Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

[Sveta08]

This is just the last chance for people to board the "I don't like Mareinette" train.

And I want to make sure the choice is there. Just in case there is something wrong and I can go "Knew it."

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... Interesting use of lantern. Never been much a fan of using it as such.


Regardless. I feel the Grail sacrament is the dangerous, unpleasant, soured thing to do. I personally feel there is a lot of interesting things that Can come from it there, but that does cloud my view. But, that aside, it both solves a problem and advances a state.

The Grail is simple. Make it such that what they want and you want are aligned. The Heart gives the patience for timing.


Oh, and something I slept on! I think Our Lady QM has adapted well. Too much number crunching there was. Too clean and precisely absolute. A few rolls omitted and a careful word by Ax and suddenly some of the thread is uncertain and hesitates. Imperfect information.

Though I do wonder! On Ax, why she didn't say.
Doubtful that it was to spare Velvet the turmoil of someone good. Velvet will think they are the best. And the worst.
Perhaps to prevent hesitancy? Goodness knows we like to try and wait for an assuredness. Perfect information in an imperfect system.
Maybe it was the lash of her tongue! Velvet won't know and will hate herself for the crime of not knowing enough. And Ax knows what it will be used for. So why not barb and hurt?

I do not know. But as she said.
"Does it matter?"


I want to say yes.
But only want to.

 

[DelightedOne]

The Colonel Sacrament had the QM saying that it would taint our epilogue, he didn't say the same for Mareinette, while it may not be what we want, i doubt that it will be completely wrong.

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The Stains also aren't stated to poison our epilogue, QM doesn't need to hold our hands and say "This might not be pleasant" for everything. And really the issue is not the epilogue at all, it is the near future and how Velvet sees Mareinette.

She was very careful to not let Velvet know about any of the many breaches of conduct she has done(getting inside the house, the ponies she has been talking to and who knows what else). A Velvet that befriends Mareinette will trust her, we have seen proof she can't be trusted, not fully.

 

[Pittauro]

The Colonel Sacrament had the QM saying that it would taint our epilogue, he didn't say the same for Mareinette, while it may not be what we want, i doubt that it will be completely wrong.

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it MIGHT taint our epilogue. has a CHANCE to.

It's very much possible that the Colonel was not a wrong choice. It was simply a risky one. It's putting faith into an higher authority we know very little of.

It's giving up a measure of agency.

It's basically the choice, if we can call it that, that Jade and Selene have done with trusting Velvet. That even if she does bad things, she has good enough reasons and they should just trust her.

 

[Rafuki22]

The Stains also aren't stated to poison our epilogue,

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They do, he was very clear about that, he just called it a win, because technically it is, being better than the worms and all that.

He also doesn't need to say that an ending achieved by making regrettable actions is...regrettable.

Also, saying that the Colonel Sacrament could poison the epilogue implies that there were ways to avoid it, with the Wolf likely being one of them.

A Velvet that befriends Mareinette will trust her, we have seen proof she can't be trusted, not fully.

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You can distrust, and be firm with, your friends, it isn't an on or off thing, Velvet is not going to swing from one extreme to another just because of Mareinette Sacrament.

Trust and friendship also go both ways.

 

[DelightedOne]

They do, he was very clear about that, he just called it a win, because technically it is, being better than the worms and all that.

He also doesn't need to say that an ending achieved by making regrettable actions is...regretabble.

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Isn't that contradicting? The Mother of Wolves is an ending, the Stains are progress to that ending. I am talking about their effect in other victories.

You can distrust, and be firm with, your friends, it isn't an on or off thing, Velvet is not going to swing from one extreme to another just because of Mareinette Sacrament.

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The point is that she doesn't know she needs to be firm with Mareinette.

And Velvet has denial of unpleasant truths basically mastered(Soft killing herself again and the Velvet's true face).

