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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Oh with this family I'm sure the superhero wedding will be completely calm, uneventful, and drama free, with zero supervillain attacks or shouting matches at all whatsoever.

Don't need Irene's powers to see how unlikely that is : )

Now Paul just has to fight the Mandarin, and decide who gets what ring at what time.
 
"It was supposed to be in apostrophes."

"I'm sorry?"

"'Evil Mutants'. A place for those cast out of polite society because they were different and so of course they were evil. Creed took it as a challenge." She shakes her head with a grimace. "I've got no idea what she saw in him."
Called it!

Well it has sometimes been hinted that the chemicals that blinded [Daredevil] altered him to have enhanced senses.
In some continuities the exact same accident and spill was also the origin story of the Ninja Turtles, so it's entirely plausible.
 
Fleet Traction (part 13)
1st January 2013
21:06 GMT


"Orange Lantern." Athyns sounds like he's in good health, though something of the timbre he had while using the Seeds is missing. Hopefully that's been resolved by… Whatever this civilisation is now calling itself. "What brings you here?"

I hang back slightly as the Ascendants' ships fly in the direction of New Chronos. The damage has long since been repaired, and… It looks like they've expanded the docks. Asteroids have been dragged into near-Minosyss orbit to be taken apart by new orbital stations, and I can detect the network of interdiction fields and detection networks.

"Bit of a problem in Karrakan's system. The Reach attacked, and then Grayven attacked them."

"Thiva?"

Her ships are heading towards New Chronos at high speed. I… Hm. There's one advanced settlement very visible on the surface. I didn't ever find out how good the New Titans' building technology was. It seems to me that they'd probably do what the New Gods of New Genesis do: keep all advanced technology and magic up in 'Supertown' and leave the rest as a primitive wasteland. But it looks like they've decided to actually do something with the local people. That'll be useful.

In a generation or two.

"It is as he says. Everything we built there has been destroyed, and Grayven and the Reach are fighting over Karrakan itself. Grayven has Ascendants among his followers."

"Lantern, while I appreciate your work in reuniting my people, we are not your allies in your war with the Reach."

"I understand that. I'm just accompanying these ships, and I'll clear off if you want."

"Grayven was trading with Sparta. He had Ascendants serving him."

"I couldn't feel their influence myself, but the ships were of a design to require that."

"Thiva, take the ship carrying Grandmother Rhea's remains to the surface at once. We will prepare for Grayven's arrival. The rest will dock with New Chronos."

"Yes, Athyns."

"Orange Lantern, we… I, have no wish to join your war. On any side."

"I'm glad to hear it."

"I have been expecting you to attempt to recruit us."

"The Controllers will feel obliged to Minosyss. This is the first time we've encountered Grayven since his declaration of war. Without us having an immediate need to fight New Gods, they felt that it was better to leave you be."

"Why haven't either of them approached us?"

"Not sure. I'd guess that Grayven already has a… Excuse the phrasing, 'breeding population' of Ascendants, and so doesn't need you, and the Reach… Probably hasn't heard of you. Depending on whether or not they capture anyone on the surface, they may not find out even now."

"But they knew of Karrakan."

"Yes, but… With the L.E.G.I.O.N. ships that have been flying through it, it's perfectly possible that they just knew that we were interested in it."

"I don't think that is why they were there." Thiva certainly sounds dubious. "That was a great many ships for an investigation."

"It would also work as a trap for me. What they did to lock us in the system, that's not what their usual system interdiction devices look like."

Oh. Ring, update Controller Hinon.

Compliance.

"So if the Reach kill Grayven, there's no real reason for them to come here even if they know here exists. If they don't, and you don't ally with Grayven, there shouldn't be any problem."

"And if they decide that they do not want to take a risk?"

"You're not part of the conflict. You could.. call in the Green Lantern Corps. Them picking a fight with you would violate their treaty. If they limit themselves to sieging the system, you could bypass that with boom tubes, or… Just… Not? Did you feel an urgent need to go elsewhere?"

"No. And we will not for quite some time. Having them picket our system wouldn't really impede our work here."

"So that's a perfectly fine result. Of course, if Grayven turned up… He can probably track boom tubes, and Sparta would almost certainly have been sharing information with him."

"What will he demand?"

