Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Yeah, unlike the Master, Biedde would give clear instructions to his soldiers on how to make things happen.

If he can communicate with his followers without being summoned like the Master could, then things get worse because he can cripple our efforts without ever setting hoof in the Wake. Rarity is a massive weakpoint of ours, for example, and even a slight bit of Edge is probably more than enough for a pony to kill her.

 

[AuthorTransient]

Egh, Wolf is right there for a quick and easy Edge 5.

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I cut myself on this Edge lol

Honestly? Fuck both sides, I don't want anything to do with this war, go fuck yourselves, etc., etc. I especially hate that the ending will be poisoned - although I do want to say that if we hadn't tried the Sacrament we likely would not have met Smiles.

[X] You will take the coward's way out.

But on the subject of the changelings discussion:

First of all- the Proto Hive. Everyone feels "so bad" for the changelings. Need I remind you that they MURDERED soft sweeps family? They are not innocent little fillies. Let the Bureau have the map.

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I do want to point out, however, that condemning an entire species to death and genocide is bad ackshually. Like, we dealt with Tall Tales proto hive as enemies because they were enemies and entrenched in a civilian city at that, and as a soldier on the frontlines it is kill or be killed; no opportunity for mercy, but if I was head of a government Bureau I would offer a surrender - except, of course, that public sentiment is very soured towards them (many had relatives in the Capital or at least friends of friends) and a very heated ruler.

I suppose the difference between taking the map and leaving the map is that if the Bureau gets their hands on it we'll have to deal with preparing a government expedition / mission, but if we take the map then that's one less distraction from. Yk. Up there. So I'm neutral leaning taking the map, I don't really want to genocide the Changelings, but that notion doesn't have a huge impact on any of our looting decisions currently and is only my sentiment on the Changeling Question, because the point is still, again, the crowning GLORY.

One last thing I want to ask @OurLadyOfWires though, is what I've been chomping at the bit for this entire time - or maybe we've already done it and my brain is just addled with Christmas - can / have we dropped the Forge's Redemption to the Lunar Bureau here? Or is that part of the current Turn introducing Forge lore?

 

[excedere]

Merry Christmas! I love being a coward

[X] Plan The Rich Path Forward

[X] You will take the coward's way out.

 

[ses]

[X] You will take the coward's way out.

 

[Sintonir]

[X] You will take Smiles' offer.
[X] Plan: Don't Bother With the Small Stuff

 

[Biowolf]

So maybe I'm missing something but I thought the Worm Museum was holding a Worm of some kind in it can anyone inform me?

 

[Sylve()/.]

[X] Plan: The Mothy Path Forward
[X] You will take Smiles' offer.
First time actually voting on a quest! The whole thing is absolutely delightful, and we just couldn't remain static, a mere shade observing from the gallery. Oh, well. In any case, we believe that we need all the advantages we can have, and fast. Glory waits for no-one, and here is a deal to make our chances provisionally better, made by a party that is also rather desperate for the said deal. And he's far nicer to be around than Biedde! And Selene has THREE actions per turn, she can do guard duty just fine! Probably would be better for her emotional state, even, konsidering.

 

[Shaper47]

So maybe I'm missing something but I thought the Worm Museum was holding a Worm of some kind in it can anyone inform me?

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Here you go

You see broken doors, even if they lead to rooms with unbroken cages (that you dare not look, for the sight might infect you).

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Biedde is stuck out there to stop anything nasty from leaving,

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You know I was thinking of the situation and I realized something interesting.

That was why Smiles was standing on that doorway.

Because Biedde's Lord, it seems, is currently waiting somewhere in this hall.

And Smiles' Lord is somewhere else in the Museum, somewhere that can only be accessed by passing Smiles, growing stronger and stronger still.

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-Biedde will not take offense to this, and you will be able to challenge him again at a later date. Smiles will not take offense to this either.

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If we summon both and befriend Smiles we could gain an audience with the Lionsmith.

Pass Biedde to enter the Worm Museum and pass Smiles to talk to his lord.

 

[Sintonir]

So maybe I'm missing something but I thought the Worm Museum was holding a Worm of some kind in it can anyone inform me?

