With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

The thing is from a detached perspective Venturia leaving is largely a formality. From King Orin's it's a major failure because to most people's minds losing territory is bad, and he wants to be a good king, good kingston't let bad things happen to their countries.

A bit simplistic, but frankly a lot of politics boils down to either juvenile posturing or simplistic ideas buried under miles of pageantry, obfuscation, and double talk.

Now this can't be the first problem that Aquaman inherited from previous monarchs, nature of bloodline royalty and all that. So why did this one have such a break down in how it was presented to the crown?

 

Or it could be because Orin has regularly fought world ending threats and wants all if Atlantis resources united in fighting those.

 

The thing is that it's already not contributing to that, Venturia has been only nominally Atlantean territory for decades. Given their entrenched position, forcing them to come to heel would likely be more resources lost than he could recoup from the ruins, for decades more at least.

Furthermore, due to needing to be self sufficient, odds are that Venturia's magical and unit composition contributions would be largely redundant in most cases.

 

"Politic" in the 4th to last sentence should be "polite", I believe

 

No, that's correct.

 

Generations of bad advice and stubbornness.

See the Dictionary.com page.


EDIT: Coincidentally (probably, because why would it be otherwise), I was eating porridge while reading this.

 

You'd better be careful... Idries Shah wrote about the dangers of 'Oatism'.

(His collections of short stories are thoroughly recommended, excellent reads. I like the 'onion' one.)

 

Zoat is the paragon going to meet Darkseid anytime in this story?

 

There is a very viable, and very British, potential middle ground that could be found on this point.

Suggest, at the negotiations regarding the vote, that the exit includes either an agreement to cooperate in defense against world-threatening (or even just ocean-threatening!) foes, should the need arise... or, to be more British about it, potentially to agree to a sort of Commonwealth system whereby, during times of existential crisis for the atlantean species, Venturia grants Poseidonis control over their military for the duration, much as the independent dominions in the British Commonwealth (Canada, Australia, New Zealand, etc.) grant the British monarch during wartime.

Basically, try to hammer out an agreement where the potential exit includes maintaining some loose ties that ensure that all of Atlantis's resources will remain united in fighting existential threats while granting Venturia independence in all other matters; this could be done in any number of different ways that might make it more palatable to Cyprian and his people--which should be negotiated in advance of the actual vote.

Indeed, such an agreement might even see Orin decide to reduce his rejoin campaign to a mere pro forma one, should that cover the majority of his tangible objections (as opposed to the potentially "bad optics" of a de jure loss of territory, even if it's been de facto lost for a long time). Combine that with arguments about the history of decolonization in the surface world (conveniently leaving out how badly it has gone in cases where there was a vote for it without a functioning local government already in place, since Venturia has such a government in place), and it might be possible for Orin to spin this into something that would actually be, eventually, celebrated rather than reviled...

 

I have no plans for him to do so.

 

Thank fuck for that. The way things are currently OL would just watch as he attacked Earth. Protecting from a hostile polity is more the local militaries job than his.

 

You do realise that he would protect Earth with everything he has if Apokalyps came knocking right?

Hopefully your Vaermina sickness will be cleared up soon.

If an alien invasion were to occur then he would help, especially considering the power Apokalyps has.

He is letting the various governments solve this because they have neglected to make solutions for decades and he doesn't want to coddle them.

The only two civilisations that would be able to survive Apokalyps are New Genesians and the Maltusians.

Earth doesn't have the power to fight Apokalyps, hell few do, but they do have the power to solve the Cluster Corp issue.

 

Earth has had the ability to mass produce Speedsters for decades, has the ability to impliment large scale magical training centres for decades and so much more.

See above. If Earth sorted their shit out they could throw back an invasion with minimal fuss. A million Flashes attacking in concert is a hell of a thing.

They didn't so they can't.


It's the exact same train of thought OL is applying the current situation but for some reason it's only applicable in one area but not another? Fucking bullshit. OL is just being a shit and throwing a hissy fit.

 

The Flash can't fly. At all.

I know Apokoliptian attacks are usually depicted as 'boom tubes open, infantry come through', but they generally only fight like that because they don't care about their soldiers. If they actually wanted somewhere destroyed they could use a fleet.

 

Do remember that most of those governments thought that magic didn't exist until the Roanoke incident.

They didn't mass produce speedsters since they are not unified and if one nation tried that then others would and war could happen. Mutually assured destruction.