"I don't know. He was fairly hands-off with Sparta, but he might have expected her to declare her allegiance after she won. Or he might have been satisfied with the service of those Ascendants who wanted to work for him. Or he might just have wanted the Sun Eaters to use against the Reach."

"How much success has he had against them?"

"We don't.. really know. The thing is… N.E.M.O. has incorporated as many of the worlds on the periphery of Reach space as we can. We've been in contact with literally all of them. Grayven's personal followers are gordanians, from the Vega Systems. But they're not going home to recruit new soldiers. So where are his shipyards? Where is he getting raw materials from?"

"The ships of the Ascendants can self-repair."

"Sure, but with no raw materials for the repair systems? And… Major damage? There weren't any reports of him using ships like his Ascendant captains are using before now. Where is he building them? Is he capturing worlds at all, or just fighting like the tau?"

"Please explain."

"N.E.M.O.'s aim in the early stage of the war is to take back worlds that have native populations on them so that we can remove whatever mind control the Reach used on them. If the Reach fleet in the area pulls back, we'll probably let it go because killing Reach citizens isn't our specific aim. For the tau, the objective is the enemy. Grayven isn't trying to save anyone. Yes, he probably wants to take Reach territory and industry, but if he doesn't need it to maintain his current fleet, then he might just be treating Reach fleets as his objective and going after them."

"Do you know what he would do if we went to his aid?"

"No. The gordanians I spoke to seemed perfectly happy being ruled by him, so I doubt that he's a particularly bad tyrant. He might expect you to kneel at once, or he might treat it as a favour."

"How would you take it?"

"Honestly, we'd be happy for Grayven to take the entire core of Reach territory. We just want the bits around the edge so that we can restore them to the species who lived there before the Reach wiped them out. We'd much rather make common cause than fight him."

"Why didn't he agree?"

"I don't know. Maybe he felt like he needed to look strong and independent. Or maybe he plans to conquer us as well. A lot of the species who signed up with N.E.M.O. were fairly sure that Maltus would be treating them like vassals, but they did it anyway because at least that meant that someone had a plan for fighting the Reach."

"Would our position be weakened by aiding him?"

"It will piss off the Reach and eliminate your defence under their treaty with the Green Lantern Corps."

"I need more information."

"It's usually helpful."

"I thank you for your counsel. Please, come to New Othrys. I want to show you what we've made here."
 
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they'd probably to what the New Gods

"do what"

Everything we build there has been

"built"

your war. No any side."

"Nor any side"

Without us having a immediate need

"an immediate"

"So if the Reach kill Grayven, there's no real reason for them to come here even if they know here exists. If they don't, and you don't ally with Grayven, there shouldn't be any problem

Unless they want to achieve godhood and experimenting on you will achieve that.

"N.E.M.O.'s aim in the early stage of the war is to take back worlds that have native populations on them so that we can remove whatever mind control the Reach used on them. If the Reach fleet in the area pulls back, we'll probably let it go because killing Reach citizens isn't our specific aim. For the tau, the objective is the enemy. Grayven isn't trying to save anyone. Yes, he probably wants to take Reach territory and industry, but if he doesn't need it to maintain his current fleet, then he might just be treating Reach fleets as his objective and going after them

Hmm, with his powers, conquering his foes would make him more powerful.

"Why didn't he agree?"

"I don't know. Maybe he felt like he needed to look strong and independent. Or maybe he plans to conquer us as well

He's Apokoliptian so he may not be capable of viewing anyone he views lesser in any way as an ally.

Plus, if he did leave Darkseid then he may not want to be anything other than independent.

what we're made here."

"we've"

So what happened to the New Titans?

Are they still comatose?
 
I feel Paul is rather ignoring Apokolips' angle in all this. At least he should try to find a way to investigate wether there is an angle.
That would be like investigating the game master's angle for running a tabletop game.

If you aren't already playing on the same level like Renegade is, you end up chasing your own tail.
 
1st January 2013
21:06 GMT


"Orange Lantern." Athyns sounds like he's in good health, though something of the timbre he had while using the Seeds is missing. Hopefully that's been resolved by… Whatever this civilisation is now calling itself. "What brings you here?"