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Worm museum does not hold "a" Worm. It holds multiple Worms, always dying but never quite dead.
The Colonel is the main guardian of the museum, and normally the Lionsmith shouldn't challenge him there but it seems the times have changed.

 

[Sk1lz3r]

I was worried for nothing. Nobody has voted to take the Colonel's offer. Yeeeeeeeeee

 

[DelightedOne]

I was worried for nothing. Nobody has voted to take the Colonel's offer. Yeeeeeeeeee

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Now someone will definitely vote for the Colonel. The Gloryjoke is right there.

 

[Silent Symphony]

[X] You will take the coward's way out.

 

[Waela]

[X] Plan: The Mothy Path Forward

[X] You will take Smiles' offer.

 

[DelightedOne]

Wait, is Smiles not a Branded? We didn't see no Brand.

@OurLadyOfWires was that on purpose?

 

[dcoconeo]

[X] You will take Smiles' offer.
1) Biedde, you betrayed us first with this.
2) We are now making a enemy not of a neutral Name, not of a unbound Name, but of a Name that is more dangerous than Celestial the Doom Clock:
I don't care how powerful you think Velvet is, we are getting this Quest done with in three or at absolutely most four months yeah?
So no more diversions allowed, we need to focus here.

[X] Plan: Don't Bother With the Small Stuff
-[X] (MAP) Let the Bureau have it.
-[X] (PRISONER) Leave him.
-[X] (LOOT) I will do the right thing, and not steal.
-[X] (THING) Capture it.

[X] Plan: Focused Small Loot Is Still Loot
-[X] (MAP) Let the Bureau have it.
-[X] (PRISONER) Leave him.
[X] (LOOT) I will steal from the poor, innocent pony prisoners.
-[X] (THING) Capture it.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

[X] Plan: Small or Big and Nothing Between
[X] You will take Smiles' offer.
First time actually voting on a quest! The whole thing is absolutely delightful, and we just couldn't remain static, a mere shade observing from the gallery. Oh, well. In any case, we believe that we need all the advantages we can have, and fast. Glory waits for no-one, and here is a deal to make our chances provisionally better, made by a party that is also rather desperate for it. And he's far nicer to be around than Biedde! And Selene has THREE actions per turn, she can do guard duty just fine! Probably would be better for her emotional state, even, konsidering.

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Glory has been waiting for uncountable ages, actually, what with being locked up so powerfully it drove every cultist, Long, and Name to give up on reaching it. The only one that currently knows that Velvet has figured out a way through said lock is The Baldomare. So no, Smiles is not desperate for Glory. He is desperate to not lose to Biedde and the Colonel.

As for the Quest ending in 3-4 months, I certainly hope not. We still have a Level 7 Book to acquire, Selene's plan to defuse Celestia to implement, Cherenkolt's Iotic Essence to craft, whatever it takes to befriend Smiles, and so on and so forth. Any one of those things going awry is going to set our plans back considerably. As for no distractions, a Name as an Enemy is a massive fucking distraction! Especially when said Name can kill anyone in our faction (barring Smiles) with ease the instant he hits the field!

 

[DelightedOne]

You know, considering getting an Edge Sacrament of an Edge Hour looks like it is the same as joining their side on the Corrivality I am very glad we did not pick the Wolf one.

And I'm also wondering about how we got wounded in the fight against Biedde, because Smiles saying Velvet is too frail to meet the Lionsmith makes me think if we had wounded Biedde at full health we would have been granted an audience with him.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Also, have we considered having Luna summon Smiles and hand over the reins if we take the Coward's Way Out? She has a better General Bonus than us with the same level of Edge and Heart as us if she borrows the Heartifact for the Ritual, with only one less level of Knock.

 

[ses]

Also, have we considered having Luna summon Smiles and hand over the reins if we take the Coward's Way Out? She has a better General Bonus than us with the same level of Edge and Heart as us if she borrows the Heartifact for the Ritual, with only one less level of Knock.

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QM wants Velvet to do Name summoning rituals, Axe was an exception because it was a resummon. But if you get special QM permission confirmed then that would indeed make Coward's Path a lot more viable, as we could summon Smiles next turn cheaply and reliably

Autopass on Heart, 99.2% on Knock with reroll, and 3 Edge levels of sacrifices needed (5 bits plus a Risen) to autopass Edge

@OurLadyOfWires Is Selene allowed to summon Smiles?

