1. Due to issues with external spam filters, QQ is currently unable to send any mail to Microsoft E-mail addresses. This includes any account at live.com, hotmail.com or msn.com. Signing up to the forum with one of these addresses will result in your verification E-mail never arriving. For best results, please use a different E-mail provider for your QQ address.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. For prospective new members, a word of warning: don't use common names like Dennis, Simon, or Kenny if you decide to create an account. Spammers have used them all before you and gotten those names flagged in the anti-spam databases. Your account registration will be rejected because of it.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Since it has happened MULTIPLE times now, I want to be very clear about this. You do not get to abandon an account and create a new one. You do not get to pass an account to someone else and create a new one. If you do so anyway, you will be banned for creating sockpuppets.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. If you wish to change your username, please ask via conversation to tehelgee instead of asking via my profile. I'd like to not clutter it up with such requests.
    Dismiss Notice
  5. Due to the actions of particularly persistent spammers and trolls, we will be banning disposable email addresses from today onward.
    Dismiss Notice
  6. A note about the current Ukraine situation: Discussion of it is still prohibited as per Rule 8
    Dismiss Notice
  7. The rules regarding NSFW links have been updated. See here for details.
    Dismiss Notice
  8. The testbed for the QQ XF2 transition is now publicly available. Please see more information here.
    Dismiss Notice

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Discussion in 'Creative Writing' started by Mr Zoat, Jan 27, 2019.

Loading...
  1. Queshire

    Queshire Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2019
    Messages:
    466
    Likes Received:
    2,771
    I can yell too!

    But hey, I'd love to hear it if you have a reason for going that route that's not regurgitating the initial controversy that they didn't look fuckable enough or isn't predicated on the tonal nature of the series which I'd equate to, hm, say the Teen Titans cartoon?
     
  2. IBulit

    IBulit Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2018
    Messages:
    198
    Likes Received:
    2,462
    What arcs deal with alternate versions of Paul, like the Boys Paul and Sybarite Paul? Read about them on TvTropes but can't find them.
     
    DAT_NOOB and Xmaster3000 like this.
  3. Queshire

    Queshire Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2019
    Messages:
    466
    Likes Received:
    2,771
    It was mostly just isolated updates spread among other episodes.
     
    DAT_NOOB, Cuchulin and Xmaster3000 like this.
  4. WereDragon

    WereDragon Bookwyrm

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2020
    Messages:
    309
    Likes Received:
    1,504
    At this point I feel the Illustres has all the justification needed to decide that this excuse for a sapient being should not have a Power Ring, orange or otherwise.
     
    erebus1994, Vorian, Cuchulin and 6 others like this.
  5. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2019
    Messages:
    22,134
    Likes Received:
    320,299
    He's tired governments and society not doing the competent thing so he is going with the option of helping Luthor if it at least gets the Earth to advance a bit.

    Pretty sure Zoat once said that he doesn't like the art style so that's why he doesn't watch the show.

    Despite being a clearly intelligent man Zoat can sometimes be incredibly petty, especially when it concerns some new piece of media or entertainment like comics, games and TV shows, considering them to be inferior to their previous version, even when he doesn't know all that much about them and doesn't want to have anything to do with them despite the fact they are quite good in some cases, even if they are bad in other cases, kinda like the previous versions.
     
  6. ForeverShogo

    ForeverShogo Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2016
    Messages:
    453
    Likes Received:
    2,724
    As a reminder . . . Zoat has previously said that Paul almost got through to Lex. That the only reason Paul failed to convince Lex to abandon The Light is because of Lex's own paranoia.

    Lex started to worry that his desire to turn over a new leaf wasn't his own, but rather one being forced onto him by Paul's ring.

    Would be interesting to see Paul's reaction if he learned their relationship soured because Lex thought he had put a mind whammy on him.

    Maybe he'll give him another chance if he remembers the only reason Jade didn't suffer a worse fate is because Lex offered up his own legal team to defend her when Paul was talking to him about rehabilitating her so very long ago.

    Or maybe I'm just being weird because I thought the interactions between Paul and Lex were some of the best parts about the early era of this fanfic.
     
  7. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2019
    Messages:
    22,134
    Likes Received:
    320,299
    That paranoia may not be all that unjustifiable.

