With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

dw7thdoctor · Mar 7, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
"I met Dream when a possessed madman

I thought he met Dream when the Goddess of Nightmares and madness went missing. It is how we got a new sandman, because during the investigation looking for her Dream tell OL that Sandy is still alive.

Chojin Patriarch · Mar 7, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
The Man

8th May 2013
09:23 GMT

"…and I spent most of the rest of the day feeding arcane artefacts to the Ophidian, because just removing the physical objects wasn't enough to destabilise the system quickly, but I couldn't feed her too much because-."

Queen Artemis nods. "That would risk the ire of the elementals you would hope would finish the job."

I mean, if Delirium's portrait was anything to go by, she'd probably have thanked you for removing them, but I can understand the caution. Don't want to dump that much insanity energy anywhere too fast.

I nod, leaning back slightly in my chair. "Exactly. I mean, it's a brilliant piece of thaumic engineering, and I… I think there are other things that they could do with the system, but the planet's thaumic systems aren't something you can just reroute like that without colossal amounts of power that we don't have."

And given how said systems are still recovering from both the Anti-Life and the Raising of Atlantis... Best not to stress them more.

She shakes her head in amazement. "I understand the principles you have described, but I cannot imagine devising the mechanisms to put it into operation. And you believe that she did that while being tortured by evil gods for thousands of years?"

"That's my best guess. She had other concerns when she decided to be more open about what she'd been doing. Hopefully, if we eventually restore her mental clarity, we can find out."

Which could be some time.

It's not like I can check the clay she used to change her own appearance, but I wouldn't be shocked if she'd had some of Ahri'ahn's bones added to the mix. But we never found out where she found them… If that is what happened.

"What would happen to her then?"

And that's dismissing the possibility that Ahri'ahn has been a live and hanging around another dimension, like Gemworld or Skartaris.

Huh. I look around her drawing room as I think about it. The carved wood and padded furnishings put me in mind of my granny's living room or dining room, though in fact it's probably more similar to the drawing rooms of the Early Modern wealthy. I smile a little as I see some of my books on the personal reading shelf.

Heh. Taking advantage of her NEMO contacts, then.

"I don't know. It won't really be my business either way. Adom is a head of state, but he was killed before Gamemnae could try and murder him. The people she killed died a long time ago, and she legitimised her own actions in Atlantis-. Old Atlantis, so there's no legal issue there. But attacking King Orin, taking his authority and reordering Atlantean society… That's probably a death penalty offence, which strikes me as extremely wasteful."

A bit disappointing, but well within his rights. Let's hope her current state makes it unfeasible to execute her.

"But hardly unearned."

"If she hadn't been willing to sacrifice her sanity with no prompting from me at all, I'd probably be a lot less conflicted."

That was surprising. She didn't seem the sort. Then again, she might have simply latched onto a slim hope in the depths of despair...

I mean, I'm not conflicted, exactly. I want her alive and in prison so that she can work off her debt to society. I don't think she's an ongoing threat. But King Orin doesn't want a new Ocean Master, and getting his heart cut out really hurt. I can easily understand why he might just order her death. It wouldn't be capricious or arbitrary if he did.

Hopefully he lets his head cool before he makes that decision. Or takes time served as a fitting sentence.

I wonder if the genomorphs could-? Of course they could, but would it-?

"What are you thinking about?"

Would it be safe, you mean? Tapping the mind of someone lost in magical madness could let that spread to the whole collective...

"I was wondering if we could use a species of telepathic hive mind creatures to take a copy of her knowledge, in the event that King Orin insisted that she be executed."

"I suppose that you could, but where would you find such creatures?"

Nothing hypothetical there, dear. And it'd probably be best to wait and see if she regains some sense first.

"Oh, no-. Sorry. We've already got them. They're called g-nomes. They're a synthetic organic species, one of several genomorph types created by a company called Cadmus Laboratories."

She appears to take that with reasonable equanimity. "Do your people use many types of vassal creature?"

Probably not a strange concept to her, in a world this magical. I expect there's more than a few such species made by enterprising or mad wizards...

"No. None, actually. I was actually responsible for the legal changes that got them manumitted; they officially have full citizenship now. Do your people use.. things like that?"

"Some do. Though I imagine that their nature is dissimilar. Can your 'genomorphs' use magic?"

The interesting thing will be how similar they are, or how different...

"Some can, but they have to be specifically designed for it. We've still got a couple who were engineered to use demonic magic in the wind, but the other types are a good deal easier to deal with."

"Then they are living creatures whose nature makes it easier to use a particular type?"

I hope they've been doing well, actually. It's been a while since we last saw them.

I nod. "That's my understanding of it."

"Ours are… Partially elemental. A seed enriched with magic is placed in a vessel, and their master will usually grant it life with a drop of their own blood."

So, something closer to golems or homunculi than anything.

"How mentally.. complex are they?"

"They essentially run off their master's intellect, understanding their orders and situation based on their master's understanding. If their master dies or severs the bond they usually just sit where they are until the raw magic powering them is expended."

Well, that's reassuring. Mostly.

That's.. a relief, and Artemis picks up on my response.

"Were you worried that we used slaves?"

"A little. I don't know your culture."

In which case he'd be obliged to correct that failing...

"Then let me put your concerns to rest. They're more like an extra pair of hands that a magician can operate without a second mind."

I nod, smiling. "That's a relief."

Admittedly, that's her word, and there's no telling what some mages might get up to with biomancy...

"Have you noticed any ill-effects from contact with Despair?"

