With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

There is one god im the Aztec Pantheon that people should be happy about. Quetzalcoatl. Though he isn't just an Aztec god, he was worshipped through out all of Mesoamerica. If any god in that region can considered a good person, its him. Some sects of Christianity have put forward that he and Jesus are the same people, so that should tell you something.

 

Thank you, corrected.

 

https://dcanimatedmovieuniverse.fandom.com/wiki/Mictlantecuhtli

It'd be funny if this guy makes a future appearance now. Mictlantecuhtli would be good to see, even if it's just for a single chapter.

 

I don't really think I could do his comic appearence justice. His fight with the demons? In the comics it wasn't even close. They were destroyed. And that's not taking into account that when he wanted to see what sort of person John was, he time travelled around his life, killing everyone in John's vicinity.

 

Also in the comics, the holy water had no effect on Mictlantecuhtli whatsoever. John explicitly notes that while it forms an impenetrable barrier to the demons he lured to the church, as far as Mictlantecuhtli is concerned, it's just water.

 

If anyone's mentioned Aztek, I missed it, but he's the obvious one that springs to my mind if the Aztec pantheon is in play.

 

This sentence looks awkward. Either just "I don't think that I should mention that X" or "I don't think that X is really a topic for the breakfast table" works, but not together.
Or maybe it was intended as "I don't think that I should mention that X, as it is not really a topic for the breakfast table"?

With that out of the way, is this a third Paul that got personal experience with kitty titties now?

 

I mean, you have a habit of missing the obvious.

And with how many more people there are, even if they have a fraction of the world's population worshipping them it would still rival their old numbers.

And with Adom fighting the Anti-Life, there are bound to be more.

That idea Lady Liberty gave you about a pantheon cooperation.

Hmm, maybe with the Accala rising in power there's been a resurgence in old South American religions.

 

With Helios's blessing, he may actually have a chance against her.

Who were you expecting?

 

Is the colour-and-font change here intentional, and if so, what does it signify?

 

Really? never really endorsed animal sacrifice? even though the predecesor did this anually? they did, it just got less needed or they changed due to famines and stuff, it wasn't something that they just decided because now they had Jesus. Also, I think torture and killing to please god no matter the situation should count as Human Sacrifice (the witch hunts *wink**wink**nudge**nudge*)

again, this is DC's interpretation, maybe this is official for this story but in reality there was no "god of human sacrifice" Huitzilopochtli is god of passion, will, SACRIFICE, sport, feats of endurance, and most importantly the SUN. so Sacrifice, not "Human Sacrifice" like "Jesus died for us" sacrifice AND sacrifice to the gods but not just Human Sacrifice

 

Replying to Vaermina,

Because the joke he made that she is mad about mentioned it? And you can find that joke one post above the story.

Let me reiterate he Literaryly and Literally set this up years ago.

This is one of the things I love about this story, small things that are set up well in advance become relevant much later and you can trace the through line.

Yes, just as many seemingly large things get lost but, that's the trade off on a ten year old one man project.

 

Yes, It was one of the man reasons for the Epistles in the Bible, converted Jews were still use to performing sacrifices and the apostles had to explain that those were no longer needed,

Spoiler: 1Peter 2:5

1Peter 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Spoiler: Hebrews 10:1 - 4

10 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
² For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
³ But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
⁴ For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

These were sacrifices to turn the minds of the Jews to the coming redeemer, every sacrifice was specifically detailed in exacting detail of what they were to be and how they were to be killed. With the most common being The Passover lamb, or goat, which must be unblemished, one year old and male. The sacrifice had several steps to be fulfilled to match the greater sacrifice that was to come.

Spoiler: The Book of Leviticus

All of it. Seriously it's called the book of Laws.

Actually, that's exactly why the sacrifices stopped. When the Lamb of God came into the world and took on the sins of all humanity then died to bring about life everlasting the need for sacrifices in similitude ended for the true sacrifice had been done.

Spoiler: Hebrews 9:11 - 15

¹¹ But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
¹² Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
¹³ For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
¹⁴ How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
¹⁵ And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

No that is Human evil that should be condemned, and was never done at the desire of God.


All quotes are from https://www.biblegateway.com/

 

I'm sorry but you are literally ascribing history to a mythology book, the bible is not historically accuarte and as such hearsay not history. Also you are also saying that GOD didn't want us to sacrifice and if you are serious about this you are skipping the part where GOD should not enter this, because for all you know the Aztecs GOD also did not want this. this is going to be my last comment on this because the majority of people are christian and as such can be offended by this but GOD is not historical and I was arguing a historical point.

