With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Duke Long · Thursday at 4:51 PM

CrazyNoVa said:
Two, you forget that when someone succumbs to the Orange light, they tend to act both very irrational and antisocial, meaning that any affected Dominator wouldn't give a damn about social norms or caste stuff and all that, and they'd go crazy on EVERYONE.

Eh, wasn't it mentioned that they don't really have desires outside of the caste structure? I figure orange light madness is supercharging antisocial desires, so if dominators don't have significant antisocial desires they won't be nearly as problematic when mad. Also I think the Dominion is good enough at killing Lanterns that it wouldn't be a massive problem for them unless you sent a lot of orange rings. It is an interesting idea though.

CrazyNoVa · Thursday at 5:02 PM

Duke Long said:
Eh, wasn't it mentioned that they don't really have desires outside of the caste structure? I figure orange light madness is supercharging antisocial desires, so if dominators don't have significant antisocial desires they won't be nearly as problematic when mad. Also I think the Dominion is good enough at killing Lanterns that it wouldn't be a massive problem for them unless you sent a lot of orange rings. It is an interesting idea though.

Fair point, although the element of surprise and ensuing chaos would definitely give the orange Dominators a massive advantage over the regular Dominators.

Also, do they have a proper defense against assimilation? Because if the mad Dominators start assimilating other Dominators, then....

CTrees · Thursday at 5:43 PM

PDV said:
Dominators seem like someone's science project that got loose. Report the information to your creators, eventually, but they've disappeared.

That's a neat idea. Maybe a little too close to the origins of the Psions, but if the Dominators were seeded into the galaxy/universe by some other entity as basically autonomous, biological, von Neuman research probes? "Collect all the data you can on this weird galaxy so we can review it later?" Has potential in multiple directions. Like, what if their original masters are dead or overthrown? Or what happens when they come back to recieve the research results?

Duke Long · Thursday at 10:54 PM

CTrees said:
That's a neat idea. Maybe a little too close to the origins of the Psions, but if the Dominators were seeded into the galaxy/universe by some other entity as basically autonomous, biological, von Neuman research probes? "Collect all the data you can on this weird galaxy so we can review it later?" Has potential in multiple directions. Like, what if their original masters are dead or overthrown? Or what happens when they come back to recieve the research results?

I was going to say that they feel too much like natural people to me (specifically I think of the bit about how high caste dominators enjoy evil science in particular, they aren't just indifferent to suffering, which seems unnecessary in a science drone species) but I suppose it's possible some stuff like that could be added in by the designers to better disguise them as a natural species that extensively modified itself.

Mr Zoat · 2026-01-09T06:15:23+0000

15th August 2013
19:45 GMT -7

Prime Minister Geoffrey Talbot lands on the forecourt of Sunset and Circe's school, the police car construct he was flying in fading around him as he stands up. He takes in the surroundings for a moment, straightens his jacket, and then nods to me. "Grayven."

I smile warmly. "Geoffrey." I step forwards and offer him my right hand. "Thank you for coming."

He shakes it, eyes scanning our surroundings suspiciously. "Not the sort of place I expected."

"I didn't think you'd want to meet up this quickly. The Bilderberg Hotel didn't have any rooms I could rent out at short notice." I shrug. "And if anyone asks, we can say that you were meeting with the staff to talk about sending some of your own police to study here. Which you should do anyway."

"Doesn't Constantine teach here?"

Does Constantine teach here… Like he could be reliable enough to hold something like a class. "Irregularly, yes. But I'm almost completely sure that he's not here now. Is..? That going to be a problem?"

"Not as long as he's not part of this Star Chamber of yours."

"Huh-heh-hahhaha… Urh… Bless you, no, bless you, no. But it's the sort of thing he might hang around and get in the way of."

Scan… No one, good. I raise my right hand and fabricate a small table. Upon the table I create a pile of boxes of Silk Cuts, several bottles of ale and a sign saying 'Free cigarettes and alcohol.'.

"That should do it." I start towards the front door, Geoffrey matching my pace.

"It can't be that easy."

"I added some of the old wacky backy to the cigarettes, and scumble to the ale. Enough to disrupt his judgement. Otherwise, tomorrow's classes are going to be jolly interesting."

He snorts as we enter the building, the lights still on in the direction of the staff room. A few moments pass before he asks:

"Why am I here, Grayven?"

"Short version? We're a little worried that something might happen to render the human species extinct, and we'd like to set up humanity's first off-world colony."

"You have a space fleet and those boom tube things. And a Lantern Corps."

"Oh, I gave the Lantern Corps to my former second in command. He was basically running it anyway. They're busy setting Vega to rights and undoing centuries of degradation. Besides, part of our thing is to use human resources exclusively."

He raises his right fist, ring glowing balefully. "This isn't human technology."

"No, but the office of Prime Minister of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is. The ring just lets you survive when someone tries to stop you. Anyway." I push the staff room door open. "Hello, everyone!"

