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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Discussion in 'Creative Writing' started by Mr Zoat, Jan 27, 2019.

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  1. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    'lifting'

    'it'

    Before that.

    In the Wings and Dagger episode we saw Daniel, his replacement in the comics, is still human.
     
  2. Prognostic Hannya

    Prognostic Hannya Knight of the Yuri Crusade

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    Ahhhhhh it's finally happening!!! We're gonna finally figure out if the Endless know Paul's name.
     
  3. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    Maybe add 'this' or 'the'

    "What is the 'Dreaming'?"

    ''What is this 'Dreaming'?"
     
  4. Handlewithcare

    Handlewithcare Versed in the lewd.

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    Yes! Endless time, baby!

    And the way I understand the Dream: isn't it kinda unclear what the linear relationship between the Dream and material existence is? Which one came first? Or rather, if there is such a relationship at all and the Dream is instead infinite, timeless potential-reality?
     
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  5. Kalem_Lee

    Kalem_Lee Well worn.

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    Oh god its happening.

    We getting more Endless Interaction. I'm jiggling in terror.
     
  6. Vaermina

    Vaermina Well worn.

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    He's embarrassed to even know you Paul.

    Paul... It was a comic and you don't have an edict memory... Just admit you don't know it and move on...
     
  7. transhumansage

    transhumansage Versed in the lewd.

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    oh boy here we go!:sneaky::D
     
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  8. Citizen

    Citizen Well worn.

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    As I understand it they are emphatically not summoning him, but rather politely inviting him to stop by to chat.
     
  9. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    Thank you, corrected.
    No, that's Koriand'r's linguistic awkwardness.
     
  10. cereal_lurker

    cereal_lurker Getting sticky.

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    It seems like full disclosure would have the SI mention to the group that he's been touched by Desire, which may impact Dream's willingness to help/holding a misplaced grudge. Did he forget that arcane beings (like the demon twins) can detect the contact lingering on him? I don't think he had his rings when the demon twins mentioned it to him.
     
  11. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    I'd say it's more along being exasperated rather than embarrassment.

    He does have a perfect memory.

    Power rings are awesome.

    He also had Hinon expect the site to figure out what happened.

    So chances are extremely high that he does know how the spell works, but is just worried that he may not know everything, and it's not him lying to try and make himself seem smarter, or whatever other messed up headcanon you believe this story has.
     
  12. Kalem_Lee

    Kalem_Lee Well worn.

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    Paul doesn't remember that. Like full on memory block.
     
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  13. moralrelativity

    moralrelativity Recovering pendant.

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    I read all of Sandman for the first time about a year ago, so I'm fascinated by where this chapter might head. This will be THE VERY FIRST TIME I've ever had more than passing familiarity with the canon associated with WTR. (All of the original Batman TV shows, and a few original animated Wonder Woman episodes don't really count, right?)
     
  14. Yog

    Yog Know what you're doing yet?

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    Morpheus actually does owe Paul a little bit. Paul saved the muse, who was Morpheus's past lover (and also is a being connected to the Dreaming through her nature), so Morpheus himself didn't have to.

    On the other hand, Paul is the creature of Desire, in the same way, I wager, as Norton was the Dream's, so there might be a bit of animosity there.

    On the third appendage Paul's relationship with the Endless in general should be a hellishly convoluted mess.
     
  15. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    He actually does remember it.

    He remembers that it happened, but may just find it difficult to remember all the specifics.

    I also don't think he was paying all that much attention to Desire then.
     
  16. Tzeentch

    Tzeentch I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    The Three prefer to be called "The Kindly Ones" when they're in their most vicious and vengeful aspect, dearie.

    In fact, they INSIST on it....
     
  17. cereal_lurker

    cereal_lurker Getting sticky.

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    He certainly may not remember the twins mentioning that they felt it on him, but he explicitly was told of the contact when Hinon visited Earth. He did have his rings then, so his memory of that conversation should be full and complete. And he confirmed with Hinon the Sandman event where Dream's lover cheated on him after Desire's nudging and Dream subsequently punished the entire Maltusian race for it.