I hang back slightly as the Ascendants' ships fly in the direction of New Chronos. The damage has long since been repaired, and… It looks like they've expanded the docks. Asteroids have been dragged into near-Minosyss orbit to be taken apart by new orbital stations, and I can detect the network of interdiction fields and detection networks.
Turning New Chronos into the lynchpin of a new orbital facility, eh? Or at least using it to build the necessary parts to jumpstart it. At least they're taking their space-going defences seriously. With a war nearby, it's a safe plan and a good idea.

"Bit of a problem in Karrakan's system. The Reach attacked, and then Grayven attacked them."

"Thiva?"
Heh. Sounds like a major case of screwing the pooch, but thankfully, Thiva accomplished her mission there: Retrieve Rhea's remains, and rescue as many as possible.

Her ships are heading towards New Chronos at high speed. I… Hm. There's one advanced settlement very visible on the surface. I didn't ever find out how good the New Titans' building technology was. It seems to me that they'd probably to what the New Gods of New Genesis do: keep all advanced technology and magic up in 'Supertown' and leave the rest as a primitive wasteland. But it looks like they've decided to actually do something with the local people. That'll be useful.
Hopefully without the arrogant attitude the New Genisisians tend to show towards the Bugs.

In a generation or two.

"It is as he says. Everything we build there has been destroyed, and Grayven and the Reach are fighting over Karrakan itself. Grayven has Ascendants among his followers."
Which is worrying in itself. It gives his armies a certain measure of quality to match the gordanian's quantity.

"Lantern, while I appreciate your work in reuniting my people, we are not your allies in your war with the Reach."

"I understand that. I'm just accompanying these ships, and I'll clear off if you want."
Yeah, could be awkward. Orange Lanterns basically do have a strong connection to NEMO in the eyes of the galaxy, after all. Even one acting on their own recognisance will still likely be seen as acting in Maltusian interests.

"Grayven was trading with Sparta. He had Ascendants serving him."

"I couldn't feel their influence myself, but the ships were of a design to require that."
Well, you did stay pretty much across the system from them. Your God-sense isn't exactly developed enough to pick their works out at that distance...

"Thiva, take the ship carrying Grandmother Rhea's remains to the surface at once. We will prepare for Grayven's arrival. The rest will dock with New Chronos."

"Yes, Athyns."
I expect her tomb will be something spectacular. Though likely to be very noticeable as 'something of value' to invaders...

"Orange Lantern, we… I, have no wish to join your war. No any side."

"I'm glad to hear it."
The challenge to remaining neutral, though, is proving that you want nothing to do with any side. Switzerland manages it by having been so badass that everyone asked them nicely not to kick their asses. :p

"I have been expecting you to attempt to recruit us."

"The Controllers will feel obliged to Minosyss. This is the first time we've encountered Grayven since his declaration of war. Without us having a immediate need to fight New Gods, they felt that it was better to leave you be."
Now? Well, expect polite overtures...

"Why haven't either of them approached us?"

"Not sure. I'd guess that Grayven already has a… Excuse the phrasing, 'breeding population' of Ascendants, and so doesn't need you, and the Reach… Probably hasn't heard of you. Depending on whether or not they capture anyone on the surface, they may not find out even now."
Heck, those Ascendants under Grayven probably have better gear than their unaligned cousins. After all, he wouldn't have passed the good stuff to an untested prospect.

"But they knew of Karrakan."

"Yes, but… With the L.E.G.I.O.N. ships that have been flying through it, it's perfectly possible that they just knew that we were interested in it."
and disrupting a potential point in their supply line would have been a strategic concern, certainly.

"I don't think that is why they were there." Thiva certainly sounds dubious. "That was a great many ships for an investigation."

"It would also work as a trap for me. What they did to lock us in the system, that's not what their usual system interdiction devices look like."
And, to be blunt, OL's a bigger fish than you kids are...

Oh. Ring, update Controller Hinon.

Compliance.
Hinon: "Good grief. Only he could get involved in something this ridiculous..."

"So if the Reach kill Grayven, there's no real reason for them to come here even if they know here exists. If they don't, and you don't ally with Grayven, there shouldn't be any problem."

"And if they decide that they do not want to take a risk?"
Well, you'd probably end up playing the role of Poland: The Reach invading you would get some other galactic players off their ass.

"You're not part of the conflict. You could.. call in the Green Lantern Corps. Them picking a fight with you would violate their treaty. If they limit themselves to sieging the system, you could bypass that with boom tubes, or… Just… Not? Did you feel an urgent need to go elsewhere?"