Clea has completely failed to dress down, though at least she's left the crown at home. And from the way she's glancing at Circe's school teacher/farmer's wife combo she knows it too. Adom is clearly uncomfortable in slacks and a short sleeved shirt, but he has managed to remain on the ground, which is major progress. Richard has rearranged his shadows to something that a nutty Victorian professor might wear, and Cranius is… In a lab coat. Lex is using a television straight from my old primary school, big blocky design and cathode ray screen.

"Grayven!" Richard waves. "It's been a while since my last fancy dress party. Who are you supposed to be?"

My armour vanishes, replaced by a tweed suit. "My Dad; the human one. He taught biology." I step aside and allow Geoffrey to see what he's letting himself in for. "Geoffrey, I believe you know-."

"The Shade, yes. And Doctor von Schadel. I was concerned about Mister Fiendstein, but since I haven't heard anything about him returning to crime I assume that you've got him under control."

"Yah, yah. He just needed to heff his… Energies… Directed properly. He is a wonderful chirurgeon."

"I'll take your word for it. Teth Adom."

"Red Lantern."

Geoffrey doesn't seem entirely happy about being addressed like that, but shrugs it off. It's not like he can deny it, after all.

"Professor Larissa."

"Oh, please." She smiles, leaning slightly against Adom in the hope that he'll unclench slightly. "Call me-" Her clothing shimmers and shifts into something more Grecian. "-Circe."

"The witch who turns men into farm animals."

"I gave that up. I'm a happily married woman."

Geoffrey observes her with Adom for a moment. Likewise, Circe considers her husband, then pokes him until he awkwardly wraps an arm around her.

"I see. And, you, madam? I'm afraid that I don't-."

Clea gurns in mock-distress. "Why am I the only one he doesn't recognise!"

I give her a flat look. "Sixty years of isolationism."

"Apart from that!"

I gesture to her with my right hand. "Queen Clea of Venturia."

He looks blank. "Is that in Eastern Europe?"

I'm not sure that it's mock anymore. "No, it's in Atlantis!"

"Ah. I'm sorry, we don't have much to do with Atlantis."

"And that's one of the things I joined this little group to fix." She shakes her head in irritation. "Honestly."

Then the screen moves, and Geoffrey starts slightly. "He did not recognise me, either."

"And you are..?"

"Ah." I raise my right hand for a moment. "Just curious. Has anyone not worked out-?"

"Lex Luthor." / "Alexander Luthor." / "Luthor." / "Mister Luthor." / "Luthor, naturally." / "Lex."

BOOM!

The portal opens, creating a passage from his office to this staff room. "You may as well come through. The thing about working with intelligent people is that they occasionally work out inconvenient things."

A moment passes, and Lex walks through the boom tube, dressed in what looks like a rather expensive business suit.

Circe shakes her head. "This was supposed to be a dress down meeting, Lex."

For a moment, he hesitates. Then he manages what looks nearly like a natural smile. "I didn't expect to attend in person, and didn't leave time to change. Geoffrey, I'm glad to have you with us."

"I wouldn't go that far yet." I gesture to the seating, and everyone takes their places. "Explain to me exactly what I'm supposed to be joining."

Zig · 2026-01-09T06:32:23+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"My Dad; the human one. He taught biology."

He's being rather cavalier about this considering he used to force himself to even think of Darkseid as his father.

Breadnaught · 2026-01-09T06:40:07+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"I wouldn't go that far yet." I gesture to the seating, and everyone takes their places. "Explain to me exactly what I'm suppose to be joining."

"You know all those times a group of wealthy and powerful individuals decide they know best, then get together in a secret cabal to steer the course of world events?"

"Of bloody course. And this one won't turn out like every other such group?"

"We haven't yet, at least. Wanna join before we get too far up our own asses and still do some actual good for the world?"

DAT_NOOB · 2026-01-09T06:56:13+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"Lex Luthor." / "Alexander Luthor." / "Luthor." / "Mister Luthor." / "Luthor, naturally." / "Lex."

I wonder how long ago they worked it out

Chojin Patriarch · 2026-01-09T06:59:11+0000

Mr Zoat said:
15th August 2013
19:45 GMT -7

Prime Minister Geoffrey Talbot lands on the forecourt of Sunset and Circe's school, the police car construct he was flying in fading around him as he stands up. He takes in the surroundings for a moment, straightens his jacket, and then nods to me. "Grayven."

I smile warmly. "Geoffrey." I step forwards and offer him my right hand. "Thank you for coming."

Ah, the Renegade. And Geoffrey Talbot, meeting his associate's little management group for the first time. Though I find it amusing he rides about in what I can't help but imagine is a flying, monochrome panda car. More likely a 'Jam Butty' though

He shakes it, eyes scanning our surroundings suspiciously. "Not the sort of place I expected."