 

[Pittauro]

Also, saying that the Colonel Sacrament could poison the epilogue implies that there were ways to avoid it, with the Wolf likely being one of them.

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Not quite.

Like with Master as Cadance's alicorn child, it's an action that can't be taken back.

It's just that we don't know what the consequences of those decisions would have been.

Master could have become a future tyrant, or an enlightened Prince who adapted to Harmony.

Colonel might be a cruel despot, or a well-meaning protector, like Velvet.

We don't know. And could NOT have known until the epilogue.

That's it.

 

[Earth-Destroyer]

We don't know. And could NOT have known until the epilogue.

That's it.

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99% of quest are a struggle to get anything but a 100% chance of success to happen. Quest do to being run by votes, tend to be ultra paranoid, that will pass up 99% ultra high reward option that would last for years, for a 100% minor benefit for a single turn. . Even if the GM had not mentioned a chance of the epilogue being tainted, the Colonel option had zero chance of winning, just from the unstated chance it would.

 

[des-pair-2]

The Quarry of Yuxtabei

Location: Far, far to the east. After the earth becomes hard and dark, but before it is blanketed by the snow. There, a thrice-cursed gouge into the ground grows ever deeper, occupied by those who forgot why they still dig.

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Diamond dogs? They would fit the description.

On top of that, Axe recently reported to you that she acquired a prisoner. But when you asked her about the pony she, well, kidnapped, she looked you straight in the eye and asked "does it matter?"

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It matters to Velvet, so by extension it should've mattered to Axe. But what can Velvet do when Axe really dislikes her?

 

[Sveta08]

The point is that she doesn't know she needs to be firm with Mareinette.

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Oh I do so love talking on Marinette. And, I'm not being phesecious here. I do truly enjoy it.


But, Velvet does know.
In the same way one knows things they do not want to check. Like debt balances, or credit scores, or when the last time you called someone you loved grows too long.


Mareinette is Grail and Heart. One of, if not the last of her kind and Grail is not lust. That's something that is hard to explain when it can be so steeped in it.

Grail is a word. It is a kindness and a threat. It is the promise and fulfillment. It is soft power as much as it is respect and the things associated with it. It is a whirlwind of intention and interest and silent careful words spoken without a care. It is about and yet above such things.
Grail is the shape of power. Not in threat, not in knowledge, not in secrets, not in paths or endurance or silence or past. It is the way of the world and the body and blood.

Velvet knows she would need to be firm in the same way Salt Rope knew he had to bow.
There simply isn't a world where they don't.


For those who want a bit more Meat to that, I would offer two things we already know Velvet knows.
Mareinette held and helped knit together Velvets broken body after Copper tried to kill her.
Velvet gave motion with intention that she is still interested in Mareinette.

There are some only so many ways that can be interpreted. Only so many ways it can be understood. And it is...


Ha. Spiderhellian put it perhaps best, and it has lodged itself in my brain.

Perhaps her host, too, esteemed desire, more than she esteemed the cage that so often surrounds it. Perhaps she respected it, as a lion-tamer respects a lion, or a tornado-chaser respects a storm. Perhaps she knows the oenophile always at least samples a vintage, trying a drop and a sniff, before rejecting it out of turn.

Perhaps not. Perhaps, instead, it was merely out of respect for Her. Thankfully, there is little difference between the two.

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Velvet knows.
I do not know whether to taint that with Lantern or Grail. Ha! Or perhaps Knock is more appropriate? Quite likely in fact...
Velvet knows because she does, because that's the way of this. She has made overtures such that Mareinette has felt them. Mareinette then too has matched her beat.

Such a gracious dance partner.

Why then, be troubled by the dance?

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

I am troubled by any dance that culminates in cannibalizing one's own child.

 

[Sveta08]

I am troubled by any dance that culminates in cannibalizing one's own child.

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Ha-ha!
Oh perhaps I should write then later! So much worry... Ah, but I need to see a hint more of Smiles first. Blasted...
So much to do. So little time!