Speedsters are good on land, certainly, but in space, not so much. Apokalips can also bombard the planet.

Earth also doesn't have spaceships, aside from a few, like Starmans and the one Blake has, and that one needs a powerful telekinetic to use.

Apokalips also has powerful spaceships and they have been destroying powerful star spanning civilizations for quite possibly millions of years.

They managed to fight the GLC to a standstill. The Lanterns were probably not holding back and remember that a single Lantern is potentially capable of being a solar system level threat, or at least a planetary one, capable of taking on entire fleets if they are skilled enough.

Earth, even if it had a fleet, may not be able to sort out an invasion with minimal fuss and would most likely take some damage. Luthor's ship may have destroyed that guys ships in the renegade side, but I'm pretty sure that wasn't an invasion fleet and was just a bunch of ships sent to kill a woman and her baby. Apokalips has quite possibly the most powerful fleets in the galaxy, or one of the most powerful.

Once again OL doesn't want to handle all of Earths problems when the leaders can do that themselves. If it is a situation where they can't do it themselves, like fighting Apokalips, then he'll help.

He compared solving all of Earths problems to wiping the ass of a fully grown, mentally and physically healthy adult, something that is completely unnecessary when the individual in question can do it themselves.

Negotiating with someone like Khan is simple and easy in comparison to fighting off an army of Apokaliptians

 

He can, however, throw rocks. And what is a rock thrown at near-light speed but a relativistic weapon?

Actually what would happen if the Flash threw a rock at super-speed within the context of this fic? Would it keep its momentum, abruptly slow down after he released it, or something in between?

 

also, in a potential conflict with Apokalypse, wouldnt the GLC be highly likely to intervene regardless of former agreements, given that the Life Entity is sleeping somewhere on earth, and given that the terminally insecure Tyrant attempting to anti-life the bloody thing (or the hundreds/thousands abarrent/schitzotech-equipped individuals on the planet) is one of those things unlikely to end well for anyone in...well, the galaxy......


....i get what some of the other's are Saying about OL-
my counterpoint to his excuse is that it WILL be his problem when his outright refusal to act begins complicating his future operations due to degraded trust/credibility-

and this very mindset is likely WHY the situation he's whining about (no formal plans/preparation for this form of contact/non-military sociatial disruption) has occurred-literally everyone else who's had the possibility suggested to has likely shrugged, said "not my problem, sod off!" and gone for a pint-and he already KNOWS there's someone with afterlife-warping clout fucking with perception/society in a way that would encourage said mindset-is HE infected now?

*sighs* regardless,its petty,shortsighted, and likely to blow up in his face mid-long term >.<

 

A good way of making your hand explode?

Not sure. Probably something in between.

 

Sorta?

EDIT:

As for the Relativistic Rocks.....much much worse.

 

And who exactly is this everyone else? because if you include high level government strategists, leaders, and administrators, then yeah it was was and is their job to deal with foreign relations and trade. That's what is happening here. Comic King is a foreign corporate leader looking to establish trade with local suppliers. He's doing so within a close enough definition of legal that stopping him without being raging hypocrites would require going after most of the fortune 500. There are specifically people in governments whose job it is to deal with this sort of thing. Having OL take over would essentially be empowering him to act as the first and final arbiter of Earth's economic interactions with all extra terrestrial powers, if not all international trade period.

 

I notice several people have said that Apokalips is a galactic, not just a solar system, or Earth, problem. OK, yes, but aren't the New Gods tied into the Source Wall, which is something which applies to the whole Universe, not just the local galaxy? And, there's trillions of galaxies in our universe?

So, rather a big problem. Yes, Space is Big.

 

I think canonically the universe is much smaller in the DC universe.

 

The universe could be smaller in DC comics.

I also remember that in the n52 Apokalips was a multiversal conquering empire, so they are certainly a very big threat.

 

Change "and" to "I".

Change "though" to "thought".

Change "it" to "if".

 

Hehehe, at least that is more than more customer service representatives would do.

 

Think it could be ' I am ashamed ' instead of 'I am shame'

 

Oh nice, at last we get to the military matters. I'd like to see how manga king handles these affairs,

 

Ah yes, his actualization team "might" have one of the most advanced tools in the galaxy... He didn't care enough to even give them a cursory inspection before sending them on their way.

Do they have
ashamed (?)

 

No that is consistent with how he talks in general.