"I didn't think you'd want to meet up this quickly. The Bilderberg Hotel didn't have any rooms I could rent out at short notice." I shrug. "And if anyone asks, we can say that you were meeting with the staff to talk about sending some of your own police to study here. Which you should do anyway."

Given the prestige of the place, I imagine it's regularly booked out months in advance... The hotel, not the school.

"Doesn't Constantine teach here?"

Does Constantine teach here… Like he could be reliable enough to hold something like a class. "Irregularly, yes. But I'm almost completely sure that he's not here now. Is..? That going to be a problem?"

Since we know Geoff has been at odds with Johnny-boy before in his comics appearances. Not many happy memories shared there.

"Not as long as he's not part of this Star Chamber of yours."

"Huh-heh-hahhaha… Urh… Bless you, no, bless you, no. But it's the sort of thing he might hang around and get in the way of."

Constantine's got a bit of a 'I wouldn't become a member of any club what would have me as a member' vibe to him.

Scan… No one, good. I raise my right hand and fabricate a small table. Upon the table I create a pile of boxes of Silk Cuts, several bottles of ale and a sign saying 'Free cigarettes and alcohol.'.

"That should do it." I start towards the front door, Geoffrey matching my pace.

Baiting a distraction, eh? Except if John is watching, he'll know it's a distraction. But on the other hand... Free ciggies and beer?

"It can't be that easy."

"I added some of the old wacky backy to the cigarettes, and scumble to the ale. Enough to disrupt his judgement. Otherwise, tomorrow's classes are going to be jolly interesting."

I don't think he'll appreciate the hangover from all that, but the Renegade can deal with a grumpy Constantine. Better than dealing with a curious one.

He snorts as we enter the building, the lights still on in the direction of the staff room. A few moments pass before he asks:

"Why am I here, Grayven?"

Tempted as I am to quote the first episode of 'Red Vs Blue'... Isn't it obvious? Or are you referring to what role you'll be playing in said group?

"Short version? We're a little worried that something might happen to render the human species extinct, and we'd like to set up humanity's first off-world colony."

"You have a space fleet and those boom tube things. And a Lantern Corps."

No, not an uplifted colony using alien technology. Human technology, schizophrenic as Earth's tech level is...

"Oh, I gave the Lantern Corps to my former second in command. He was basically running it anyway. They're busy setting Vega to rights and undoing centuries of degradation. Besides, part of our thing is to use human resources exclusively."

He raises his right fist, ring glowing balefully. "This isn't human technology."

Oh, I can't wait to see how badly that bites him in the ass someday...

"No, but the office of Prime Minister of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is. The ring just lets you survive when someone tries to stop you. Anyway." I push the staff room door open. "Hello, everyone!"

Plus he has enough common sense to smack any super-villainous ideas some of them might put forwards out of their heads.

Clea has completely failed to dress down, though at least she's left the crown at home. And from the way she's glancing at Circe's school teacher/farmer's wife combo she knows it too. Adom is clearly uncomfortable in slacks and a short sleeved shirt, but he has managed to remain on the ground, which is major progress. Richard has rearranged his shadows to something that a nutty Victorian professor might wear, and Cranius is… In a lab coat. Lex is using a television straight from my old primary school, big blocky design and cathode ray screen.

Oh god, the Shade's totally cosplaying a Doctor, isn't he? I wouldn't put him past it. At least most of the New Light get how to dress down.

"Grayven!" Richard waves. "It's been a while since my last fancy dress party. Who are you supposed to be?"

My armour vanishes, replaced by a tweed suit. "My Dad; the human one. He taught biology." I step aside and allow Geoffrey to see what he's letting himself in for. "Geoffrey, I believe you know-."

And before people complain, he's made no secret that this 'Grayven' was reborn and raised in an alternate universe as a human, for reasons.

"The Shade, yes. And Doctor von Schadel. I was concerned about Mister Fiendstein, but since I haven't heard anything about him returning to crime I assume that you've got him under control."

"Yah, yah. He just needed to heff his… Energies… Directed properly. He is a wonderful chirurgeon."

An old 'Albion' character, for reference. Bit of a ~~mad~~ scientist, then.

"I'll take your word for it. Teth Adom."

"Red Lantern."

Hey, now. No-one else is using people's 'made-up names'.

Geoffrey doesn't seem entirely happy about being addressed like that, but shrugs it off. It's not like he can deny it, after all.

"Professor Larissa."

"Oh, please." She smiles, leaning slightly against Adom in the hope that he'll unclench slightly. "Call me-" He clothing shimmers and shifts into something more Grecian. "-Circe."

A clever pun there, as 'Larissa' is a city in the Thessaly region. Fitting for a Hellenic sorceress.

"The witch who turns men into farm animals."

"I gave that up. I'm a happily married woman."

Still amazed at that. Pity it prevents Isis and Osiris, but given their typical comics fate, maybe for the best.

Geoffrey observes her with Adom for a moment. Likewise, Circe considers her husband, then pokes him until he awkwardly wraps an arm around her.