"No." I shake my head. "Other than what happened to Gamemnae there doesn't appear to have been any ill effects. On the other hand, Despair is fairly patient, so they might just be setting me up for something. Or… Someone I meet, or something like that."

Probably at some narratively dramatic moment, for maximum impact. Ideally just when he's about to experience a great triumph.

"Is there a story there?"

"I doubt that you've heard of the planet 'Krypton'. Despair was the one who arranged for it to develop intelligent life, knowing that it would be unstable and eventually explode. That took millions of years, so, I doubt that the comparatively short span of a mortal lifetime is much of an obstacle for them."

Probably a bit too far from his home sector or Krypton's...

She gives her head a small shake. "How do you know about that?"

"It happened at a party. One of the guests was a Maltusian, and I work for her descendants. Well, the descendants of her people."

Interesting how variable the ancient maltusians were. Given some ancient depictions back pre-Crisis... Then again, given how advanced they were, customised bodies probably don't seem unlikely.

Huh. Technically, she might still be alive. Might be worth looking into. And… Actually, that whole business might.. go some way to explaining why Hinon was so interested in how Dream got contained…

"It's amazing that you've directly encountered two of the Endless-."

Now that would be an experience. Sadly, Dream's romantic prospects don't always come out of the relationship well...

"Four."

"Four?"

I can just picture her face, and the 'how is this madman still alive?' thoughts...

"I met Dream when a possessed madman tried spreading the Anti-Life to the Dreaming, and Desire thinks I'm entertaining viewing. I haven't met Destruction, Delirium or Death, which is actually unusual as most people meet Death twice."

She nods slowly. "At the start and at the end of their lives. But you come from a place beyond their reach, and have not yet died."

True, he might well not be on her radar, so to speak. Or he simply doesn't remember any meetings. Few beings do.

"No, I've died twice. Didn't see her the first time and I don't remember seeing her the second time, but… My memories of that death are a bit confused."

She looks at me like she thinks that she misheard me. "You.. have died twice."

When you're as powerful in the Spectrum as he is, mortality is a much smaller concern.

"I got better."

She nods slowly, looking unconvinced. "Perhaps, if we… How do you see the return of Atlantis affecting our agreement?"

Ah, that is a good question, given that once they get things back on track, the Atlantean mages involved might well want to resume their NEMO duties.

"There's no such thing as too many researchers. Regardless of Atlantis getting spare capacity, we'd still like to expand. And if we don't need your researchers for our fleets in the short term, there are plenty of research projects we'd like them to work on. Obviously it's a little less urgent, but we're still eager to proceed."

"Then let us discuss how to do so."

They learned a lesson about putting all their eggs in one basket. Or rather, drawing them from a single chicken, so to speak.

A meeting that makes sense, given the likely resumption of Atlantean services once things stabilise. It's amusing, I don't think they had their arrangement in place for more than a week or two at this stage, did they? Has Alan even had his date with her yet, or has he been busy? Still, better to have multiple sources and services available...

Darko · Mar 7, 2025

Chojin Patriarch said:
I mean, if Delirium's portrait was anything to go by, she'd probably have thanked you for removing them, but I can understand the caution. Don't want to dump that much insanity energy anywhere too fast

Her thanks may have taken the form of a newly developed mental illness.

Chojin Patriarch said:
A bit disappointing, but well within his rights. Let's hope her current state makes it unfeasible to execute her

If anything her current insanity may make them consider executing her to be more necessary.

Chojin Patriarch said:
That was surprising. She didn't seem the sort. Then again, she might have simply latched onto a slim hope in the depths of despair...

She did seem to care about Atlantis.

Chojin Patriarch said:
Now that would be an experience. Sadly, Dream's romantic prospects don't always come out of the relationship well...

At least Killala didn't end up in Hell after her civilization was destroyed.

Timetech · Mar 7, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
"Some do. Though I imagine that their nature if dissimilar. Can you 'genomorphs' use magic?"

Should be "is" and "your" I think.

Mr Zoat · Mar 7, 2025

Signaller said:
Where did she get the name 'genomorphs' from? I don't think OL said it out loud?

Me said:
"Oh, no-. Sorry. We've already got them. They're called g-nomes. They're a synthetic organic species, one of several genomorph types created by a company called Cadmus Laboratories."

Also, you --> your.

Thank you, corrected.

Darko said:
"nature is"

Thank you, corrected.

Madwoman, since it was that despair goddess from Erebus.

He was referring to Mannheim.

Ngamer11 said:
@Mr Zoat, what is the name of Hieronymous' home planet and what sector is it located in.

It doesn't have a canon name or Sector designation as far as I know. I haven't named it, and the Sector number is fairly irrelevent as it's a long way from anything interesting.

Do you want to suggest a name?

dw7thdoctor said:
I thought he met Dream when the Goddess of Nightmares and madness went missing. It is how we got a new sandman, because during the investigation looking for her Dream tell OL that Sandy is still alive.

As far as I remember, only Sanderson met Dream during those events.

Ngamer11 · Mar 7, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
It doesn't have a canon name or Sector designation as far as I know. I haven't named it, and the Sector number is fairly irrelevent as it's a long way from anything interesting.

Do you want to suggest a name?

I'm not usually good with names. Just as a random name and placement, how about Planet Soumaya in Sector 1104?

Edit:

Mr Zoat said:
As far as I remember, only Sanderson met Dream during those events.

Paul, John Quinn, Zagreus, and Koriand'r summoned him to ask for some directions on where to find Melinoë in part 12 of Episode 100: A Week in the Life of. Sanderson met Dream when they were trying to break into the Tower of Fate much later.

