Dungeon Crawler Quest(Original Fantasy)

I am always happy to see people putting so much thought into my quests. I'm glad you like it enough to write so much about it Darkened.

 

It's quite fun, and it seems really well put together particularly on the structural end. Mechanization of my quests is something I tend to struggle with or fail to do, so it's useful to break down others.

Rereading. The Devil's Eye's First Mention said:

Which is correct?

 

The quest's good- it might not have the mythological aspects of DDQ:RE but the worldbuilding is actually still very good though of an utterly different style, and it has actual good characterization as well as a MC with low charisma which means we can't just bullrush everything and expect to brainwash people into agreeing.

Also, design-wise it seems very solid. There is a lot of logical set up between the different dungeons and continuity between the different upgrades. The way "They are just wargs, we know wargs" is a false arguments because of the way ranking and party-recommendation works is very neat. Same dungeons get very different.

Now, Darkened, a couple of points you glossed over: Number of rooms and numbers of recced people to do the dungeon can go up as the rank of the dungeon. Wailing cavern is always 6 room and 3 people so far, but Ogre Den gets a 5th room and a third party member recced at C-rank, hinting that there are probably 'minimums' for higher ranked dungeons when it comes to complexity of the dungeons and intelligence of the enemies.

 

Glancing through my dungeon notes... the twelve is right. Goofed on the copying.

 

Assuming my analysis is correct, the number of rooms is largely irrelevent as that seems independent and something of its own thing (Shows how endurance is/is not a factor)

Raising party size suggests an increase in complexity again, but no more than would be expected from A C/10/3 anywhere else.

It's worth noting that they raise, but until we do C rank, it's hard to say if this is the consequence of it raising or just a particular increase in that dungeon. (And even then we'd need a few C ranks to contrast it with to really evaluate)

It'll be a useful point of data, but we lack enough for the full set.

Once we hit Divine Eye B or A, I really really want to take a few days and mass investigate dungeons, gear, levels, etc depending on what info we have.

That said, that's probably a ways off.

 

Additional rooms probably means additional enemy types or special condition rooms like enviromental\spawning\puzzle rooms.

 

We got Divine Eye after our first two runs so it should be 77.
Counting up Water magic is correct at 32.

New figures should be:

Job: Ice Elementalist Rank D(59/70)
Slot1: Ice Magic: D (54/80)
Slot2: Staves: D (54/80)
Slot3: Water Magic: E (32/40)
Slot1: Magician’s Blood: D(34/120)
Slot2: Cat’s Curiosity: D(34/120)
Slot3: Divine Eye: E (77/80)

 

Oh that is right, we didn't get it from our mother, we got it from our uncle. derp. Yeah add day 2 dungeons to the total. Also apparently I cannot add.

 

So yeah, JP wise we won't have any issue getting to Rank C Job/Divine eye D tomorrow. The big question is going to try and get Ice MAgic/Staves to C, but it would need 26JP, which sounds a bit hard if possible. We also need 175XP, which requires planning but is very doable with such.

 

BTW, while I object to going to the cemetary anytime soon... for when we do.
I noticed that we are out of slots for it, what happens if we tried to equip firemage now? Because if we could swap ice mage for firemage before going into cemetary it would be very useful.

 

Level 5 gives us another slot, though we want Wind magic, as it also combines with Ice Magic (Blizzard Sage).

 

I wonder if Blizzard and Polar combine.

 

Equipping a third Elemental Magic might be a hassle that we do not yet need, since we have Water magic.
Not to mention, Ice Resistance is not Slow/Freeze Resistance.


I think?

 

Ice resistance is definitely slow/freeze resistance.

I am also not sure how equipping a third Elemental Magic a hassle? It doesn't change anything except a°) gives us more options, b°) levels it up.

 

Probably worth it to find out. Even if they don't, their skills probably synergize pretty nicely, and getting one means we've already done half the work to get the other. That said, we do hit the problem of wanting to level something to B rank eventually or our actual magic will stop getting stronger soonish.

There's a definite incentive to getting a low hanging job like Ice Elementalist to A-S rank so that we can then forevermore level all elemental magic skills to A-S rank without worrying about current job.

That said, as JP seems to be creeping upward as we ascend the ranks little by little, and we're gradually getting a wider platform of skills to thrash easy content, it'll probably be easy enough to grind something up high if we focus on keeping skills current and then go back for it.

Like, I know I definitely want to eventually grab hexer and solo the easiest dungeons we can run until hit hits C-B so we can check out Winter Witch (if we can't find anything there later) and just because having the option of equipping a healing skill is very very good.