    Remember that Paul may have accidently influenced Heras decision to divorce Zeus with his ring.

    Even if he's not actively influencing them like he did with Mammon, he may still be nudging them in certain ways subconsciously.

    Renegade Lex may not be so paranoid about renegade because he consideres him to be a part of his team, while paragon Paul has shown a greater willingness to work with the League, unlike renegade who commited actions that went against the League.

    It is also possible that renegade also got his hooks into Lex with his god powers like he did with Blackfire.

    The renegade may not have turned her into a completely reasonable individual, as he told Kara 50 that she was interested in brute force conquest and someone that would support all her decisions no matter what, but she probably won't become childishly petty and stupid evil like her pre n52 self.

    Luthor may similarly become more reasonable, just with a bit of paranoia left over, but he probably won't be adopting a nihilistic philosophy and work for a goddess that thinks an army of supervillains is the way to protect her universe.

    I'm a big fan of a number of post flashpoint changes, additions and story lines, the Year of the Villain is not of them.
     
  8. SirKaid

    SirKaid Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2015
    Messages:
    138
    Likes Received:
    1,000
    I love every moment of this, both the scene and the character.
     
    Jaron, Vorian, Handlewithcare and 5 others like this.
  9. Rebu

    Rebu hey, little Anna, you're the one

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2017
    Messages:
    182
    Likes Received:
    1,268
    Oh, crap. He's a Wodehouse character.
     
  10. Coda

    Coda Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2019
    Messages:
    1,079
    Likes Received:
    4,181
    Nope, software engineer.

    It's a plausible spelling. It's not correct according to the dictionary but there are other words that do pluralize that way, and English has a way of normalizing things like that over time.

    I, for one, wouldn't have submitted a correction for it.
     
  11. Xmaster3000

    Xmaster3000 Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2019
    Messages:
    119
    Likes Received:
    501
    Well it's like this: Lex has grabbed the tiger by the tail and, to quote Baloo the bear, "There's teeth in the other end!".
    Edit: Found a clip!
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
  12. Xmaster3000

    Xmaster3000 Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2019
    Messages:
    119
    Likes Received:
    501
    *uncontrollable laughter* XD
     
    Jaron, Vorian, Zeromaru2 and 4 others like this.
  13. Dur'id the Druid

    Dur'id the Druid Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2019
    Messages:
    187
    Likes Received:
    560
    Random thought, did Paul ever confirm the Khan's credentials? I mean actually call Dox and see if he actually sent him? I mean maybe Khan summoned or 'bought' an orange ring, and isn't actually part of the official Lantern Corp.
     
  14. Breadnaught

    Breadnaught Experienced.

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    2,745
    Likes Received:
    70,164
    He probably could justify it, but Comic King having a Ring isn't the issue here.

    Earth has known about aliens - has been visited by aliens - for centuries. And in Ye Olden Days, when people didn't know any better and the terms god/alien/fae were basically interchangeable as far as most people could tell, they get a pass for not figuring out a protocol for responding to this stuff.

    But that's no longer true in the modern age, where the existing governments of the world know perfectly well aliens, and whole interstellar nations, exist and could visit at any time. But so far it's only been loan visitors, or invasions. And the answer for both has been "let the superpowered champions deal with it."

    But now it's not just some lone guy in an escape pod, or a hostile invasion. It's just some shitlord travelling salesman from an alien megacorp.

    It's not something you need champions to deal with. It's something the governments of the world need to talk to, establish trade deals with. Actually international diplomacy stuff. And they should have been prepared for that, because it was bloody obvious it would happen eventually.

    But apparently they're not. They got so used to the "let the superpowered champions deal with it" response, they failed in their duty and don't know how to react to this highly predictable situation.

    And frankly, Comic King is soft balling them hilariously in this situation. He's not an expansionist empire here to inform Earth they now control this region of space. He's just the space version of a used car salesman.

    In short, DC Earth stuck their heads in the sand and failed to maintain a foreign policy worse than Sakoku era Japan. And now a less-dignified Commodore Matthew Perry just showed up.
     
  15. Handlewithcare

    Handlewithcare Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2019
    Messages:
    1,289
    Likes Received:
    12,979
    In the MCU they tried with the accords and the fans were totally against that, wanting no oversight wahtsoever over superheroes.