"No. And we will not for quite some time. Having them picket our system wouldn't really impede our work here."
And you have little or no need of external supplies. It'd be like learning to ignore the constantly-barking dog next door.

"So that's a perfectly fine result. Of course, if Grayven turned up… He can probably track boom tubes, and Sparta would almost certainly have been sharing information with him."

"What will he demand?"
Well, for a start, you might find out what he expected from Sparta. At best, he'll just command you to kneel.

"I don't know. He was fairly hands-off with Sparta, but he might have expected her to declare her allegiance after she won. Or he might have been satisfied with the service of those Ascendants who wanted to work for him. Or he might just have wanted the Sun Eaters to use against the Reach."

"How much success has he had against them?"
Grayven does have something of a hard-on for cosmic-scale superweapons. The Orrery, Sun Eaters... I shudder to imagine what else he might have tried to acquire... And what he might have succeeded in acquiring.

"We don't.. really know. The thing is… N.E.M.O. has incorporated as many of the worlds on the periphery of Reach space as we can. We've been in contact with literally all of them. Grayven's personal followers are gordanians, from the Vega Systems. But they're not going home to recruit new soldiers. So where are his shipyards? Where is he getting raw materials from?"

"The ships of the Ascendants can self-repair."
Most likely he's exploiting unclaimed interstellar resources, and those systems he's been able to conquer.

"Sure, but with no raw materials for the repair systems? And… Major damage? There weren't any reports of him using ships like his Ascendant captains are using before now. Where is he building them? Is he capturing worlds at all, or just fighting like the tau?"

"Please explain."
Hmm... Mont'Ka or Kau'Yon? Not really grokking the comparison, sadly. Or is it a reference to his collecting subservient 'allies'?

"N.E.M.O.'s aim in the early stage of the war is to take back worlds that have native populations on them so that we can remove whatever mind control the Reach used on them. If the Reach fleet in the area pulls back, we'll probably let it go because killing Reach citizens isn't our specific aim. For the tau, the objective is the enemy. Grayven isn't trying to save anyone. Yes, he probably wants to take Reach territory and industry, but if he doesn't need it to maintain his current fleet, then he might just be treating Reach fleets as his objective and going after them."
And it feeds his Godname. He looks at Conquest and sees 'Taking by force of arms and intimidation.' Very childish of him...

"Do you know what he would do if we went to his aid?"

"No. The gordanians I spoke to seemed perfectly happy being ruled by him, so I doubt that he's a particularly bad tyrant. He might expect you to kneel at once, or he might treat it as a favour."
And while that may sound like an oxymoron, 'Tyrant' merely refers to an absolute ruler. It has a bad name in modern culture because most 'tyrants' these days are petty men with selfish desires.

"How would you take it?"

"Honestly, we'd be happy for Grayven to take the entire core of Reach territory. We just want the bits around the edge so that we can restore them to the species who lived there before the Reach wiped them out. We'd much rather make common cause than fight him."
Except that he won't be satisfied with taking what the Reach has gained. He will always want more.

"Why didn't he agree?"

"I don't know. Maybe he felt like he needed to look strong and independent. Or maybe he plans to conquer us as well. A lot of the species who signed up with N.E.M.O. were fairly sure that Maltus would be treating them like vassals, but they did it anyway because at least that meant that someone had a plan for fighting the Reach."
Yep. He's like Alexander III of Macedon. Always looking for the next conquest, never satisfied with what he's gained. Alexander only stopped because his men threatened to overthrow him. Grayven won't allow such independence.

"Would our position be weakened by aiding him?"

"It will piss off the Reach and eliminate your defence under their treaty with the Green Lantern Corps."
So probably better to beg off joining him, though that has the risk of angering him.

"I need more information."

"It's usually helpful."

"I thank you for your council. Please, come to New Othrys. I want to show you what we're made here."
Not for too long. Don't want to be seen 'harboring a hostile agent' by the Reach or Grayven...

Well, a fairly calm debriefing for OL. Calm discussion, smoothing of concerns and even a Warhammer 40,000 reference.:p Let's hope things stay this calm in the foreseeable future. And at some point, OL will have to go talk to Dox, if only to find out what the level 12 intellect wants him to do next. There's still the matter of Earth to be resolved, too. It could be a busy January for OL...
 