"I see. And, you, madam? I'm afraid that I don't-."

Heh, Adom's not exactly a man used to making public displays of affection. Suppose they weren't really a thing in his time.

Clea gurns in mock-distress. "Why am I the only one he doesn't recognise!"

I give her a flat look. "Sixty years of isolationism."

And she is looking a lot younger than she used to anyway.

"Apart from that!"

I gesture to her with my right hand. "Queen Clea of Venturia."

Everyone remembers her, right? Former Wonder Woman villain from the forties? The Renegade recruited her by going to her for trade with the Atlanteans. And rejuvenations as a bonus.

He looks blank. "Is that in Eastern Europe?"

I'm not sure that it's mock anymore. "No, it's in Atlantis!"

I see she's feeling youthful today for sure, with that temper.

"Ah. I'm sorry, we don't have much to do with Atlantis."

"And that's one of the things I joined this little group to fix." She shakes her head in irritation. "Honestly."

Patience. Rome wasn't built in a day nor will the Renegade's new empire be.

Then the screen moves, and Geoffrey starts slightly. "He did not recognise me, either."

"And you are..?"

Lex, that's because you're doing the 'obscured identity' thing like a chuuni.

"Ah." I raise my right hand for a moment. "Just curious. Has anyone not worked out-?"

"Lex Luthor." / "Alexander Luthor." / "Luthor." / "Mister Luthor." / "Luthor, naturally." / "Lex."

Good to see it fooled exactly no-one in the group.

BOOM!

The portal opens, creating a passage from his office to this staff room. "You may as well come through. The thing about working with intelligent people is that they occasionally work out inconvenient things."

Of course, it's quite a step up from his prior associates. Intelligent, sure, maybe some were but so, so foolish at the same time.

A moment passes, and Lex walks through the boom tube, dressed is what looks like a rather expensive business suit.

Circe shakes her head. "This was supposed to be a dress down meeting, Lex."

I get the feeling Lex is incapable of anything so mundane as 'dressing down'. Wouldn't be surprised if the suit had multiple high-tech defences built-in, though.

For a moment, he hesitates. Then he manages what looks nearly like a natural smile. "I didn't expect to attend in person, and didn't leave time to change. Geoffrey, I'm glad to have you with us."

"I wouldn't go that far yet." I gesture to the seating, and everyone takes their places. "Explain to me exactly what I'm suppose to be joining."

I can't see him turning the offer down, if only to keep an eye on them.

And so the New Light gains a new member. Well, most likely he'll agree. Just the economic benefits alone might well get him re-elected. And he's canny enough to know the Renegade will probably treat him as a second voice of reason, given he knows each member as a super-villain (or suspected, in Lex's case.) Good luck to him.

Stsword · 2026-01-09T07:14:59+0000

Duke Long said:
Do we know what the actual goal of the Dominion is as a civilisation? They gather a lot of data but it's not really clear to me whether they value that in itself or if they just want to expand their capabilities to support universal conquest or alien extermination or whatever.

In the comics, their biological sciences are for practical conquest.

They've made Daxamite/Dominion hybrids that are stronger than normal Daxamites (Might just be they didn't have the lead allergy, it's been a while since I read that LoSH issue).

A Dominator studied the comet that gave Captain Comet his psychic powers to gain his own psychic abilities.

They turned Computo into Bion, an android that had the collective powers of the Legion of Superheroes.

They even, after studying the metagene of humanity, produced Super-Dominators with apparently great but unspecified superpowers. Rather than allow the Dominators to start conquering with their new superpowers, someone banished the Dominator planet to another dimension.

AmericanNumbers · 2026-01-09T07:31:33+0000

Zig said:
He's being rather cavalier about this considering he used to force himself to even think of Darkseid as his father.

Because he effectively combined with the other Grayven so whatever doubt there was about who the true Grayven was is merely academic now.

BR549 · 2026-01-09T08:18:02+0000

Chojin Patriarch said:
Oh god, the Shade's totally cosplaying a Doctor, isn't he?

Third Doctor, I'd wager.

Certainly not the Sixth.

Duke Long · 2026-01-09T08:59:55+0000

Mr Zoat said:
A moment passes, and Lex walks through the boom tube, dressed is what looks like a rather expensive business suit."

'in'
Extraneous speech mark.

Mr Zoat said:
"I wouldn't go that far yet." I gesture to the seating, and everyone takes their places. "Explain to me exactly what I'm suppose to be joining."

'supposed'

Vaermina · 2026-01-09T10:01:47+0000

Zig said:
He's being rather cavalier about this considering he used to force himself to even think of Darkseid as his father.

That was Renagade, this is Grayven who thinks he is Renegade because of arrowholes in his soul.

Mr Zoat · 2026-01-09T13:21:13+0000

Duke Long said:
'in'
Extraneous speech mark.
'supposed'

Thank you, corrected.