Likewise focusing just on ice might leave us overspecialized (though getting higher tier ice jobs might require or involve a decent chunk of aquiring supplementary jobs)

On the other hand, for one train of jobs, we're likely to want...

White>Green>Blue>Purple>Gold

Assuming that jobs aren't levelish dependent and that white jobs are, in principle, roughly equivalent, then we'll either get a higher tier job or, if this is the correct loot ranking:

1 gold=2 Purple=4 Blue=8 Green=16 white

Granted, some of those 16 white crystals will be the same crystal (Say, ice elementalist might appear 3-4 times)

Without finding rare jobs easily, we'd need something along the lines of 30 crystals to get from the common ones we're finding to gold via fusion. In practice high level fusions might be trickier or require 3+ crystals, and we'll likely find some jobs at higher levels that cut out entire sections of that. The fusion tree might not even be so neatly organized either.

However, in principle, what I'm saying is that getting a single gold crystal could require upwards of 30*105=3150JP. (Probably more since green, blue and purple crystals likely require more JP to level).

In that sense, a single divergence from that tree could take a while, and we'd definitely want to get at least something elementalisty to A or S rank fairly early. (Harder to grind a bad job up as the level of encounters rise and it'd take longer to grind up a good one.)

That said, since the cost of recovering ice elementalist after we get polar adept is 400 gilder or so, I'd say we should just go straight to polar and grab ice again for more leveling.

While getting ice elementalist from C to A will probably take 420 JP, in the long run it's quicker to do. I'd rather get polar sage's active skills and start grinding those first, rather than wait, but after that we'll want B rank quickly so we can level up our likely capped active skills.

(Taking water elementalist, our obvious next move, from E>C will likely take 105 JP. By contrast, leveling our ice magic active skill from C>B likely takes 160JP. That 35 JP difference means we won't be able to level it anymore until we get something to B rank, after which it'd probably immediately hit B rank and we'd want to hurry Ice Elementalist to A to avoid having skills capped at B, after which we just go with the jobs we need to grind.)


tl;dr: Leveling jobs is quicker than leveling active skills, but we have to level a lot of jobs. Level 1 job quickly to A so we can get A ranked skills and then never bother raising another above C until its name turns blue.

 

It is a hassle, for now, since we do not have an open Active Skill slot yet (we could un-equip Staves, but that lowers range and damage).
And also, if we take a third Elemental Magic Skill, I'd prefer it to be Wind, since we know about the Wind+Ice fusion.

Not gonna contest the Ice = Slow & Freeze thing, since that is not quite clear.


On a different consideration, if Maya succeeds to get Ranger tonight, she will be able to equip Bows and Taming, assuming both are Active, without de-equipping any other Skills.

Depending on how Taming works, we might want to visit Wailing Cavern or Goblin's Glade in the morning, so she can practice that Skill. Unsure if Drakes are categorized as Beast-type or as Dragon-type.

 

I... guess you didn't read my posts?

I was talking about buying Wind Magic (if we can find it) so that we can equip it tomorrow night when we are level 5 and have access to a 4th active skill slot. This was part of my argument fo why we shouldn't go to Lost Graveyard tomorrow, but instead once we hit level 5 and can equip a new magic skill.

 

Ah, I was replying to the other guy, who wanted to get Fire for Undead.

 

Alright lockin up, consensus is definitely hugs for everyone/shopping and poking Sera and Shimah for sleep over privileges.

 

It's not weird if we're all the same gender, right?

Right.

 

Maybe it’s just that the shock is finally wearing off, maybe you’ve just had enough time to really process what happened, but as everyone makes their way up the main street, you can’t help but think of it.

You almost died. Your friends almost died, way more so than any of dungeons, where you were no more than an orb away from escape. If Sokal hadn’t shown up you would have died, flat out. Maya… You shudder as you remember that monster’s sword cutting through her. You never want that to happen again.

So maybe that’s why you find yourself and your group paused at the edge of the street as you hug Maya from behind, face pressed against her back.

“Al, what are you doing?” she asks, you think you can hear a note of understanding in her voice though, but maybe that’s just you.

“Just shut up and accept it,” you mutter, not budging an inch, “That was way too close,” you add, a little more quietly.

You can feel Maya sigh, and see Sera shudder out of the corner of your eye. She is still looking pretty pale. “It really was,” Maya says after a moment, not making any move to dislodge you.Anshelm just scuffs his boot on the ground, looking sullen… You don’t have to be a genius that he sees Maya’s near death as his fault. “There wasn’t anything we could do to avoid that one though… It was no one's fault,” the last seems directed at Anshelm, who makes a noncommittal grunt but doesn’t otherwise respond.