    Captain Murica immediately went MUH FREEDOMS and blew up an airport and fans loved it.

    So it seems perfectly reasonable to assume people would actually want it like that.
     
  16. Tzeentch

    Tzeentch I trust you know where the happy button is?

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2019
    Messages:
    765
    Likes Received:
    6,483
    Manga Khan might still be a "Bunny-Ears Lawyer" though, some who's VERY good at their job despite their eccentricities.

    You dont become a highly ranked intergalactic broker with connections throughout several galaxies by just collecting bottle caps...
     
    Istaran, Cuchulin and Darko like this.
  17. Kalem_Lee

    Kalem_Lee Well worn.

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2017
    Messages:
    7,809
    Likes Received:
    59,322
    Weren't those accords made with Ross's help and not much talking to the actual Avengers to iron out the problems and ideas for it.
     
  18. Idkusername

    Idkusername Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2019
    Messages:
    1,463
    Likes Received:
    13,996
    Are you sure? My experience has been that a lot more people were on Team Iron Man than on the Captain's.

    Edit:

    Look, the execution for Civil War was pretty shit. Like really pretty shit. Literally. In the correct sense of the word. It was pretty, and it was shit.

    Anyway, what I mean is, plot contrivance was the reason most of the things happened in the movie. Apparently the Captain who should know the value of oversight (having fought in a war as both a soldier and a commanding officer) suddenly holds the idiot ball.
     
  19. Galacticplumber

    Galacticplumber Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2018
    Messages:
    302
    Likes Received:
    916
    Even if incorrect, the push here hasn't been about regulating supers, but about having a function space foreign policy. Big difference.
     
    WhiteNoise, Ardy, Vorian and 3 others like this.
  20. Idkusername

    Idkusername Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2019
    Messages:
    1,463
    Likes Received:
    13,996
    Uh... yeah. I never said othewise.
     
  21. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2016
    Messages:
    14,696
    Likes Received:
    729,149
    In the MCU, the Accords were presented by General Ross. The man who pursued Dr Banner for years, repeatedly set him off when he just wanted to be left alone to cure himself and caused completely unnecessary property damage and the death of both bystanders and US military personnel. He is not someone anyone with any sense would want to regulate superheroes.

    And neither are the people who had oversight of SHIELD and 1) tried to nuke New York and 2) signed off on Hydra's flying railgun plan.

    The Accords were brought forwards as a policy because a criminal blew himself up after Scarlet Witch moved him away from a crowd and inadvertently towards a smaller number of politicians. Said criminal was attempting to acquire a biological weapon of horrifying potential power and was stopped by the Avengers.

    There was a good argument in favour of putting Scarlet Witch in prison for her work with Hydra and Ultron, but 'failed to let unimportant people die' isn't a good reason for doing anything.

    There was a good argument in favour of putting Tony Stark in prison for ACTIVATING ULTRON, but he did that out of his armour and wouldn't have been stopped by an anti-superhero law. And he at least partially did it because Scarlet Witch messed with his mind. I like the way he was played in Winter Soldier, where he nearly fully realised that it was his fault and was trying to fix things.
     
  22. PDV

    PDV Revelation That Uncertainty Is Itself An Answer

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2018
    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    1,467
    Renegade Lex is just as paranoid; moreso, probably. He internally refers to Grayven as "the second alien".

    Given the events of Winter Soldier, Cap was obviously correct. Do not give intrusive oversight powers including detailed secret identity info to an organization which is easily subverted by supervillains. And given that SHIELD was controlled by supervillains from the start, that should include literally every government organization.

    In the comics version, almost everyone was on Team Cap, even including Iron Man. Tony Stark thought the imposition of oversight was unavoidable and championed it in a (ultimately successful) attempt to be put in charge and therefore able to shield his friends from the negative effects. He has explicitly stated this 'onscreen'.
     