Radix · 2026-01-09T14:22:50+0000

Zig said:
He's being rather cavalier about this considering he used to force himself to even think of Darkseid as his father.

His story is that Grayven escaped and lived life as a human in another universe before showing back up in Earth 16.R.

The fact that he specifies human father still alludes to Darkseid being his Apokaliptan father.

boo600 · 2026-01-09T14:31:18+0000

BR549 said:
Third Doctor, I'd wager.

Certainly not the Sixth.

It can't be cosplay; one of the first chapters of WTR has Paul talking with Megan about how Doctor Who doesn't exist in this reality.

Which means he escaped before the poor show caught fire, but he also missed some fantastic stuff.

Still, it's chugging along, and Ncuti Gatwa was good. And Jodie Whitaker was a good actress, she just got handed the worst scripts. And the Timeless Child nonsense, sadly.

Ardy · 2026-01-09T14:55:05+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"I gave that up. I'm a happily married woman.

When did this happen? It would have been hilarious to see!

I know they've been dating for a while but...

FuzzyZergling · 2026-01-09T14:55:37+0000

Mr Zoat said:
He clothing shimmers and shifts into something more Grecian.

Her clothing

Mr Zoat · 2026-01-09T15:27:49+0000

boo600 said:
Still, it's chugging along, and Ncuti Gatwa was good. And Jodie Whitaker was a good actress, she just got handed the worst scripts. And the Timeless Child nonsense, sadly.

Huh. I've been calling him Shooty Gatwa this whole time.

You are of course entitled to your personal taste on the quality. I gave up after Moon Egg and the Poo Daleks.

FuzzyZergling said:
Her clothing

Thank you, corrected.

Prince Charon · 2026-01-10T04:34:55+0000

Mr Zoat said:
Huh. I've been calling him Shooty Gatwa this whole time.

His first name is apparently pronounced 'Shooty,' but spelled 'Ncuti.' I blame British linguists. I don't think I've seen him in anything, though, and I gave up on nuWho partway through Jodie Whitaker's first series.

Mr Zoat · 2026-01-10T08:12:02+0000

15th August 2013
20:39 GMT -7

"Hm."

Geoffrey has taken a glug from one of the ale bottles and is contemplating the flavour. Since there's no John Constantine passed out underneath the table, it seems that the bait was unsuccessful. Somewhere behind me I feel the brief tug as Circe sends everyone home.

"So?" He looks around, face indicating deep thought. "Good? Bad?"

"Luthor."

"Did you ever get a full briefing on what the Light did?"

"Do you know how many children died?"

"Yes, of course I do. Why do you think I killed the people responsible?"

"Except Luthor."

"He had no direct input into that. All he knew was that Klarion would be creating a distraction while Mister Crock stole the Star Conqueror sample. And while I do take issue with him signing up with a team containing Klarion in the first place, him deciding not to wouldn't have stopped Klarion doing it."

"And the rest?"

"Mind controlling the Justice League highlighted a rather important flaw in their security, and we were able to deal with it before too much time had passed. He voted against unleashing the King of Tears, and I killed the others before they could follow through."

"Fine. What about what you're doing now?"

"Kahndaq was a brutal shithole, and now it's… Alright, and getting better. Venturia's experiencing an economic revival and an improved relationship with the rest of Atlantis. Uncorporation is now offering a range of services which are actually useful to people…"

"Africa. Looks colonial."

"Y-es? I mean, technically, the genomorphs are colonising the place, and they're not really interested in becoming citizens of pre-existing countries. On the other hand, if you'd like to look at the reports on local standards of… Everything, then I'm sure that you'll see that they've done the world of good."

"I already knew that. I get reports from the Commonwealth Office."

"So what's the issue?"

"What's the issue with the Prime Minister of Great Britain cooperating with the group taking over most of Africa?"

I shrug. "I understand that it's a little embarrassing that we're outperforming the Commonwealth Office with a fraction of the resources. Have you considered doing an audit?"

"The Commonwealth Office don't assassinate people."

I gesture upwards with my right hand. "And there's where you've been going wrong! It's like Batman not killing the Joker; it's amazing the number of lives you can save by murdering a logjam. Do you remember when the people of Sudan stopped murdering each other?"

"That was you, was it?"

"That was my eldest and her friends. I put them up to it, but the technique and timing were all them. And look at the results. Far less death than if no one did anything or if another country invaded. And we haven't even had to lean on the surviving government officials all that much."

"The country has effectively partitioned, but I suppose that's the best result they could have gotten."

"Well, they are next door to Kahndaq. They know perfectly well that if anyone acts up Adom might well pay them a visit. The southern tribes are in talks regarding annexation, and LexCorp is already constructing mines and oil wells in the area."

"I thought you were using cosmic converters to power everything?"

I shrug. "South Sudan had basically no infrastructure. It's easier to refine local oil and use it to fuel generators than build an actual power network to hundreds of tiny villages. We're working on it. And we still need plastics and oil-based lubricants. Besides, LexPower's global monopoly relies on us not letting cosmic converters get out of our sight. Sticking them on starships is one thing. Putting one in a random African village with no security is quite another."