Vanbers · Mar 7, 2025

It's always nice to see a person slowly coming to terms with the "What the FUCK even IS Earth?" thought.

Like, for 99% of the Universe, Earth is a complete fucking madhouse.

Conversations most aliens have with Earthlings in DC must be something like:

"Dream? Like the conceptual embodiment of a fundamental truth of the universe?"

"Oh, yeah, he acted up so we had a man in spandex go rough him up a bit, y'know? Calm him down a tad. Just the usual yearly apocalypse. At least it was more relaxed than that time that bald lad tried to end the world because he really, REALLY hates the spandex fellow."

RoninSword · Mar 7, 2025

@Mr Zoat Paul and others met Dream when looking for Melinoe. They did the most barebones summoning tk get his attention and Dream said that in return for finding Melinoe for them he wanted Paul to track down Sandy now that he had more resources then when he first showed up.
It was an oddlike dream sequence.
Ngamer11 found it in part 12 of episode 100

Mr Zoat · Mar 7, 2025

RoninSword said:
@Mr Zoat Paul and others met Dream when looking for Melinoe. They did the most barebones summoning tk get his attention and Dream said that in return for finding Melinoe for them he wanted Paul to track down Sandy now that he had more resources then when he first showed up.
It was an oddlike dream sequence.
Ngamer11 found it in part 12 of episode 100

Episode 100 part 12 is Canis and the SI chatting with Melmoth, but I'll take your word that it happened.

NightmareWarden · Mar 7, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
I nod. "No chance of patching things up now?"

That prompts a smile. "I don't think my current girlfriend would like that too much."

…

"But at least Carol and I are friends again. I missed talking to her."

"Ah, who's-?"

"Batman to Lanterns. Prepare to move out."

Uhh, did we ever learn Hal Jordan's current girlfriend? This is from 2020, the Sheedha invasion.

Ardy · Mar 7, 2025

NightmareWarden said:
Uhh, did we ever learn Hal Jordan's current girlfriend? This is from 2020, the Sheedha invasion.

Dame Carol?

RoninSword · Mar 7, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
Episode 100 part 12 is Canis and the SI chatting with Melmoth, but I'll take your word that it happened.

That's episode 102. Episode 100 is

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

With This Ring Current Story Only Second Revised Story Only (Now up to date!) Historical Story...

forum.questionablequesting.com

Vaermina · Mar 7, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
"I doubt that you've heard of the planet 'Krypton'. Despair was the one who arranged for it to develop intelligent life, knowing that it would be unstable and eventually explode. That took millions of years, so, I doubt that the comparatively short span of a mortal lifetime is much of an obstacle for them."

Not a smart idea to go around publicly blaming one of the Endless for something like that when you have no idea if it is true or not.

NightmareWarden · Mar 8, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
I've picked up a few open uses of magic, but it appears to be restricted to a small portion of the population. Euphorix is governed like a scaled down version of the Crown Imperium so I wouldn't be astonished to learn that magic education was restricted to the ruling class, but… I suppose it could be a heritable trait, or require a particular ritual to connect people to the local thaumosphere. I can't assume that the magic system here works in exactly the same way as the one on Earth.

Psychic abilities are similarly limited. As far as I can tell, almost the entire population has a really low level of psychic ability, with a tiny proportion having higher levels. As much as I can tell from the way people are dressed, that doesn't appear to be an aristocratic thing.

Mr Zoat said:
"Fine. Deliver this into Queen Kalista's hand."

"Certainly." I lean forwards and take it from him.

"And-." Something occurs to him. "Since the shield will most likely come down in a few days, would you like to speak to one of our necromancers before you leave?"

"No need. Back in a second."

I raise my right hand to my forehead,

head towards Kalista and Pren's shared desire to return home and then

return to the material universe.

"Here." I jab at her with the letter, and she instinctively takes it. "He wants a few days to prepare."

"W-?"

And then it's

back to Euphorix.

"But I would appreciate it if I could speak to one now

Interesting.

Recall what Zatanna said about Paul's teleportation flooding an area with certain magics? This office isn't exactly a research lab with sensitive devices around, but the combination of his blatant display, the info he told the returning royals, and the massive consequences of his actions on Euphorix? I think this world could be important for the cabal of villains making moves to oppose Paul, like Sinestro.

Mr Zoat said:
Heh.

-me carefully. "How does this compare to how you died last time?"

"Far less painful, didn't involved a giant would-be god with a smiley face for a head and escaping didn't involve my brain slowly suffocating while stuck in a robot body. Of the two, I definitely preferred this one. I definitely preferred the Honden to the Source."

'involved' -> 'involve'

Mr Zoat said:
"It's about you disgusting creatures using my work." He holds out his right hand and a book I.. don't recognise teleports into his hand. "My actual work. You.. create these abominations and celebrate it. You're like children proudly standing next to a shit-filled potty."

Mr Zoat said:
"No you idiot!" I glare at him. "M Two! Your religion didn't even exist back then! We worked it out! For ourselves! No gods, only men! Hard material graft! And… You! You say that humanity's peak was in the past and try to recover it from… Fragments. You can't! It's gone! The only way to get back up there is to do it the same way we did the first time around! Like the tau do, and you don't!"

The techpriest glares at me. "Heresy."

I sit back in the chair, smiling faintly as the ring notifies me that someone tried to set off the explosive. "You lack our virtues, and try to pretend they're vices to make yourself feel better about your inadequacy. You want to know what the ancients would have thought of you? You're a child proudly displaying a full potty. And then replacing your own organs with the contents. Your civilisation disgusts me profoundly."