I am not worried for that. For reasons I will not explain.

 

[Rafuki22]

I am troubled by any dance that culminates in cannibalizing one's own child.

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That will never happen, any option that would put Velvet family in danger, let alone death, is a foregone conclusion.

And no amont of Grail would convince Velvet of that, so i think that worrying specifically about that is misplaced paranoia.

 

[DelightedOne]

Sometimes I wonder why some people are so easily ensnared... then I remember they like it.


Torments, punishments and more have no power to bar the way to the eternal chase.

No matter how much they bleed, how much they lose, they can't stop. Won't stop.


Throw it away, spend it, burn it even. Whatever the sacrifice is, you know it will be fun.


Just don't be disappointed when the consequences come knocking.

*Ahem*

It is not as if we should want to antagonize Mareinette but it would do well to remember that no matter what, she is a monster playing guest. A mutual separation while on friendly terms is still a good choice, even if it is not the most beneficial.

 

[spiderhellian]

Aragallop: Gentleponies, we do not stop 'til 4 Sacraments.
Pippony: What about Mareinette squabble?
Aragallop: You've already had it. You considered sending her to a Lore 0 Alicorn!
Pippony: We've had one, yes. What about second Marienette squabble?
Aragallop: You've had that, too. There was a whole turn planning vote.
Pippony: ...What about third Mareinette squabble?
[Aragallop turns and walks away]
Merry: I don't think the thread could use a third Mareinette squabble, Pip.
Pippony: What about Mareinette quarrel? Mareinette row? Mareinette disagreement? Mareinette bickering? Mareinette dispute? The thread could use them, couldn't it?
Merry: I wouldn't count on it.

 

[Sveta08]

-snip

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Ha! I try to not repeat myself too often, but!

Conflict is an eternal thing. The shape of it is all that changes.

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[Mage_of_Eyes]

It is not as if we should want to antagonize Mareinette but it would do well to remember that no matter what, she is a monster playing guest. A mutual separation while on friendly terms is still a good choice, even if it is not the most beneficial.

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Oh, but her demands will grow by the day. If we do not befriend her, there shall come a time when we can't afford to renew her contract.

Although it does seem like the end of the game is growing near.

 

[spiderhellian]

On another note, I'm so sad that there's very few circumstances where it's worth it for Velvet to go on Expeditions. Maybe an argument could be made for one of the Short expeditions, though those are also where Axe + ? tends to smash it. But the AP costs are quite prohibitive otherwise... But these seem so cool, and I'm sad we'll read about them in reports rather than as a proper adventure.

I wonder given that Axe is the Expedition Name, if the Silver Key is (mostly) relevant on expeditions, the exact thing that we're ~never going to prospectively send Velvet on to find out

 

[Pittauro]

On another note, I'm so sad that there's very few circumstances where it's worth it for Velvet to go on Expeditions. Maybe an argument could be made for one of the Short expeditions, though those are also where Axe + ? tends to smash it. But the AP costs are quite prohibitive otherwise...

I wonder given that Axe is the Expedition Name, if the Silver Key is (mostly) relevant on expeditions, the exact thing that we're ~never going to prospectively send Velvet on to find out

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Velvet on expeditions would be more doable if we could allow Followers to lead, saving Velvet an action.

2 actions to send Velvet on one of the Long expeditions would be viable. 3 is asking for a lot.

@OurLadyOfWires I don't suppose you'd allow that?

 

[DelightedOne]

Oh, but her demands will grow by the day. If we do not befriend her, there shall come a time when we can't afford to renew her contract.

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And that is where the "mutual separation while on friendly terms" comes to play. We did get Word of Bird a while back that the more rebindings the more amenable to us she will be if we end the contract(or something like that).

3 rebindings sound good enough. It would be easier if we had let her hang out with Cadance but it is still possible. I am very willing to just give her freedom every time she asks.