"I was waiting for the other shoe to drop regarding electrical generation. I assumed Luthor would be asking for tax breaks or something of that nature. But he's already past that, isn't he? The point is to fund his fleet, and it's already doing that."

"What he wants is for people to accept cheap electricity and stop trying to bypass him when they directly benefit. He's using it to fund the stellar self-defence force that protects the Earth. That's all there is to it." … "Alright, it's also an ego boost for him too, because… Heh. I read a book… Centuries ago on my personal timeline, where a media mogul had a group of magical dragons hooked up as a transmitter array because it was cheaper than using satellites. When the hero asked him if he was planning on taking over the world, he said 'no'. Because when you own the media corporations they throw in the governments for free."

"And the raw materials are just for building starships?"

"At this point the few shareholders he doesn't control regard him as the second coming of John Rockefeller. He works very long hours and was already extremely rich. What's he going to do with the extra money that's going to meaningfully affect his quality of life? No, he wants Earth to have a self-defence fleet because this way it's not relying on Superman."

"What's wrong with Superman?"

"Lex hates him. Don't ask; it's not rational and he knows it. He feels better if the Earth is protected by a navy rather than a single man who could choke on a kryptonite fishbone tomorrow and leave the planet defenceless."

"And what about you?"

"The need to build up civilisations is built into my soul. I'll do that until my soul reunites with the Source. But in the medium term, I want help killing my father."

"Why?"

"Can I be blunt?"

"I would appreciate it."

I glance up for a moment. "Remember how it felt, when you found your wife's body?" He jerks and then goes still, jaw tensing. "My father wants to make everyone in the universe feel just like that, all of the time. Cradle to grave. Abject misery for all. He wants to alter reality so that no other state of mind is possible. And I don't know how close he is to pulling it off, but he hit me with a little of his work-in-progress a while ago and I spent a week raving in despair and trying to claw my own head off."

"How?"

"It's called the Anti-Life Equation. He speaks, and you're not exactly you any longer. That's what I want to stop, why I'm investing in Earth society rather than going somewhere else and building up from scratch." I turn back to him. "So, you on board?"

"Does he know you feel like this?"

I nod. "Probably."

"Then why hasn't he stopped you?"

I shrug disarmingly. "He can hardly crush me if I haven't built up anything to crush, can he?"

He watches me for a moment, mulling things over.

Then he nods.

"Alright then. I'm in. What do I need to do to get started?"

Darko · 2026-01-10T08:21:40+0000

Mr Zoat said:
magical dragons looked up

"hooked up"

Mr Zoat said:
while ago and I spend a week

"spent"

Mr Zoat said:
build up anything to crush,

"built"

Chojin Patriarch · 2026-01-10T08:50:59+0000

Mr Zoat said:
15th August 2013
20:39 GMT -7

"Hm."

Geoffrey has taken a glug from one of the ale bottles and is contemplating the flavour. Since there's no John Constantine passed out underneath the table, it seems that the bait was unsuccessful. Somewhere behind me I feel the brief tug as Circe sends everyone home.

I suppose a lot of the meeting was boring briefings about what each of them was doing. Only natural to skip over exposition we the audience have seen before. Though the lack of Constantine is a little worrying.If you don't know where he is, you don't know what he's up to. And that can bite everyone in the ass.

"So?" He looks around, face indicating deep thought. "Good? Bad?"

"Luthor."

A necessary evil. He has the global infrastructure to enable them to carry out their plans.

"Did you ever get a full briefing on what the Light did?"

"Do you know how many children died?"

He has the same kinds of Rings as you, Geoff. And he was involved in the resolution of it...

"Yes, of course I do. Why do you think I killed the people responsible?"

"Except Luthor."

Again, he's still useful. The rest of the old Light were defectives, to put it mildly. At least by the Renegade's standards.

"He had no direct input into that. All he knew was that Klarion would be creating a distraction while Mister Crock stole the Star Conqueror sample. And while I do take issue with him signing up with a team containing Klarion in the first place, him deciding not to wouldn't have stopped Klarion doing it."

There is that, true. Because it was funny to him.

"And the rest?"

"Mind controlling the Justice League highlighted a rather important flaw in their security, and we were able to deal with it before too much time had passed. He voted against unleashing the King of Tears, and I killed the others before they could follow through."

Handily. An eldritch monstrosity running loose is no good for anyone, even the loonies who summoned it.

"Fine. What about what you're doing now?"

"Kahndaq was a brutal shithole, and now it's… Alright, and getting better. Venturia's experiencing an economic revival and an improved relationship with the rest of Atlantis. Uncorporation is now offering a range of services which are actually useful to people…"

And that's the foundation of the Renegade's methods: He turns places that would seem super-villain breeding grounds and makes them into powerhouses of advancement.

"Africa. Looks colonial."