It's an effective comment, effective writing. I thought of it as a very Grayveny description the first time, especially since some of his kids were quite young when he first met them. Do you recall, Mr Zoat, if you heard or read it somewhere before using it here? Seems too negative for George Carlin, and the use of the word "potty" doesn't scream American-English anyway.

SuperPulp2789 · Mar 8, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
4th October 1995
13:24 GMT -5

"…several minor irregularities in their accounting, but…" I shrug. "Honestly… I'm not sure that we want to help them recover funds from people trying to embezzle money from them. Though…" I smile a little. "It would be kind of funny if you did."

Professor Xavier smiles back. "I'm inclined to agree, but I think that perhaps our efforts could be more effectively focused elsewhere."

"There's also a load of violations of weapon control laws, but…" I gesture with my right hand to Scott's face, Logan's hands and my ring. "Pot, kettle."

"My face isn't a gun." Scott sounds unimpressed.

Henry looks uncertain. "No, but it could well be argued that you were -as a mutant- privileged in your ability to own a highly dangerous weapon while attempting to use the law as a tool to deny equivalent weapons to your political opponents."

I nod. "Again, getting a Supreme Court ruling which overturned all U.S. weapon ownership restrictions would be amusing, but I doubt that they'd thank you."

Jean nods. "But you do have something?"

"Yes." I press a button and bring up a series of crime reports on the screen. "I've been studying the statistical links between crimes and sentencing. Now, particular groups of people getting longer sentences for the same offence doesn't prove prejudice, as a fairly wide range of injuries can be covered by the same law. But it was a place to start looking. And in these cases we have three x-gene-possessing assault victims who were hospitalised with-" I bring up the police photos. "-injuries including stab wounds, severe bruising and broken bones, and whose attackers received surprisingly light sentences. Reading the judge's sentencing, there nothing that stands out as openly biased, but she did receive a donation from Friends of Humanity during her last election campaign. Now, if we could demonstrate that her ruling was due to underlying anti-mutant prejudice that might get her removed from her position, but there isn't anything else I can do remotely and I'm.. not a mind reader."

Anne-Marie frowns. "There ain't nothin' bettuh?"

"Not that I can find through statistical analysis." I shrug. "While I'm not trying to argue that the Friends of Humanity are harmless, the mutant population is relatively small, hard to distinguish from people who got superpowers in other ways, and a lot of illegal discrimination doesn't rise to the level of crimes, or go as far as generating criminal convictions. To be honest, this requires a large outreach effort whereby areas of concern can be identified by people on the ground, and we could perform investigations once that identification had been made."

Professor Xavier nods. "So what do you suggest?"

"Major cities usually have places where people with powers get together. The best information I have is that about three quarters of them should have the x-gene. And if we can't find them by asking politely, there's always Cerebro. Find community leaders, make sure they have our number."

The Professor nods. "I have had a few local organisers reach out to me in the past. But for the most part they were very… Angry people who wanted to pursue a more confrontational approach than I am comfortable with."

Remy actually looks up from the cards he's playing with. "When people scared, they jus' listen to whoever got de biggest mouth."

I nod. "I realise that it will take more work, but convincing people with superpowers to stay calm and rational and -where practical- obedient to the law will make it much easier to identify bad actors in the judiciary. If people with the x-gene are actually more likely to commit crimes then we're on a hiding to nothing. As for countering the Friends of Humanity generally… I think it might be an idea to expand the Institute's education program." I look around the room. "I mean, it's basically just Jubilee and me training at the moment, and in my case it's just mindfulness lessons and the occasional telepathic check-up. Each of us are easily capable of mentoring a few children with powers..."

Remy looks decidedly uncertain at that point. "I ain't sure they need mah kinda lessons. 'less you wan' the other bébé t' go home without dheir wallets."

Logan snorts. "Sounds like a valuable lesson t' me."

Henry raises his eyebrows. "Perhaps it would do less to encourage criminality if you limited yourself to card tricks? I'm certain that would find those just as entertaining, and it would be something which they could show their parents afterwards."

Kevin nods. "Ah, okay, mutants having better self control is good, but what are we doing with the regular kids? Mutants aren't getting beat up by other mutants."

Scott fans his hand out. "Why not invite them along? My best friend growing up was-. Didn't have an x-gene."

The professor thinks for a moment. "Because while I understand the value of exposure therapy, children without powers do not require special lessons in using powers which they don't have. Also, on a more practical level, Hank and I are the only people here who are licensed to teach children."

I nod. "Yes, I considered that. My thoughts were that offering a summer camp doesn't require the staff to have teaching qualifications as long as the activities are described as 'activities' rather than 'classes'. We all know enough about camping to oversee a camping trip, and I'm sure we could all find something to keep them entertained. If we encounter a child having control issues we can help them with that, and maybe suggest that they stay on a week for focused training. Of course, if the Institute did become a full-on school-school, then the rest of us are going to have to get qualified because I have no idea what the U.S. curriculum is like."

"Problem." Logan tilts his right hand slightly and extends a claw single claw. "What'd'we do when someone shows up t' trash the place? Or when we need t'go trash someone else's place?"

I shrug. "Summer school is… A week or two long? I'm sure the world can survive for that long without us actively fighting someone. And if we did desperately need to deploy while there were children on the premises, then one or two of us could stay behind and organise a safe group activity. And we'll obviously need an evacuation plan for if we were attacked here, but… Sad to say, most regular schools have those now. Supervillains are a fact of life in a lot of places. And.. our.. defences are a lot better than what most places have, especially including our exotic abilities."