 

[Greymere]

Also, have we considered having Luna summon Smiles and hand over the reins if we take the Coward's Way Out? She has a better General Bonus than us with the same level of Edge and Heart as us if she borrows the Heartifact for the Ritual, with only one less level of Knock.

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I was thinking about that, yeah. She'd be a much better fit for it, and we could honestly probably get away with just using a Risen sacrifice.

Edit: Or as Ses pointed out, a Risen and a trivial amount of bits for an Edge 1 reagent.

 

[Earth-Destroyer]

[X] Plan: Compromising more than only a little
-[X] (MAP) Let the Bureau have it.
-[X] (PRISONER) Take him.
-[X] (LOOT) I will steal from the poor, innocent pony prisoners.
-[X] (THING) Capture it.

[X] Plan The Rich Path Forward

[X] You will take the coward's way out.

More Names is better.

 

[Pittauro]

As for the Quest ending in 3-4 months, I certainly hope not. We still have a Level 7 Book to acquire, Selene's plan to defuse Celestia to implement, Cherenkolt's Iotic Essence to craft, whatever it takes to befriend Smiles, and so on and so forth. Any one of those things going awry is going to set our plans back considerably. As for no distractions, a Name as an Enemy is a massive fucking distraction! Especially when said Name can kill anyone in our faction (barring Smiles) with ease the instant he hits the field!

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3 to 4 (turn 25 to 27) months is actually possible.

Right now the major wishlist to do in the next 3-4 turns is basically

Sacraments:

Moth: probably turn 23 or 24 (depending on prisoner leashed making it impossible to do Spoiled next turn).
Lantern: maybe turn 25 or 26
Forge: maybe turn 26 or 27
Edge: probably now
Winter: probably we won't make it, but there's a chance still
Heart: definitely not
Grail: turn 23
Knock: done
SH: probably turn 23 and 24 for both.

Name Friendships:

Axe: done
Baldomare: turn 23 probably (if we get the lvl 7 book)
Mareinette: turn 23
Cherenkolt: probably turn 24 (we're scrying for the reagent now, we get it turn 23, we make it into blue ingot turn 24)
Biedde/Smiles: Biedde not possible, I expect we'll get Smiles. Unknown if we'll get his friendship in time, but I'm betting on turn 25 or 26 personally.
Neighnia: probably not.

Basically I think we can get all Name Friendships and most of the sacraments by turn 25 to 27.


and, as a reminder, the worst case scenario for Celestia...

We know she was lantern 2 by beginning of turn 22.

turn 25 lantern 5 is the very worst case scenario. I don't think we'll get more than turn 27 unless Selene comes up with a good plan, in which case we'd need to heavily replan anyway.

 

[ses]

Conditional on QM not shooting down Selene summoning, I'm convinced on Coward and would encourage others to do so as well.

Biedde is essentially free to keep summoned now that we understand his motivation: His project of gathering an army is measured in years and he has no idea that it is completely irrelevant due to Glory being on the table. We can just scam him into thinking he's getting what he wants as he renews his bindings for free in exchange for being allowed to gather up trainees (who will be training as monster-hunters in an Equestria that sorely needs extra monster-hunters right now anyway, so incidental benefit to Equestria at large. Ash does have an effect on the Wake after all)

We can essentially treat the Micromanage cost as Biedde's summoning renewal price, which is totally reasonable. 1 Velvet social action is worth less than 60 full bits anyway.

 

[Rafuki22]

[X] Plan: Compromising more than only a little

[X] Plan: Don't Bother With the Small Stuff

[X] You will take the coward's way out.

Taking the coward way out, seems managable if we have just 3 to 4 months.

 

[Quaxotia]

Biedde is essentially free to keep summoned now that we understand his motivation: His project of gathering an army is measured in years and he has no idea that it is completely irrelevant due to Glory being on the table. We can just scam him into thinking he's getting what he wants as he renews his bindings for free in exchange for being allowed to gather up trainees.

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Are we still intent on getting the edge sacrament? I'm not optimistic about finding a worthy opponent with the time remaining given the past opportunities we passed up as such as Comet Feet. A sacrament from Smiles down the line will more than likely be another battle and will inevitably piss off Biedde. If we are to piss off Biedde, might as well do it now before giving him multiple turns of pursuing religious goals to build up his edge cult for reliably resummoning himself.