    EDIT: Checked the part with the Twins (Agony and Ecstasy, had to find the names). They could have been referring to The Ophidian rather than Desire, but it was never confirmed. So the contact with Desire may not be immediately detectable. Still seems like something he should mention to this group before going in.
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2020
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  18. Chojin Patriarch

    Chojin Patriarch Veteran Lurker

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    Calling in a professional consultant, eh? And Doctor Mist isn't suitable, being a Justice League member. because OL doesn't want them hearing about this, does he? :rolleyes:

    The deity has style. And a surprising sense of comedic timing.

    Yes, he's stepped in it deep this time. Considering her mother has it out for him already...

    Switching the entry location? Appropriate.

    This is her first time in an eldritch location, isn't it? Must be quite the eye-opener.

    Oh-ho, some dream sand? How typical of a Constantine.

    He's learned from the best, after all. And he has plenty of practice with blowback.

    That's better than the most obvious alternative, that the remnants of the Mother Star ate her.

    Even a god of the hunt has trouble with the Dreaming? How pedestrian. But it really highlights the instability of the place.

    For those wondering, it's a callback to the first arc of the Sandman comic from Vertigo. After Morpheus got out of a century of confinement, he went on a walkabout to track down his three treasures of office.

    Morpheus went to Constantine on the trail of his Bag of Sand, a powder that can cause sleep and dreams in any mortal. But he'd already lost it, after an ex-girlfriend stole it.

    By the time they found her, she'd been using to get high on dreams for months. In true Constantine form, it didn't end well for her, though quite peacefully. One last, dying dream...

    Magic has its price, after all. Something like this could be expensive.

    How about you start with the polite option? Morpheus doesn't take too kindly to meddling, as seen when he reclaimed his gem from Doctor Destiny (who'd been using it as his Materioptikon.) Or when he went into hell to reclaim his Helm. He intimidated the Kings of Hell into releasing him by threatening to remove the dreams of their prisoners. Because what good is hell, if those within cannot dream of heaven?

    And believe me, you'd know if he did. He condemned one old girlfriend to an eternity of torture in Hell for the crime of... Dumping him. He later relented...

    Cross your fingers and hope he's not in a particularly bad mood. Or that he's dating, that usually puts him in a good mood, until things sour...

    And not all of them are fun, pleasant or easy.

    Do you really think Morpheus would take kindly to you using the Dreaming as a stopover for mass transit? Then again, still safer than using Hell, or the Warp. Or would the Dreaming be the Warp? Very definite similarities to the Immaterium...

    You aren't going to take The Caliph of Bahgdad's route, are you?

    Let me guess: "Don't even think about it."

    I doubt he'd take kindly to uninvited guests, either. The being is the very definition of mercurial.

    She's in way over her pay grade here. She's just a sector lantern, this is Illustres-grade.

    Just don't say as much. Or be very polite about pointing out that you won't ever use them, even if you could use magic properly.

    It's definitely one of those 'bad consequences for failure' works.

    If he's feeling nice, he'd just dump you into years of nightmares. Take note of the former girlfriend's fate I mentioned above for a moderate level of peeved. Do not piss off one of the Endless. It never ends well.

    Oooh, this promises to get esoteric. Let's hope they can actually get his attention, or even pique his curiosity. Or this might prove to be a waste, and it turns out Melinoë is simply having tea in his castle, safe and sound. With any luck, we'll see tomorrow.
     
  19. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    I think it's because Quinn has access to the Tower of Fate, which has one of the largest libraries of magical lore in the universe.

    Quinn also can use the Helm of Nabu, so he is most likely able to perform magic that an ordinary magician can't.

    Dr Mist, while highly intelligent and knowledgeable, probably doesn't have a giant library, and while he's powerful he may still be weaker than a Lord of Order.

    I think it was more because she wouldn't go out with him and not because she dumped him.

    I don't think they dated, but Dream definitely wanted to date her.
     
  20. Me. Joka-r

    Me. Joka-r Professional Procrastinator

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    Does it make any difference?
     