  23. rkyeun

    rkyeun Cabbitus Maximus

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2018
    Messages:
    854
    Likes Received:
    6,544
    boolean isViableOrangeLanternCandidate()
    {
    ...
    Item 47763: Check to see if individual will be excessively wasteful and frivolous with the orange light. -- No, orange light will be used sparingly if at all. Subject prefers to use robots and standard technology even after possessing orange ring.
    ...
    Item 56192: Consider if exposure to orange light corrupts the personality of the user and renders them more unstable. -- No, subject's personality is unchanged, he was always like this. Immunity to mind alteration?
    ...
    Item 82987: Estimate the divergence from other examples of orange lanterns and anticipate worthiness of new data. -- This should be enlightening. Subject is almost as in tune with his desires as Paul. And slightly more restrained.
    ...
    return(true)
    }
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
  24. Kalem_Lee

    Kalem_Lee Well worn.

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2017
    Messages:
    7,809
    Likes Received:
    59,322
    Thank you. This needs to be remembered every time.
     
  25. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2019
    Messages:
    22,134
    Likes Received:
    320,299
    This, this is beautiful Zoat.

    Now I really wanna see a scene of MCU Paul and what he does with this whole Accords shitfuckery.

    We already saw Paul deal with Hardcastle when he attacked Xor, so it would be nice seeing Paul confront Ross over his mishandling of the Hulk situation.

    The idea of the Accords is a fairly sound one, making sure that people with great and potentially destructive powers can be given oversight so that they don't abuse their powers, but the execution was just a clusterfuck.
     
  26. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2016
    Messages:
    14,696
    Likes Received:
    729,149
    I haven't really decided in my own mind when that version of the SI would return to Earth. I know there was a snippet of him being around during Captain America 2, but that wasn't a... Considered decision.
     
  27. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2019
    Messages:
    22,134
    Likes Received:
    320,299
    I vaguely recall a snippet of him talking with Skye about how dumb HYDRAs plan was and about how SHIELD doesn't exactly wait for things like warrants and such, though I don't remember if it was set during one of the movies or the Agents of SHIELD show.

    Anyway hope to see you write something featuring MCU Paul in the near future.

    And really hope we see what those alternates, like Angel, Red, Sybarite, Common Sense, are doing now that they're back to their universes, in this or the next episode.
     
    Ardy and Cuchulin like this.
  28. Idkusername

    Idkusername Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2019
    Messages:
    1,463
    Likes Received:
    13,996
    Aside from all the points Mr Zoat brings up,the argument for the Accords is very much a sound one in principle. IN almost any modern nation, the government draws its power from the consent of the governed, except in the case of the UK, where the Parliament derives authority from the Crown (it's functionally the same, though).
    The very idea of a superhero runs counter to this.

    Only governments can authorise legal use of force, conditionally, and within a limited jurisdiction. Anything else (except when done in self-defence, in defence of another, or under duress) are the same in the eyes of the law. A vigilante and a villain would still face the same charges. Note, in defence of another only applies when the threat is imminent, not far off.

    What I'm basically driving at here is that the Accords are actually a really good idea that the movie had to fuck up (either deliberately or unintentionally) to have Captain America make the slightest amount of sense.

    In a world with the slightest semblance of sense, the Accords would have generated much discussion and would reflect reality at least a little bit, even if my cynicism forbids me from saying that politicians would work with actual, thought out, policy positions.

    Edit: Ideally, experts would also have been called upon for advice. Further, the law could have later been changed or repealed through protest, or when it was shown that it clearly had problems.
     
    Xmaster3000, Ardy, Vorian and 2 others like this.
  29. nogoodnames

    nogoodnames Getting out there.

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2020
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    66
    Finaly caught up with this story again, I just love the unique perspective the SI has in this story. I respect the dedication Mr Zoat has to this story. For this arc I wonder if Lantern Khan will still have his ring after the plotline. How would the Light use this situation to its advantage. Have to comment on the Crisis of multiple SIs is Krona gone for good or what? Are they any future Crises planed?
     
    Cuchulin and Darko like this.
  30. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2019
    Messages:
    22,134
    Likes Received:
    320,299
    Considering that HYDRA had basically infiltrated a shit ton of governments, governmental organizations and other such groups for decades, most people would be a bit suspicious with any new policies they set after they are exposed.

    If HYDRA hadn't done these things, or at least no one found out, I'm pretty sure Cap would be a bit more willing to accept them, but seeing as they did those things and were found out his trust in governments that were essentially furthering HYDRAs agenda for decades, even if mostly unknowingly, would be a bit frayed to say the least.
     
Loading...