I don't think heat death will happen in this universe, given that infinite energy seems possible to acquire, for example with bleed generators. Heat death was kind of going on in the Sheeda future, but that was only after Starbreaker ate 99.9% of the universe.
is it dc canon that starbreaker was eating the universe during the time of the sheeda? like was he featured in the seven soldiers story?
 
is it dc canon that starbreaker was eating the universe during the time of the sheeda? like was he featured in the seven soldiers story?

No, that was just Zoat's explanation for why a civilization with both the magic and technology that mining other planets and asteroids should be child's play actually needs to raid the past for resources, which went without an explanation in the comics.
 
Yeah, for some reason I feel there's some information Paul does not have right now that will greatly impact the New Titans decision.
 
Not for too long. Don't want to be seen 'harboring a hostile agent' by the Reach or Grayven..
Also, between the inner-core Reach fleet decimating NEMO forces, the apocalypse currently happening on Earth, and the once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to ravage the Reach while they're really vulnerable….

Well, I think it's fair to say that Paul has better uses of his time right now. IMO he should head out to his choice of fronts as soon as he's done with the urgent investigating and save the diplomacy for a week from now.
 
"The one who spoke to you here. Desire. The Endless." She looks at me with mild frustration. "Do try to remember why we're here."

Desire. The only thing I remember about Desire from Sandman was that… They are a hermaphrodite, or.. something, they.. helped that iron age tribeswoman marry the chief's son and probably had something to do with him getting killed the next day, and failed to tempt Emperor Norton to do… Something. The plot was rather Dream-focused.

"Is that a problem?"

"Think about it for a moment. You may well exist in perfect equilibrium with your desires now, but how would you characterise how you felt when you came here?"

I nod. "We were a confused mess."

"And this was when and where Desire chose to visit you. Not before, when you were struggling with your ring. Not afterwards, when you were at peace with it. When you were at your lowest ebb."

"At my most entertaining."

Guess Desire is a bitchhole, then. At least I appear to have become boring enough that they haven't put in another appearance.

"Just report any future contact and you should be alright."

"Really?"

"No. But it can't-" My ring blinks. "-hurt. Much."
Have we told Hinon about our recent encounter with Desire? I'd be quite curious what she would have to say about it.
 
Fleet Traction (part 14)
1st January 2013
21:22 GMT


New Othrys has an interesting mix of styles.

The weapon and shield emplacements might as well have just been ripped off the Ascendants' warships. I see the classical New God tron lines combined with materials… Materials that are easier to produce when you're a technologically primitive but magically powerful civilisation. I wonder if that's something Grayven shared with them or something that they developed based on his guidance? Or something Rhea showed them how to make?

The 'God Buildings' are much the same, but the rest of the city… Reminds me of Themyscira City. Primitive materials used to make something that was planned out far better than a naturally occurring primitive city would be. Wide thoroughfares paved with stone or brick because they can't make tarmac or an equivalent, or can't make it in sufficient quantities or can't make it here. Anti-gravity floaters serve as cranes for the building works while animal-drawn carts are used to move raw materials. Even under the guidance of well-intentioned incarnate gods, it would have taken several generations to make a noticeable change to the lives of the natives using novel technology; even a relatively sparsely populated planet like this just has too many people on it, and too many logistics systems that can be snarled up if you rush things.

"How are the locals taking all of this?"

I hear Athyns exhale. "One group of alien gods are much the same as another. Our beliefs and theirs are similar enough that nothing… New needed to be added to the doctrine we were promulgating."

"'Ours' and 'theirs' in the context being..?"

"The followers of the gods and the followers of Sparta."

"What does your theology look like at the moment?"

"We have demonised Sparta, and accepted the other descendants of Rhea as equivalent to me. With the gods… Not presently available to lead us, we have taken more prominent roles."

"'Not presently available'?"

Ahead of me, the warship I've been following docks with the upper level of the central tower. It clearly isn't a shipyard, and as far as I can tell they aren't bothering to construct ships on the planet's surface.

"This world is thick with magic. And even in death, Rhea's remains will strengthen that link."

"You're going to try resurrecting them using the seeds?"

"Not… Precisely. I heard what you and Melinoë said concerning the nature of divine magic. That they-"

Ah.