The Professor nods. "I… Think that a summer school is something that we should be able to organize. Hank, perhaps you and I can put our heads together?" Henry nods. "Scott, please take the rest of the team and follow up with this judge. And Paul, while you're there, if they have any remaining injuries-."

"Of course." I nod. Abnormal physiology can make medicine difficult, but simple things like organic damage are easy to fix.

"Make sure that you make a record of their severity first. A defense lawyer might try to claim that we're exaggerating their extent."

"Certainly."

He looks around the table. "Then.. unless there's anything else..?"

There doesn't appear to be.

"Dismissed."

Scott stands first. "Get your things and then meet up in the hangar. Jean, can you tell Ororo?"

Jean raises her right hand to her forehead for a moment, then nods. "She's on her way."

A sensible precaution when everyone else is busy: someone gets to sit by a console to decrease our reaction time. And with Lilandra acting as an advisor with S.W.O.R.D. in exchange for a green card, Ororo drew the short straw. But with the meeting over, that's no longer so much of a concern. Anne-Marie and I glance at each other when we get out into the corridor. I don't think we really need anything-.

"Fergetting something?" Kevin looks at me expectantly, right hand held out.

I nod, a folder appearing from subspace. "Friends, family, local Friends of Humanity members and professional colleagues. Please don't do anything too creepy."

He shifts into-. Director Nicolas Fury, as he takes the folder. "How about you leave the spying to the professionals, huh?"

"As well as not being teachers, none of us are licensed as private detectives."

"In that case…" He shifts into… A cartoon character I don't recognise. "Let's go commit some federal offences!"

I nod. "Again."

One real problem with human and mutant coexistence is the primal fear and sheer jealousy that will ensue when it's realized

"X is so much better than me, because he has superpowers, he gives me an inferiority complex, I want to be able to shoot lasers too"

Who doesn't want superpowers? Raise your hand? I find sheer jealousy a more likely factor to hating mutants than being a victim to them

Mr Zoat · Mar 8, 2025

5th December 2023
13:27 GMT -5

"I guess…"

The large gold-furred gorilla opposite me slumps a little further.

"I guess since-. I.. died… I've just had conflicting drives. Like, the ape's still in here too, rather than dying with the body he was in… Or maybe that wasn't what happened, and… I'm just the ape that got smarter because a human kept sticking his mind in my brain."

I nod. "And how does this manifest?"

"I get-. Stressed out. Human body language and gorilla body language are just-. Different. Bared teeth, staring at someone directly… I see it as a threat display. And gorillas respond by throwing stuff around, beating their chests and hitting each other. And I shouldn't just automatically do that, because I'm supposed to be a man in a gorilla's body, but… I-I do."

"Mister Glenmorgan… It's not just you. Prison is a highly stressful environment for everyone. And most of the people here feel just as threatened by everyone else as you do." He nods unhappily. "Now, have you reconsidered coming to one of our group sessions?"

"I-I don't know…" He doesn't look directly at me, but he shifts where he sits so that his leg touches mine. "What if the-? What if I act up again?"

"I can calm you down. I don't like doing it because you need to learn how to deal with these feelings yourself, but if it helps you move forwards then I will agree to do it."

He smiles, reaching towards me with his left fist and tapping me on the chest twice.

"Thanks. Yeah. Yeah, I'll-. I'll come. And I'll.. do those-."

WEEEEERP!

He winces as the klaxon goes off and a guard team enters the room. "Those exercises again." He stands up with exaggerated slowness and holds out his arms to be cuffed for transport. "Thanks."

I smile, careful to keep my lips over my teeth. "You're welcome."

One of the guards glances my way as they get behind Mr. Glenmorgan, batons at the ready. "Chaplain? Waller wants to see you when she gets here."

I nod, standing and giving my wings a brief stretch before heading out of the door myself. They're heading for the main holding area for those the U.S. government considers to not be covered by the various civil rights protections of American law. And that is why I'm here. A chaplain is supposed to confront commanding officers for their immorality, and… Well, I can think of few better places for that.

Or a commanding officer who needs it more.

I walk towards the entrance of the guard portion of the facility, and in the distance I can already hear the various armoured doors opening and closing as she approaches.

I sigh as I wait behind the line for her to arrive. Very few of the inmates are strong enough to need that degree of security. All it really does for the rest is emphasise how trapped they are. It-.

The door opens, and Amanda Waller and an.. older man step through. "…the prison chaplain."

She stops, gesturing vaguely towards me. She doesn't like having me around, considering the imposition of even a little human decency to be an affront to her authority.

The man takes a step closer, frowning at me. "A thanagarian?"

I shake my head. "No."

His frown deepens. "You're… You're an actual angel?"

I shrug my wings. "If the wings fit…"

"Like a fallen angel..?"

I shake my head. "No, I'm still a faithful servant of the Most High."

He snorts. "And what did you do to deserve this gig?"

"I'm not entirely sure why I was assigned here, but for an angel… Since we lack egos and merely wish to be as useful as possible, the most difficult tasks are the most desirable."

He nods. "Alright." He offers me his right hand. "Richard Flag."

I shake his hand. "A pleasure to meet you."

"What, you're not going to tell me your name?"

"Ah… My name is lan Waller, which…" He jerks his head around and stares at her. "Yes."

"No way. No way are you-. Is he adopted-?"

She rolls her eyes, while I shake my head. "'lan' means 'servant of'. Since I am under Director Waller's command, that becomes my name."

He shakes his head. "I'm just gunna call you 'Lan'."

I nod. "Most people do."