"Y-es? I mean, technically, the genomorphs are colonising the place, and they're not really interested in becoming citizens of pre-existing countries. On the other hand, if you'd like to look at the reports on local standards of… Everything, then I'm sure that you'll see that they've done the world of good."

Which is a clear improvement over the original state.

"I already knew that. I get reports from the Commonwealth Office."

"So what's the issue?"

"What's the issue with the Prime Minister of Great Britain cooperating with the group taking over most of Africa?"

Well, it's not like you have to be public about it. If you have to talk about it, point at the economic benefits. People like money, and making money. This stands to make them money...

I shrug. "I understand that it's a little embarrassing that we're outperforming the Commonwealth Office with a fraction of the resources. Have you considered doing an audit?"

"The Commonwealth Office don't assassinate people."

No, that typically falls to other agencies. Unfortunately, the foreign office can't ask them directly to handle something...

I gesture upwards with my right hand. "And there's where you've been going wrong! It's like Batman not killing the Joker; it's amazing the number of lives you can save by murdering a logjam. Do you remember when the people of Sudan stopped murdering each other?"

As, yes. The Renegade's girls' first project together.A telepath to pick targets, a speedster to remove them and... A 'brick' to provide cover or distractions, was it?

"That was you, was it?"

"That was my eldest and her friends. I put them up to it, but the technique and timing were all them. And look at the results. Far less death than if no one did anything or if another country invaded. And we haven't even had to lean on the surviving government officials all that much."

Not with the implicit threat of the Swift Death returning. What has Misa-chan been up to, anyway?

"The country has effectively partitioned, but I suppose that's the best result they could have gotten."

"Well, they are next door to Kahndaq. They know perfectly well that if anyone acts up Adom might well pay them a visit. The southern tribes are in talks regarding annexation, and LexCorp is already constructing mines and oil wells in the area."

In that respect, it's pretty much business as usual. Foreign companies coming in and doing things. But this time the people want them there.

"I thought you were using cosmic converters to power everything?"

I shrug. "South Sudan had basically no infrastructure. It's easier to refine local oil and use it to fuel generators than build an actual power network to hundreds of tiny villages. We're working on it. And we still need plastics and oil-based lubricants. Besides, LexPower's global monopoly relies on us not letting cosmic converters get out of our sight. Sticking them on starships is one thing. Putting one in a random African village with no security is quite another."

That's basically telling any capable power or malign hypercognitive 'Please, feel free to steal this!'

"I was waiting for the other shoe to drop regarding electrical generation. I assumed Luthor would be asking for tax breaks or something of that nature. But he's already past that, isn't he? The point is to fund his fleet, and it's already doing that."

It helps that he's already basically the richest man on Earth. What's he going to do with more money besides improve his spacefleet?

"What he wants is for people to accept cheap electricity and stop trying to bypass him when they directly benefit. He's using it to fund the stellar self-defence force that protects the Earth. That's all there is to it." … "Alright, it's also an ego boost for him too, because… Heh. I read a book… Centuries ago on my personal timeline, where a media mogul had a group of magical dragons looked up as a transmitter array because it was cheaper than using satellites. When the hero asked him if he was planning on taking over the world, he said 'no'. Because when you own the media corporations they throw in the governments for free."

What a quirky concept. But yes, sadly, people do tend to follow the opinions of any handsome face in a nice suit or pretty lady with big old...

"And the raw materials are just for building starships?"

"At this point the few shareholders he doesn't control regard him as the second coming of John Rockefeller. He works very long hours and was already extremely rich. What's he going to do with the extra money that's going to meaningfully affect his quality of life? No, he wants Earth to have a self-defence fleet because this way it's not relying on Superman."

The fact it lets him put on over on The Alien is a benefit to him, yes.

"What's wrong with Superman?"

"Lex hates him. Don't ask; it's not rational and he knows it. He feels better if the Earth is protected by a navy rather than a single man who could choke on a kryptonite fishbone tomorrow and leave the planet defenceless."

I mean, there are plenty of superheroes around who are almost as powerful, if not more so. Superman just has the luck of having the most bluntly useful powers in impressive amounts

"And what about you?"

"The need to build up civilisations is built into my soul. I'll do that until my soul reunites with the Source. But in the medium term, I want help killing my father."

And given who that is, it's a goal most of the Universe would agree to help with. The arguments would come in as to who would be in charge, though...

"Why?"

"Can I be blunt?"

"I would appreciate it."

He's already something of a social wrecking ball when he needs to be.

I glance up for a moment. "Remember how it felt, when you found your wife's body?" He jerks and then goes still, jaw tensing. "My father wants to make everyone in the universe feel just like that, all of the time. Cradle to grave. Abject misery for all. He wants to alter reality so that no other state of mind is possible. And I don't know how close he is to pulling it off, but he hit me with a little of his work-in-progress a while ago and I spend a week raving in despair and trying to claw my own head off."