 

: instead of ;

Inconsistent, unless that's intentional.

bloodstream

Probably Sekhmet exerting some influence on her domain to keep things working as normal instead of letting the attention of people nearby get drawn to the scuffle.

 

Could this be related to the tribes in Brazil? They're out of the proper Aztec range but that's the only loosely-related change I could think of. It seems unlikely they'd have a spontaneous renaissance off-screen.

I guess if he made himself useful against the Sheeda that might work for this purpose?

 

A man named Jesus lived in the times between 1AD and 36AD.

Spoiler: Bart Erman

Bart Ehrman (a secular agnostic) wrote: "He certainly existed, as virtually every competent scholar of antiquity, Christian or non-Christian, agrees, based on certain and clear evidence." B. Ehrman, 2011 Forged: Writing in the Name of God ISBN 978-0-06-207863-6. pp. 256–257

Spoiler: Robert M. Price

Robert M. Price (a Christian atheist) who denies the existence of Jesus agrees that this perspective runs against the views of the majority of scholars: Robert M. Price "Jesus at the Vanishing Point" in The Historical Jesus: Five Views edited by James K. Beilby & Paul Rhodes Eddy, 2009 InterVarsity, ISBN 0830838686 p. 61

Spoiler: Jesus Now and Then

Jesus Now and Then by Richard A. Burridge and Graham Gould (1 April 2004) ISBN 0802809774 p. 34 "There are those who argue that Jesus is a figment of the Church's imagination, that there never was a Jesus at all. I have to say that I do not know any respectable critical scholar who says that any more. There's a lot of evidence for his existence."

He had followers that wrote to each other explaining their internal beliefs and teachings between 36AD and 100AD.

Spoiler: Historiography and Self-Definition

'After examining the texts myself, I must conclude with the majority of scholars that it is impossible to establish the dependence of Luke-Acts on the Antiquitates. What is clear is that Luke-Acts and Josephus shared some common traditions about the recent history of Palestine.', Sterling, 'Historiography and Self-Definition: Josephus, Luke-Acts, and Apologetic Historiography', Supplements to Novum Testamentum, pp. 365–366 (1992). Brill.

Spoiler: Historical reliability of the Acts of the Apostles

Historical reliability of the Acts of the Apostles Wikipedia

Spoiler: A Historical Evaluation of the Evidence for the Death of the Apostles as Martyrs for Their Faith

A Historical Evaluation of the Evidence for the Death of the Apostles as Martyrs for Their Faith this is 481 pages and is well documented on the possibility of them living and speaking to followers at that time

Leviticus is a book, and some Jews still follow what is written there including trying to resume the sacrifices stated there.

Spoiler: 2007/02/04

Shargai, Nadav; Barkat, Amiram (2007-02-04), "Court prevents groups from sacrificing live animals at Temple Mount", Haaretz, retrieved 2008-10-07

Spoiler: 2007/02/28

"Rabbis aim to renew animal sacrifices", Jerusalem Post, 2007-02-28, archived from the original on 2012-01-11, retrieved 2008-10-07

So yes the Bible is a historical record that also contains religious teachings. You can choose not accept the teachings, but not the records that are corroborated by other sources.

If you want to continue to declare it is "a mythology book" please be consistent and accept that the writings of the Aztecs on there gods are just as "mythological" and since they believed their kings were gods therefore they did not exist.

 

Thank you, corrected.

Yes. Sekhmet hit him hard enough to overwhelm his zone of control.

Thank you, corrected.

 

I don't really care about the rest of this argument, and the other guy is being a bit cringe about their points from what little I read, but this point is kind of stupid. Like, by that same logic you could argue most European monarchs didn't exist/rule because The Divine Right Of Kings was a thing based on their preferred deity "giving" them the right to rule.

Not exactly the same obviously, but if a connection to the divine, real or not, is the disqualifier for existence then, uh, we've got a bigger problem than which gods where or weren't assholes.

 

My first thought is that the Aztecs are inspired by Adom's success and are creating a new Tezumak to be their champion, and are perhaps looking to form a League of Divine Champions with Adom as a member.

Certainly lot of DC heroes that could qualify- Adom, Tezumak, Olympian, Son of Vulcan, Celestial Archer, Diana of course, Isis, Captain Thunder, Anansi, and one of the Black Condors, off the top of my head.

 

He clearly knew way back when he made the joke that pissed her off. Its not like this comes out of left field. The time for bitching about this particular bit of meta knowledge was some years back.

 

Spoiler: A short telling of the story of Sekhmet

 

That should say 'is'.

 

Huh, look at Paul learning from his past mistakes.