Waller heads towards the cell block common room. "He'll be joining you in the field. He's the squad medic. And if he gets there too late he can give them the last rites."

I shake my head. "Since I'm not ordained as a Catholic priest, I can't."

Flag looks slightly distracted. "Does..? That matter?"

I nod. "It's quite important to them."

"No, to… To God." He bows his head slightly, exhaling sharply. "Does-? What does-?"

"Are you trying to ask which religion is right?"

"I guess that's part of it. I wasn't expecting to just-. Run into an honest-to-God-. Angel." He looks more awkward. "Ah…"

"Let's agree to treat that as a literal description, rather than you 'taking the Lord's name in vain'."

"Let's."

"The most simple answer is 'none of them'."

"Oh. How?"

"Over the course of human history, many people have been spoken to by the Most High, or sent messages by the Most High. The problem is that the human psyche is fundamentally designed to deal with the corporeal universe and when it communes with the Most High it usually falls rather short in comprehension. So people receive a message, relay it to the best of their ability, and then a game of Chinese whispers takes place, and the result of that is translated through several languages or cultures… And the gist is usually still there but a good deal of the nuance is lost. And that's assuming that everyone along the way agrees to be honest."

"So the New Testament..?"

"The Gospels don't claim to have been written by Jesus, and while it's mostly accurate the content wasn't written by the people it's commonly attributed to. Broadly similar things are true of the Torah, the Quran, the Guru Granth Sahib, or any other-." I see his expression. "It's the religious book of the Sikhs."

"Right. I'm sorry, I'm just having a little difficulty processing the idea of dealing with someone who's got a direct line to God."

"Everyone has a direct line to the Most High. That's what prayer is. It's just that as a messenger spirit I don't have an ego to prevent me from hearing the answer."

"I dunno. That sounded kinda smug."

I smile warmly and place my right hand on his right shoulder. "It is perfectly natural to project your own imperfections and insecurities onto others. The Most High understands and loves you anyway."

"Right…" He's thinking hard about something. "Look, I gotta ask: do you know if someone's…? Gone to-?"

"Quit lagging behind, Flag!" Waller looks back, her expression mildly irritated. Though that's fairly normal for her. "It's time to meet the prisoners."

Splinterface · Mar 8, 2025

Thanks for the chapter! Is Paul putting it on in this? I thought last time we saw a Paul with angel wings working for Waller, he had them attached a John Constantine - but here it sounds like he's claiming to be an actual angel?

Stsword · Mar 8, 2025

Splinterface said:
Thanks for the chapter! Is Paul putting it on in this? I thought last time we saw a Paul with angel wings working for Waller, he had them attached a John Constantine - but here it sounds like he's claiming to be an actual angel?

I think Zoat has been watching Creature Commandos, considering in other continuities Congo Bill is a superhero, not a prisoner.

Ngamer11 · Mar 8, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
5th December 2023
13:27 GMT -5

Is this another Angel version of the SI? Or same Angel SI that we saw before?

BlackCoat13 · Mar 8, 2025

Somehow this is the weirdest Paulcert.

Mr Zoat · Mar 8, 2025

RoninSword said:
That's episode 102. Episode 100 is

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

With This Ring Current Story Only Second Revised Story Only (Now up to date!) Historical Story...

forum.questionablequesting.com

Oh, yeah, I remember that now!

NightmareWarden said:
'involved' -> 'involve'

Thank you, corrected.

It's an effective comment, effective writing. I thought of it as a very Grayveny description the first time, especially since some of his kids were quite young when he first met them. Do you recall, Mr Zoat, if you heard or read it somewhere before using it here? Seems too negative for George Carlin, and the use of the word "potty" doesn't scream American-English anyway.

It's from Small Gods by Terry Pratchett, when Brutha's getting annoyed about the Ephebians undermining religious certainty.

SuperPulp2789 said:
One real problem with human and mutant coexistence is the primal fear and sheer jealousy that will ensue when it's realized

"X is so much better than me, because he has superpowers, he gives me an inferiority complex, I want to be able to shoot lasers too"

Who doesn't want superpowers? Raise your hand? I find sheer jealousy a more likely factor to hating mutants than being a victim to them

That only makes sense if there aren't other well known sources of superpowers in the setting, and there are.

Ngamer11 said:
Is this another Angel version of the SI? Or same Angel SI that we saw before?

It's the same one, and there's a reason why he's acting like this.

Ngamer11 · Mar 8, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
It's the same one, and there's a reason why he's acting like this.

Are the closest people he has to friends (the Suicide Squad) all dead?

Edit: Found some errors.

Mr Zoat said:
He shakes his head. "I'm just gunna call you 'Lan'."

That should say 'Ian'.

Mr Zoat said:
"Right. I'm sorry, I'm just having a little difficulty processing the idea of dealing some someone who's got a direct line to God."

That should say 'with'.

SuperPulp2789 · Mar 8, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
That only makes sense if there aren't other well known sources of superpowers in the setting, and there are.

I still can't help but think of resentful kids asking why they don't have powers of their own, after getting to know these guys as civilians

Chojin Patriarch · Mar 8, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
5th December 2023
13:27 GMT -5

"I guess…"

The large gold-furred gorilla opposite me slumps a little further.

Ooh, Congorilla? There's a deep dive. Amusingly, he even served on an incarnation of the Justice League! And looking ahead. I have to wonder if this is the same Paul that got Gabriel's Wings from Constantine, or a different one?

"I guess since-. I.. died… I've just had conflicting drives. Like, the ape's still in here too, rather than dying with the body he was in… Or maybe that wasn't what happened, and… I'm just the ape that got smarter because a human kept sticking his mind in my brain."