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  21. Vaermina

    Vaermina Well worn.

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    He has a perfect memory now.

    But that very specifically doesn't extend to things from before he got his power ring.

    Or did you forget about the books he couldn't reproduce?
     
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  22. Agent Orange

    Agent Orange Experienced.

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    ...

    ... Someone's gonna attack Dream, aren't they?
     
  23. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    Even if it true that he doesn't perfectly remember everything before he got his ring, there is still the possibility that he remembers what was done to Dream in the comics.

    There is also the possibility that he figured out the spell after he got to Earth 16.

    Remember that time he brought Hinon to examine the place where he was imprisoned, and he worked with Constantine, who you can bet your ass went to that place to see what happened and probably told Paul.
     
  24. Xelloss

    Xelloss Know what you're doing yet?

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    Who is John Quinn again ?
    My google-fu failed me.
     
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  25. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    He's the new Dr Fate.

    After OL and John killed Nabu, John gave the helmet to Quinn.

    A lot of people, including me, think that he's the Golden Boy from the Hellblazer comics.

    Basically an alternate universe version of Johns twin brother who he strangled in the womb.

    He made his world into something of a paradise, but also made Johns life a living hell for some reason.

    Johns mothers maiden name was Quinn if I remember correctly, so there is a chance that he could be the Golden Boy.
     
  26. Ngamer11

    Ngamer11 Experienced.

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    Only Paul would suggest using the Dreaming as a pathway for interstellar travel. Exactly what was John Quinn reacting to? The fact that Paul thought of something like that, or the fact that Paul offhandedly mentioned the possibility of using Hell as an interstellar pathway if needed?

    There is honestly a 50/50 chance of something in this meeting going wrong thanks to Murphy's Law. Either something will provoke Dream or they are attacked or interrupted in the middle of negotiations.

    I think that the two are on par in terms of raw magical might. It's just that as the owner of the Tower of Fate, John Quinn has a lot of objects lying around that could help. Especially since Dr. Mist spent most of his time meditating instead of travelling and gathering artifacts of various degrees of power.

    That is one theory. Another is that he is Arrowverse Constantine, or some other kind of expy. I am honestly just expecting him to be what he says at this point, some guy that John Constantine thought would make a halfway decent Lord of Order for whatever reason.
     
  27. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    I think he reacted like that because of Paul's desire to use it to travel through space.

    I'll have to disagree here.

    While Dr Mist is undoubtedly an extremely powerful sorcerer the Helmet gives Quinn a great deal of power that a non Lord of Order/Chaos probably can't channel, so in terms of raw might John beats Mist, at least when he has the Helmet.

    Dr Mist may still be more skilled than him however, seeing as he's 11.000 years old and has had time to become skillful and knowledgeable ina shit ton of magic traditions.
     
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  28. Rowencloude

    Rowencloude Getting sticky.

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    This story has been going on for so long i cant actually remember... Did we ever fins out what happened to constantine after the fight with nabu?
     
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  29. Chaoswind

    Chaoswind Lord of nonsense

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    The change time trapper Paul imposed on time travel mechanics involved tapping on the Dreaming, right?

    What are the chances Dream of the endless is a little pissed at Paul for the extra work he may be getting?

    Question, do the different multiverses in DC each have a different set of endless, or are they a single set that oversees everything? Or are they a single entity that have a different avatar for each multiverse?
     
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  30. Stsword

    Stsword Versed in the lewd.

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    Mist's immortality and mojo came from the Pillar of Life, considering Zoat made Mist Life Enlightened, the natural assumption is that he basically mainlined the White Light Entity.

    Assuming he isn't still connected to the White Light Entity enough to draw power from it as the Lords do Chaos and Order, he still took enough of a charge to last him the last 11 thousand years.

    So it's possible that Mist has enough of a reservoir that the infinitely renewable mojo of a Lord might be more of an advantage on paper than in practicality.

    Since Zoat doesn't seem to be using the "legitimately immortal and does have genuine magic powers, but is actually a fraud using showmanship to pretend immense magical power ala the Wizard of Oz" version.
     
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