A gross oversimplification of both the effects of Anti-Life and of His goals, but for these purposes, it works.

"How?"

"It's called the Anti-Life Equation. He speaks, and you're not exactly you any longer. That's what I want to stop, why I'm investing in Earth society rather than going somewhere else and building up from scratch." I turn back to him. "So, you on board?"

And Earth Bullshit™ can be one hell of a force multiplier when managed correctly. One lucky crit roll and bam, steamrolled.

"Does he know you feel like this?"

I nod. "Probably."

Given that he seems to be able to read his sons' minds, possibly as an aspect of Tyranny, it's a certainty.

"Then why hasn't he stopped you?"

I shrug disarmingly. "He can hardly crush me if I haven't build up anything to crush, can he?"

"Only when he is at his highest point will I break him down. The further the fall, the greater the pain." Pretty much the logic behind His plans.

He watches me for a moment, mulling things over.

Then he nods.

"Alright then. I'm in. What do I need to do to get started?"

Excellent. One more piece on the board.

Honestly, if the Renegade explained Anti-Life and His goals like he did here, I suspect a lot of people would be more willing to play nice. Sadly, that requires a more hands-on, face-to-face approach to matters, and there's never enough time for that. So instead, the Renegade has to work through the powerful people, turning their followers to his strategies...

Mr Zoat · 2026-01-10T09:17:45+0000

Darko said:
"hooked up"
"spent"
"built"

Thank you, corrected.

Duke Long · 2026-01-10T10:20:59+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"Y-es? I mean, technically, the genomorphs are colonising the place, and they're not really interested in becoming citizens of pre-existing countries. On the other hand, if you'd like to look at the reports on local standards of… Everything, then I'm sure that you'll see that they've done the world of good."

'a'?

Mr Zoat said:
I read a book…

Is it good? I like the description and the reviews seem positive.

boo600 · 2026-01-10T10:44:18+0000

Mr Zoat said:
Huh. I've been calling him Shooty Gatwa this whole time.

You are of course entitled to your personal taste on the quality. I gave up after Moon Egg and the Poo Daleks.

Thank you, corrected.

I said the actors did their best, not the writers.

I was able to take the Moon Egg in stride, given that it's Dr Who and they erase consequences whenever the fuck they feel like. I… don't recall Poo Daleks, and I think I'm happier that way.

I'm genuinely sad you tapped out that early, though, because I suspect that your Rage and Horror upon seeing the utterly nonsensical, Mary Sue fanfic diarrhea that is the Timeless Child would make your feelings on Nu52 pale in comparison, and it would be a thing of Terrible Awe to behold.

Mr Zoat · 2026-01-10T11:48:36+0000

Duke Long said:
'a'?

No, that's correct.

Is it good? I like the description and the reviews seem positive.

Good, yes. It's not amazing, but if it's in your local library then it's worth a read.

boo600 said:
I said the actors did their best, not the writers.

Having read the actors' interviews, it seems that they were foursquare behind the new direction. Might just be them being professional about the project, but I doubt it.

Thundersmight94 · 2026-01-10T14:41:44+0000

I kept forgetting that Grayven wasn't Red Light enlightened so he wouldn't have red quotations so I was confused for like a solid minute.

BartlettMagic · 2026-01-10T15:41:12+0000

question (and apologies if this has already been addressed):

i've read in various places, including this story i think, that there are certain multi-universal constants, Darkseid being one of them, Highfather, etc... meaning that if Grayven's universe's Darkseid would somehow be killed, he's not really dead because he still exists in other universes and what really got killed was maybe like the equivalent of getting his pinky finger cut off. please correct me if i'm wrong on that, because it's what leads me to my question-

is Grayven the same? because our Renegade Grayven is really, originally, OL who then merged with the Renegade Universe Grayven in a big cosmic mind meld. OL and Grayven are now functionally the same person, their memories are combined, OL now has OG Grayven's insights into Apokolips' politics. is Grayven also a multi-universal constant (which i would think he is, since conquest is pretty ubiquitous), and if so, does that then mean that the Renegade OL is now part of the Paragon OL's Grayven? Renegade OL would be a drop in the bucket of multi-universal Grayven, but that drop would diffuse throughout the multiverse and now be part of the greater multi-universal concept that is Grayven, no?

i hope that makes sense.

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Glomerulus

Not too sore, are you?

Chasing the ring

Glomerulus

Dedicated ragequitter

Not too sore, are you?

Experienced.

Accused of writing in a far away land

Veteran Lurker

Versed in the lewd.

I trust you know where the happy button is?

This is filth! FILTH!!

Glomerulus

Well worn.

Dedicated ragequitter

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Welp

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Know what you're doing yet?

Dedicated ragequitter

Just zis guy, you know?

Dedicated ragequitter

Connoisseur.

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Dedicated ragequitter

Glomerulus

Welp

Dedicated ragequitter

Not too sore, are you?

peekaboo, you fucks you!

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