I nod. "And how does this manifest?"

It's definitely a conundrum when superpowers are involved. And his human body dying is a part of his modern backstory, yes. The joy of outliving the original series you appeared in.

"I get-. Stressed out. Human body language and gorilla body language are just-. Different. Bared teeth, staring at someone directly… I see it as a threat display. And gorillas respond by throwing stuff around, beating their chests and hitting each other. And I shouldn't just automatically do that, because I'm supposed to be a man in a gorilla's body, but… I-I do."

The problem really creeps in if he starts forgetting he was ever a man. I wonder if the apes of Gorilla City would be interested in providing him a place with more comfortable body language?

"Mister Glenmorgan… It's not just you. Prison is a highly stressful environment for everyone. And most of the people here feel just as threatened by everyone else as you do." He nods unhappily. "Now, have you reconsidered coming to one of our group sessions?"

"I-I don't know…" He doesn't look directly at me, but he shifts where he sits so that his leg touches mine. "What if the-? What if I act up again?"

Ah. I'm guessing his earlier comment about his responses wasn't rhetorical. And it was bad enough for him to end up in Belle Reve.

"I can calm you down. I don't like doing it because you need to learn how to deal with these feelings yourself, but if it helps you move forwards then I will agree to do it."

He smiles, reaching towards me with his left fist and tapping me on the chest twice.

A characteristically ape-like gesture, that. Apparently one of thanks and friendship?

"Thanks. Yeah. Yeah, I'll-. I'll come. And I'll.. do those-."

WEEEEERP!

He winces as the klaxon goes off and a guard team enters the room. "Those exercises again." He stands up with exaggerated slowness and holds out his arms to be cuffed for transport. "Thanks."

I'm guessing that was the ticking clock for a therapy session.

I smile, careful to keep my lips over my teeth. "You're welcome."

One of the guards glances my way as they get behind Mr. Glenmorgan, batons at the ready. "Chaplain? Waller wants to see you when she gets here."

'Chaplain', eh? Wonder if that's a formal role or just an unofficial one?

I nod, standing and giving my wings a brief stretch before heading out of the door myself. They're heading for the main holding area for those the U.S. government considers to not be covered by the various civil rights protections of American law. And that is why I'm here. A chaplain is supposed to confront commanding officers for their immorality, and… Well, I can think of few better places for that.

And at least some of the people here can be rehabilitated. Others... Dying in a Task Force X mission is probably a good use for them.

Or a commanding officer who needs it more.

I walk towards the entrance of the guard portion of the facility, and in the distance I can already hear the various armoured doors opening and closing as she approaches.

Waller? Indeed, she could probably use a shoulder angel with actual bite.

I sigh as I wait behind the line for her to arrive. Very few of the inmates are strong enough to need that degree of security. All it really does for the rest is emphasise how trapped they are. It-.

The door opens, and Amanda Waller and an.. older man step through. "…the prison chaplain."

Introducing him to a new operative, perhaps?

She stops, gesturing vaguely towards me. She doesn't like having me around, considering the imposition of even a little human decency to be an affront to her authority.

The man takes a step closer, frowning at me. "A thanagarian?"

And yet she never considers that needing one might be a sign of something?

I shake my head. "No."

His frown deepens. "You're… You're an actual angel?"

I shrug my wings. "If the wings fit…"

Really leaning into the role, eh? Or perhaps there's been a little bleedover between hollow man and magical biology? I wonder if he has a soul made of celestial energy?

"Like a fallen angel..?"

I shake my head. "No, I'm still a faithful servant of the Most High."

Unlike a certain other angel who made an appearance in late 90's comics... Turns out falling in love with the being you were set to watch over is enough to make you Fall.

He snorts. "And what did you do to deserve this gig?"

"I'm not entirely sure why I was assigned here, but for an angel… Since we lack egos and merely wish to be as useful as possible, the most difficult tasks are the most desirable."

Huh, really sunk into the disguise, eh? Or maybe he got 'recalled' to the Silver City and, shall we say, reordered into a proper celestial messenger? If it's the same universe it has been five years...

He nod. "Alright." He offers me his right hand. "Richard Flag."

I shake his hand. "A pleasure to meet you."

And yes, it is spelled flag. The version with 'double G' was a DCAU adaption of his son, Rick Flag jr..

"What, you're not going to tell me your name?"

"Ah… My name is lan Waller, which…" He jerks his head around and stares at her. "Yes."

For a second, I thought he said 'Ian' with a capital i. A quirk of the celestial language, then?

"No way. No way are you-. Is he adopted-?"

She rolls her eyes, while I shake my head. "'lan' means 'servant of'. Since I am under Director Waller's command, that becomes my name."

It's an easy assumption, though. The fact that Waller seems to dislike people asking that must amuse him a little.

He shakes his head. "I'm just gunna call you 'Lan'."

I nod. "Most people do."

Beats a given name you can't say without being knocked unconscious.

Waller heads towards the cell block common room. "He'll be joining you in the field. He's the squad medic. And if he gets there too late he can give them the last rites."

I shake my head. "Since I'm not ordained as a Catholic priest, I can't."

I would have thought that would be given. Then again, given how rule-obsessed angels tend to be...

Flag looks slightly distracted. "Does..? That matter?"

I nod. "It's quite important to them."

Ah, a matter of their personal belief, then. Given the mechanics of how Heaven works in this story... It makes sense.

"No, to… To God." He bows his head slightly, exhaling sharply. "Does-? What does-?"