"-would-."

"You're going to dump the seeds in the local thaumosphere."

"Yes. The process will be guided by members of the Ascendancy. The aim is to allow their consciousnesses to expand and draw power while still remaining coherent."

"Yes… I mean, in theory that could work. The local thaumosphere is relatively blank, so you could just imprint them on it-. In fact, that should allow you to draw more power into Minosyss."

"I didn't know that."

"N.E.M.O. has a number of magicians in its employ who could assist your study, even without an alliance."

"No party to the war who knew they were here would believe that."

"Then I should be able to find people not a party to the conflict who could help."

"If the Reach have been fighting Grayven, do you think that they have learned to detect boom tubes?"

"Um. Within their own territory? Probably. They give off plenty of gravitational waves that can be detected. Here?"

I have the ring open a map of the region inside my mind.

"I… Doubt it, unless they've got equipment specifically designed to pick it up pointed this way that we haven't detected. On the other hand, I didn't know about their system bottling technique."

"If the thaumosphere comes alive, we will be able to defend this world from any force that Grayven or the Reach will be able to spare. And we will be able to improve this world far more easily than we can now."

"As… Far as I can work out… Even if you don't get exactly what you want, using the seeds in that way should improve your position."

"Are you willing to review our work?"

"I am, but I'm not a practitioner. I can't do much more than confirm that it could work."

"What of the Ophidian?"

"I… Think we'd be able to tell whether it was likely to work in more detail, but the Ophidian has a strong presence herself. We might throw things off just by being there."

"Or you might make it stronger."

A-ah…

"You're really getting to the limit of what I'm competent to comment on. I think that could happen, but I also think it would cause the entire thaumosphere to become Ophidian-flavoured. And Grayven will almost certainly be able to feel that. His flagship's main gun makes an excellent ground-strike weapon."

"Still, I would like you to give me your opinion."

"Alright, I'll do what I can. Where do you want me?"

"Go to the ship."

I fly across the city and up towards the top of the tower. Gunships and a group of Ascendants in raiment that resembles New God armour fly around or wait in the air to respond to any threat as…

Thiva leads the way out of the ship, Ascendant pallbearers carrying a stone sarcophagus in solemn precession. The… Sarcophagus-.

I blink as it seems to expand in my vision, becoming… More. We feel the universe bend around-.

A pallbearer blocks my vision for a moment and I turn away. I think I can see where the stuff about gods building worlds from the remains of titans comes from. I take a moment to obscure my vision and follow on behind the convoy on foot at a respectful pace, shifting from my armour to my formal robes.

Artificially boosting a thaumosphere…

That has potential. I'm sure that there are plenty of pantheons on Earth who wouldn't mind the option to go their own way. If we assigned one to each planetoid in the system, it could really help with colonising the Sol system. Not sure what it would do for other places. Unless we could find other titan corpses? Keeping the truly malevolent ones in Tartarus doesn't seem like a sensible long term plan to me, and Zeus isn't in charge to require their use as batteries any longer. Then there's whatever was happening with that Mother Star. I still don't really understand what it was trying to show me. Does it have enough presence to serve a similar purpose?

We pass through a protective ward around the tower's exterior and then inside into the building proper. The corridor is wide and relatively long, and a cautious scan shows some very heavy duty shield generators in compartments around the walls. Personally, I'd have been inclined to build the vital equipment closer to ground level, but I suppose there might be a New God-related reason for this-.

This design.

Similar stone sarcophaguses are arrayed around the room in a circle, with a central space reserved for Rhea herself. The seeds are placed on pedestals around that bier, with Athyns himself ready to officiate as her sarcophagus is respectfully lowered into place.

We immediately feel the pull as the room becomes more real.
 
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Wow, they really WANT Rhea back eh? Probably a good use and reason to want the ophidian/OL Gestalt to weigh in on the matter.

Not exactly.

They want the New Titans back, so they're going to use Rhea's corpse to bring them back.

Rhea herself may quite possibly be permanently dead.
 
Humanity, colonising the galaxy one pantheon at a time!

Though I thought a place needed an existing thaumosphere to allow gods to exist? Even with Titan corpses, you can't boost what doesn't exist.
I think it had a thaumosphere already, but it's been a while since I read the parts with them.
 

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