“I-I was completely useless,” Sera mutters unhappily, "Al was at least able to slow it down, and Miss Maya did more damage than any of us, but I… I couldn’t do anything,” her shoulders slump dejectedly.

“That is why having multiple elements is important,” Shimah says quietly, “None of us could have predicted such a thing so early though.”

After a moment more you release Maya, you almost hesitate as you step over to Sera, what if she thinks its weird for your to…

You calmly tell that part of your brain to shut the hell up, and hug Sera, too. She stiffens up as you put your arms around her, “Hey, none of that, we’re gonna get stronger, alright, we’ll get new, better jobs, and kick the crap out every monster we see, alright, this…This was just a set back,” no verbal response, but she does hug you back, burying her face in your shoulder.

“My, Al has an affectionate side too, who knew,” Maya says, her smiles a little weak though.

“Aww shut up Maya, after that I’m entitled to a hug or two,” you grump back, that at least draws a chuckle from Anshelm.

Then you find your head buried in something pillowy soft and warm, and… Oh, hi, Shimah. “Uh… needed a hug too?” you ask, awkwardness finally starting to wear away at you again.

She looks down at you curiously, “I had assumed this was appropriate for expressing affection for a teammate? I am fond of you all, and today’s encounter was too close.”

Sera starts to giggle uncontrollably from her position in your arms, shoulders shaking with laughter. It feels like the cloud that’s been hanging over you all since the fight is starting to dissipate a little, you can’t help but laugh a little yourself, “Yeah, yeah, it’s fine, I just didn’t take you for the huggy sort.”

She releases you, and you let go of Sera, “I am still not quite certain what amount of physical contact is appropriate here, forgive me if I seem distant,” Shimah says, even as Sera works to get her giggles under control.

“Don’t worry too much about it,” Maya says easily, smiling properly again, Anshelm seems to have slipped his arm around her waist at some point while you were distracted, “Social taboos don’t mean much to branded anyway, just have fun with it,” she adds breezily.

“Yeah, pretty much,” you can’t say you're better per se, but the darker thoughts are no longer crowding out everything else, “You guys wanna grab up new jobs and offload loot before we hit the Inn?”

“S-sure,” Sera stammers, her giggles finally stopping, it’s almost too bad, Sera has a pretty laugh. You head off to the shops after that, a little bit of conversation picking back up among you. Your group sells and splits the gilder for their various junk loot, and then it’s time to hit the job crystals. Everyone has enough once the selling is done, though for Shimah the gilder is going to be a little tight until she can get another dungeon run under her belt.

Maya picks up Archery and Beast Taming. Archery gives an accuracy boost and the ability to slow enemies she shoots from stealth. Beast Taming… is a bit weird, at E it just lets her control one beast type monster, to ‘capture’ it the beast has to be the last enemy on the field and have half health or less, something to consider for tomorrow.

Lightning magic apparently lets you charge up your spells for extra power at the cost of time, plus a high damage single target spell and a ‘lightning cloak’ that does decent damage to enemies in melee with you.

Shimah can’t equip the skill she gets yet, Curses. But the E level of the skill lets her cast an area of effect poison curse and a single target paralysis curse. So that’ll be a bit more utility once she hits level five.

Glancing around yourself, you don’t see anything in particular that catches your eye, there is a Wind Elementalist Job available for four hundred gilder, but you aren’t sure if you want that or not.
With the shopping done for the night everyone heads back to the Inn to rest and eat, putting the lethal encounter with the kiln knight… and what that is a herald of, further out of mind. You do some work updating your master copy of your dungeon manual, you figure you can take it too a copyist in town to run off a few in the morning, it’s getting a little too long for you to be making every copy by hand.

As you’re writing the bit about the drake’s nest, you’re also chatting with Sera and Shimah about nothing in particular. Maya and Anshelm have already absconded back to their room, you assume Maya wants some cuddle time, and no you aren’t blushing imagining that. It occurs to you though, even if you have gotten past your initial shock… you still don’t really want to be alone tonight,“Hey, uh, Sera?” you ask, changing subjects from the silly stuff you were chatting about.

“Hm? What is it Al?” she asks curiously.

“Um… D’you think we could, uh…. Maybe sleepinthesameroomtonight?”, it comes out in a babbling rush, that leaves Sera, blinking, and Shimah completely confused.

Sera puzzles out your words first, a turns a little red, but it seems todays… issues prevent her from going into full blushing meltdown, “W-why, would you even ask that? I mean I’m flattered and um… Things were bad today, so I was thinking about… um…”

“I… I just don’t really want to sleep alone tonight alright,” you grumble, pouting a little, “Look, I know it’s kind of childish, but… I can take the bathtub, since that’s a thing I guess I do now… And hey, um… Shimah, you want to get in on this too, make it like a little slumber party thing?”