The main consideration for me is that though it might be possible to have both edge names doing random expeditions, it is impossible to have Biedde for All-In. If we want to use Smiles, there's benefits to committing early. Otherwise we might be left at All-In with no edge name and no edge sacrament. A bad combination for killing something.

 

[ses]

Are we still intent on getting the edge sacrament? I'm not optimistic about finding a worthy opponent with the time remaining given the past opportunities we passed up as such as Comet Feet. A sacrament from Smiles down the line will more than likely be another battle and will inevitably piss off Biedde. If we are to piss off Biedde, might as well do it now before giving him multiple turns of pursuing religious goals to build up his edge cult to reliably resummon himself.

The main consideration for me is that though it might be possible to have both edge names doing random expeditions, it is impossible to have Biedde for All-In. If we want to use Smiles, there's benefits to committing early. Otherwise we might be left at All-In with no edge name and no edge sacrament. A bad combination for killing something.

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Getting an extra Name is better than getting a Sacrament.

Sacraments are almost entirely irrelevant for All-In. A single extra Torn Risen is quadruple the total Lore levels of +1 sacrament, and +5 personal combat on Velvet is not going to make or break her compared to bringing an extra MITL for raw combat encounters. All-in was presumably designed and balanced before Selene even existed, since Selene was only a thing because Luna rolled a nat100, so we're bringing an effective Edge 4 Name-equivalent entirely extra that the dungeon wasn't originally balanced around.

We dont KNOW for sure that Smiles can't be Befriended without making an enemy of Biedde, we only know that taking his Sacrament does. They might be different mechanics entirely or they might not. Smiles being in All-In is really not necessary anyway. We were already doing well on preparations by committing to Mareinette after all.

Sacraments are powerful and important but reaching Glory is not a matter of collecting all of them.

 

[Earth-Destroyer]

We can essentially treat the Micromanage cost as Biedde's summoning renewal price, which is totally reasonable. 1 Velvet social action is worth less than 60 full bits anyway.

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We also just learn about minions being easy to get, so if we send Mareinette to go get minions she will probably get 1-2 a turn.

 

[Quaxotia]

Sacraments are almost entirely irrelevant for All-In. A single extra Torn Risen is quadruple the total Lore levels of +1 sacrament, and +5 personal combat on Velvet is not going to make or break her compared to bringing an extra MITL for raw combat encounters. All-in was presumably designed and balanced before Selene even existed, since Selene was only a thing because Luna rolled a nat100, so we're bringing an effective Edge 4 Name-equivalent entirely extra that the dungeon wasn't originally balanced around.

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Beyond the basic bonus, the sacrament will add a special ability. I don't believe an additional summon will outweigh that ability when it comes to killing an Outsider. I would rather not rely on guessing the encounter scaling when we could possibly get both the sacrament and Smiles. It is very much a thing where there is no such thing as stacking the deck too much.

This isn't just for collecting shinies, there are few sacraments I can think of that are more relevant to All-In than edge.

 

[DelightedOne]

We also just learn about minions being easy to get, so if we send Mareinette to go get minions she will probably get 1-2 a turn.

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When did we learn that?

Wait do you mean this?

-Among other things, he is meant to be an interesting "build-a-minion" option. Something that could have happened more often if you went on a "wider" recruitment-heavy build, or if you had your own cult. But since you never did that, and this chance presented itself, I decided to offer this here.

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This does not say that getting minions is easy, it says that if we had gone for a different build or had a cult(Freedom my beloved) we could have gotten the option to customize them.

 

[ses]

Beyond the basic bonus, the sacrament will add a special ability. I don't believe an additional summon will outweigh that ability when it comes to killing an Outsider. I would rather not rely on guessing the encounter scaling when we could possibly get both the sacrament and Smiles. It is very much a thing where there is no such thing as stacking the deck too much.

This isn't just for collecting shinies, there are few sacraments I can think of that are more relevant to All-In than edge.

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Yes like The Silver "Does nothing" Key.

Edge Sacrament has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with juicing Discord. We already know how to juice him, and that's the Malleary mansus expedition.