 

[OurLadyOfWires]

@OurLadyOfWires since they're both Long and Important, would it be possible to have a pre-turn vote before T23 regarding scouting out the locations? Since otherwise the expedition planning might get a bit. Uh. Messy.

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I was thinking of the same thing. We will need an in-between-turns vote to decide on several preliminary things ("All In?" / "Moods of Mareinette?" / "Mareinette rebinding/promise?"), so throwing in a preparatory check for the expedition was also in my books.

So please remind me of that if I happen to forget when the time comes.

In a defense situation, the target of Biedde receives Objective: Survive and hopes that Smiles can get to them in time. In case Selene defends, a risky play is for her to aim to inflict an initial wound and then attempt to disengage and have Smiles come in.

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This sounds about right.

Just don't underestimate Smiles' hate, even to the extent he might throw your plans out the window if he is directly involved.
Remember that in the Exiled endings, one of them would have regretted their end, while the other would not. It has always been the case that the Colonel tends to weaponize his hate for the sake of his duty ("I will come back for this"), while the Lionsmith tends to follow his passions ("Oh Hated Foe").
Think of it as you will. But never forget that, narratively, Biedde always had the option to kill Silky before he left, and that he chose not to because he is an intelligent actor.
Can you say the same of his polar opposite?

Soft Sweeps is having fun with her minion friend

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Oh, that was Cantrip. Her unicorn friend. Whacky Amor is an earth pony.

Velvet on expeditions would be more doable if we could allow Followers to lead, saving Velvet an action.

2 actions to send Velvet on one of the Long expeditions would be viable. 3 is asking for a lot.

@OurLadyOfWires I don't suppose you'd allow that?

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No.

Minions have the same twenty-four hours on a day as Velvet does, and yet they only net you one Follower Action. Velvet has a (theoretical) total of eight action points per month. So, they are weighted differently.

Minions need to spend X action points to go on certain expeditions because that is a proportion to how much they give you. Velvet needs to spend Y action points because that is a commitment of a percentage of the absolute total of time she has during a month.



I don't see any other pings, or anything else I feel like commenting on. So, I hope you are all doing well.

 

[ses]

Mareinette teasing Silky about the Silky/Cherry Coat ship was hilarious. Doubly so because she knows perfectly well what happened and is misunderstanding on purpose to embarrass Silky. Reminded me of that omake about Mareinette filling in as Commissioner and teasing Shining.

 

[Thamuzz]

What is Silky's cutie mark? Can't find the update it debuted in. Just recall that it was very lore coded.

 

[ses]

What is Silky's cutie mark? Can't find the update it debuted in. Just recall that it was very lore coded.

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A scroll and key in front of the Mansus as background, framed in a laurel wreath colored in the Lores

 

[Sveta08]

What is Silky's cutie mark? Can't find the update it debuted in. Just recall that it was very lore coded.

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The Sister and the Ax.

I highly recommend rereading it if you have the time.

 

[Arrkhon]

GUYS
I CRACKED THE CODE
THE GLORY HAS BLINDED US TO THE TRUTH RIGHT IN FRONT OF US
In order to help Celestia out we merely need to ask her if we could bring our Silky to see her!
As a creature of Lores, be it may in part only, she would be susceptible to Silky's special talent in mollifying murderous monsters! It's flawless!
QM has led us astray as well, Velvet may have been the closest to the Glory victory but Silky was right here all along, integrating the horrors we brought along right under our noses

 

[Pittauro]

no, wait, that's genius!

Reveal our full involvement in the Cult while using Silky and Selene as a shield. There's no way that won't work!

 

[Quaxotia]

What is the thread's current stance on Windy Flakes? By now we're aware of the danger of leaving known unknowns unattended, though is there enough time remaining for his plans to interfere with ours and do we have the actions to care? He could conceivably summon Biedde now that we've let go of the reins. I can't tell if his Wolf influence would make him more or less likely to oppose us.