"Are you trying to ask which religion is right?"

I mean, you are something of a highly visible reminder that it's a real place.

"I guess that's part of it. I wasn't expecting to just-. Run into an honest-to-God-. Angel." He looks more awkward. "Ah…"

"Let's agree to treat that as a literal description, rather than you 'taking the Lord's name in vain'."

I bet he gets that sort of slip of the tongue a lot.

"Let's."

"The most simple answer is 'none of them'."

"Oh. How?"

Because to some degree in DC, all myths are true, yet not at the same time.

"Over the course of human history, many people have been spoken to by the Most High, or sent messages by the Most High. The problem is that the human psyche is fundamentally designed to deal with the corporeal universe and when it communes with the Most High it usually falls rather short in comprehension. So people receive a message, relay it to the best of their ability, and then a game of Chinese whispers takes place, and the result of that is translated through several languages or cultures… And the gist is usually still there but a good deal of the nuance is lost. And that's assuming that everyone along the way agrees to be honest."

A fairly logical way to account for the sheer variety of denominations out there, both aligned with our world and those original to DC. (And let's not argue about the former, eh?)

"So the New Testament..?"

"The Gospels don't claim to have been written by Jesus, and while it's mostly accurate the content wasn't written by the people it's commonly attributed to. Broadly similar things are true of the Torah, the Quran, the Guru Granth Sahib, or any other-." I see his expression. "It's the religious book of the Sikhs."

Ah, the Sikh. Theirs is a fascinating faith, and one of the most badass peoples in modern-ish military history.

"Right. I'm sorry, I'm just having a little difficulty processing the idea of dealing some someone who's got a direct line to God."

"Everyone has a direct line to the Most High. That's what prayer is. It's just that as a messenger spirit I don't have an ego to prevent me from hearing the answer."

Interesting indeed. I'm guessing that's why he's not in classic Paul-insert mode.

"I dunno. That sounded kinda smug."

I smile warmly and place my right hand on his right shoulder. "It is perfectly natural to project your own imperfections and insecurities onto others. The Most High understands and loves you anyway."

I'm guessing with responses like that, he's had to dodge punches a few times.

"Right…" He's thinking hard about something. "Look, I gotta ask: to you know if someone's…? Gone to-?"

"Quit lagging behind, Flag!" Waller looks back, her expression mildly irritated. Though that's fairly normal for her. "It's time to meet the prisoners."

Rick's lost a few good friends over the years, ~~starting with his mother~~. I'm not surprised he's concerned about what comes after the end.
Edit: Well, this part was written with junior in mind. Don't doubt senior has his own share of regrets...

So, I'm guessing by the title this is set in the 'Creature Commandos' animation. And this SI seems to be an entirely appropriate fit for such a team. Presumably he'll also be a counter for the more powerful members as much as a medic. Assuming he's got the usual flaming sword associated with Angels... Perhaps things will go well for the Creatures...

GhostKing 666 · Mar 8, 2025

That Waller probably hates that Paul with a passion. It would be very hard to maintain her "Hard Man making Hard Decisions" vibe when there's a literal angel right there shaking his head and telling her all the alternatives. Would annoy the hell out of her, to say nothing of how deep down she's probably deeply unnerved and fearful over how it means that she might actually face punishment for her actions if not in this life, then in the next.

As for the inmates, moral's probably never been higher for some, or lower for others. Having an angel there helping them through... life, I suppose is the best way to put it, would probably put a lot of existential questions several of them have to rest, but Phosphorus probably prefers to hide his loss in his madness and wouldn't really like having to confront both it and the reality of all the lives he took trying to run from it.

Darko · Mar 8, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
"Like a fallen angel..?"

I shake my head. "No

Technically yes, since your wings come from a fallen angel.

Mr Zoat said:
He nod. "Alright

"nods"

Mr Zoat said:
And if he gets there too late he can give them the last rites."

I shake my head. "Since I'm not ordained as a Catholic priest, I can't."

Pretty dire the Catholic church will be fine with you performing last rites.

Mr Zoat said:
ask: to you know

"so you"

Splinterface said:
Thanks for the chapter! Is Paul putting it on in this? I thought last time we saw a Paul with angel wings working for Waller, he had them attached a John Constantine - but here it sounds like he's claiming to be an actual angel?

He bought the rings from Constantine and used his remaining ring charge to attach them.

Mr Zoat · Mar 8, 2025

Ngamer11 said:
Are the closest people he has to friends (the Suicide Squad) all dead?

Sort of.

Edit: Found some errors.

That should say 'Ian'.

No, he's using 'Lan' as a name.

That should say 'with'.

Thank you, corrected.

Chojin Patriarch said:
Rick's lost a few good friends over the years, starting with his mother. I'm not surprised he's concerned about what comes after the end.

It's his son that he's thinking about.

Darko said:
"nods"
"so you"

Thank you, corrected.

KharnTheBrotrayer · Mar 8, 2025

Man now I want to re-read the previous Paul Angel chapters, anyone know which ones they are?

Ngamer11 · Mar 8, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
No, he's using 'Lan' as a name.

In that case, the below should be capitalized.

Mr Zoat said:
"Ah… My name is lan Waller, which…" He jerks his head around and stares at her. "Yes."

"No way. No way are you-. Is he adopted-?"

She rolls her eyes, while I shake my head. "'lan' means 'servant of'. Since I am under Director Waller's command, that becomes my name."

Mr Zoat · Mar 8, 2025

Ngamer11 said:
In that case, the below should be capitalized.

No, is those cases he's using it to literally mean 'servant of'.

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

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