 

I doubt even that even many of the more Semi/Hemi/Demi Jewish sects of early Christianity did much if any animal sacrifice because the Jewish Priest hood or at least the Temple priest hood were pretty dang firm about having people sacrifice at the temple in Jerusalem or it didn't count at all. Also things like Witch Hunts, Were Wolf hunts, The 1st crusade slaughtering every man, woman, child and maybe even dog until the streets of Jerusalem literally ran with blood? That was never central to the Religion, it was rarely fully endorsed by a church, were never really formally planned out before hand and were not a regular part of the faith. Such things were more like aberrations and exceptions that are due to the dark side of human nature.
In Aztec and most other Central America Religion on the other hand blood, real human blood not wine that has been turned into blood, was a central focus of the faith with rituals being performed regularly that involved either a ruler shedding his own blood (Mayan Kings impaling their tongues and dicks with a string ray spine to bleed onto a paper that was then burned) or killing another human being, throwing women into a Cenote to please the rain god was popular and of course the Aztecs were famous for cutting out the heart of a living person.

True, a god specifically of "Human Sacrifice" is a little silly. But my point was that in DC comics Human Sacrifice is still an important part of Aztec Religion as shown by Huitzilopochtli being listed as the god of such.

 

So it's definitely as big a surprise to him as it was to us readers. And I'm not surprised the Accala are adapting to the shifting nature of the world so well. The forest is their home, after all, and their protector. Why not worship it as personified by a plant-woman?

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

Aztek? Man, there's a name I've not heard for a while. But wasn't he a plant by Lex Luthor underneath the 'secret society' trappings? And amusingly, it claims he was South American, but using the name of a Mexican/Central American culture. Mayincatec at its finest, huh?

...I bet she'd be popular in certain more extreme porn communities...

Isn't the 'removing the hearts' thing supposed to be appeasement of some cthonic deity that would destroy the world otherwise? Seems... Kinda non-negotiable.

...That you've heard of, OL. This might be something relatively recent. Or it might be a ploy by the Anti-Life-infected...

Oh, she's just naturally hot-tempered. Comes with the territory of being birthed to punish unbelievers and all that...

Which is honestly accurate. Still rude of you.

Interesting. So Adom's patrons are getting the greatest share of... Prayers? And the rest are getting some by association?

Preferably not something like catnip, OL. Perhaps an X-ionised khopesh or something?

I suppose the warm sunny glow is soothing a few aches. One more little bonus.

Go on, Kon, flash that sunny smile.

They probably had something similar to a feline. Kryptonian animals were weird.

Oh, someone's in trouble, I take it. Best to not get on your goddess' bad side, she's a killer.

Boy, regular old asshole, ain't he? Moreso than a regular cat, I mean.

Ah, the 'try it and we'll see how you taste' threat display.

...How is Wolf doing, anyway? She's smart, possibly enough for Anti-Life to affect her, isn't she?

And when it comes down to it, he submits. Yes, smart fellow.

And don't try anything outside of those orders, hmm? I suspect the boss will be displeased if they get hurt through your actions...

We can but hope. Bast/Sekhmet is a fun goddess.

Skittish for a god of the Hunt, aren't you? I guess it comes with the territory. Hunt and be hunted and all that.

...Do you want to get eaten, OL? Because I'm sure Sekhmet would oblige.

So watch your words and try not to annoy her too much. I know, that's probably difficult for you.

I don't think Mister Black there cares, Kon.

Be careful, Kon. A guy like this, he might take a mile if you offer him an inch.

And of course OL is fine with that. Because expediency and giving him what he wants is easier than negotiating.

So, then. A tour of Bubastis is in the cards, then. Hopefully the panther guy doesn't lead them on too circuitous a route, just to be an asshole. There is something of a time limit in play, after all. They should be smart enough to realise if he does take the long route about town. Then it's a matter of who knows what they need to know, and how much it will cost them...

 

figure -> figures

 

As I recall they believed it was necessary or else the sun would grow cold, go dark and likely die which I think would trigger the end of the world which was something like the 8th version of the world with each pervious one having been destroyed one way or another. Also I'm pretty sure their after life was located in/on the sun, but It's been a while since I read about that or watched a video explaining it.

Seem like a good gift for a War Goddess.

 

Demand is the wrong word, with the wrong connotations. It wasn't so much demand as need. The Aztecs had this thing where you can't get something from nothing, that even the gods were bound by. The gods maintained the world and prevented it from ending, but this was a constant task that was understandably exhausting for the gods doing it. To keep them going, human sacrifice was used to give the gods the energy they needed to keep the universe going.


Or to keep the earth from eating you.


Aztec religion was very metal that way.