For Biedde's fledgling edge cult, their ability to summon him would be contingent on first finding him in the Mansus, correct? Even if he gives bonus favor to their ritual. And is the 3 month cooldown for resummoning a Name a global thing or only for the original summoner?

Since Ash serves as a barrier to others entering the Mansus, I wonder if we can now instruct it to additionally focus more attacks on those who smell of the Colonel.

 

[DelightedOne]

What is the thread's current stance on Windy Flakes?

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The curent stance seems to be "Leave him alone", mostly because of the many other uses for AP(like tracking Neighnia).

For Biedde's fledgling edge cult, their ability to summon him would be contingent on first finding him in the Mansus, correct? Even if he gives bonus favor to their ritual. And is the 3 month cooldown for resummoning a Name a global thing or only for the original summoner?

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No. He would be able to tell his ritual to anyone he wanted to while in the Wake, so if he did that in preparation for a possible betrayal then anypony that knows it could call him even without climbing.

Summoning rituals are like phone numbers, if you know it and can pay to call the summon you have a chance like everyone else.

Cooldown is global. But Biedde might not abide by it now.

Since Ash serves as a barrier to others entering the Mansus, I wonder if we can now instruct it to additionally focus more attacks on those who smell of the Colonel.

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We could try, but closest we have to that is the Feast option and it is more "bother everyone else" than "go after this target".

It is better if you ask Bird directly if you are seriously considering it.

Huh, we could get Ash on Windy if we wanted to. Assuming we have a reason to use a regular Velvet AP to climb. Maybe after Baldomare's Sacrament? that way we get a Scrap in The Tower.

 

[Pittauro]

The curent stance seems to be "Leave him alone", mostly because of the many other uses for AP(like tracking Neighnia).

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Basically this.

leaving him alone MIGHT very well explode in our faces, but our main focus has been, rightly or wrongly, on strenghtening ourselves. Presumably We're outgrowing him, so even if he ends up becoming a problem, in-between the Bureau and our own growing personal power he should be viable to deal with.

And if we're lucky maybe he's not doing anything we'll have problems with, though that's admittedly unlikely.

No. He would be able to tell his ritual to anyone he wanted to while in the Wake, so if he did that in preparation for a possible betrayal then anypony that knows it could call him even without climbing.

Summoning rituals are like phone numbers, if you know it and can pay to call the summon you have a chance like everyone else.

Cooldown is global. But Biedde might not abide by it now.

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We could potentially try and scry for "Biedde's assets in the Wake" or something like that, I suppose. Not sure if we want to when we have so many other things to work on right now.

 

[spiderhellian]

What is the thread's current stance on Windy Flakes? By now we're aware of the danger of leaving known unknowns unattended, though is there enough time remaining for his plans to interfere with ours and do we have the actions to care? He could conceivably summon Biedde now that we've let go of the reins. I can't tell if his Wolf influence would make him more or less likely to oppose us.

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Windy is the world's second most lore-steeped pony who has been up to a Wolf-inflected plan for years.

He is almost certainly a very pressing threat to Equestria, and I would not be surprised if one of these turns we wake up to a city buried in Windigoes (or something much worse). He seems more threatening than Biedde, not least because he's Biedde's most likely next summoner.

His one "virtue", to my eyes, is that he is much more likely a threat to Equestria than a threat to us. That's a little being optimistic, but we were not on bad terms/enemies in the way Velvet was with Copper. He doesn't know we killed the Master, we could have infiltrated the Lunar Bureau all as part of the game... He is likely to bury a city in Windigoes, I think he is much less likely to send them after us.

That said, I really think we should send Luna to at least spy/make contact with him in his dreams. Or put the Lunar Bureau on his tail.

He is an incredibly obvious threat. And while we want to focus on winning, not not-Losing, I think there are some pretty low-cost ways we could at least try to figure out what he's up to.