“Oh, um… I, that is…” Sera mumbles, before visibly calming herself, “Al, you really need to consider your word choice more,” she settles on grumbling cutely. “I… I suppose I don’t mind something like that…”

“I do not think I can participate, thank you for considering me though,” Shimah says, bowing her head slightly.

Huh, you wonder why, “Why not?”

“I am afraid I sleep unclothed, and despite your assurances earlier, I am certain neither of you would be comfortable with that… And I do not have any sleepwear.” She admits, not sounding the slightest bit embarrassed.

Uh… Yeah, naked Shimah, that could be bouncy… You meant awkward, definitely awkward, you kinda doubt anything you or Sera have would fit her either.

Sera has steam coming off her head again, “Ah… Yes, I don’t think that would be appropriate… Maybe we could buy some things together later though?” she offers, in a valiant attempt to reach out to your most distant party member.

“I would not mind, perhaps tomorrow evening?” Shimah says after a moment’s thought.

The rest of the evening is spent discussing sleep wear options, apparently it’s super hot in Shimah’s home city, which is why she’s not used to needing that kind of thing, either way it looks like you might be going shopping with Sera and Shimah tomorrow night. You collect your things and put away your gear...you notice something weird though, there's an extra fifty gilder in the merchants bag when you rummage aound to organize your stuff, an item effect? Then you head to Sera’s room, you absolutely do not stare at her in the fine silk nightgown she’s wearing, wow do you feel underdressed in your linen stuff, to tell the truth you usually just sleep in your underwear, but it didn’t seem appropriate.

“So, um… You’ll be in the bathtub, are you sure that’s fine?” Sera asks bashfully, it’s no fair, what she’s wearing is way more concealing than her usual gear, but it’s somehow more appealing… Maybe the way it hangs at a slight angle exposing a bit of shoulder and collarbone… Shut up brain.

“Um… Yeah, seems I’m more comfortable in the water now,” you say awkwardly, “So… Goodnight then?”

You make your way to Sera’s bathroom to settle in, it’s a bit less comfortable than you imagined, mostly due to wet cloth clinging to you…. You might have to consider sleeping in the buff like Shimah if your gonna keep doing this.

You fall asleep soon after though, exhausted by the day.

[]Morning Plans!
--Shopping/blessings
---activities, you guys know the drill.

 

. . .
+imagines Sera and Al getting sandwiched by Shimah+
Ahem.

Anyway, since we have some confirmation about Beast Taming, we might want to go to Goblin's Glade (normal Wargs, or White Warg, but that one is harder to get), Wailing Cavern (Confusion-causing Bats), and perhaps Drake's Nest, if Drakes are confirmed to be Beast-type (Confirmed to be non beast), or even Ashen Grotto (ash snakes and Uroktor, red scaled lizard).

[X] Blessing of Lesser Good Fortune > 75 Gilder
- [X] Ask Maya if there are new Blessings opened for a 5th level Branded

[X] Shopping
- [X] Buy 1 Ether

[X] Find Copyist to give your master copy of the Guide

[X] Ask Shimah and Sera about Ogre's den before you meet up with Anshelm
-[X] If they think E rank was easy enough for us to solo:
--[X] Split the party
---[X] Anshelm, Al, Sera all solo Ogre's Den E rank
--[X] Shimah and Maya stick together and run D rank Ogre's Den. (Or some other dungeon if they'd rather)

-[X] If they don't think the E rank was easy enough to reliably solo:
--[X] Stick together and run Ashen Grotto D rank
---[X] Make sure Sera's using lightning magic and go in with hopes of catching an Uroktor or something better if it appears.


(Known) Options for beasts:
- Warg: Normal, Skulker (can use Stealth), White (Elite, can use Buff), Alpha (Elite, can Buff and Heal)
- Bat: Normal, Elite (cause Confusion)
- Ash Snake: Normal
- Uroktor: Normal (Burrow, ranged Burn)

EDIT: Confirmation, E-rank Beast Taming can't get Bosses, but if they are encountered out of Dungeons, then Taming can be attempted.

 

Right-oh, a few things we need for today's planning (that we should already know because of our continued dungeon guide) yrsillar:

A°)What were Sera and Shimah's EXP/JP rewards on duo-ing the Ogre-Den E rank. I am especially interested because it sems that Ogre Den gives more EXP but less JP than Goblin Glade, and I want to see if it's right, as it can give a hint on nature of enemies/numbers rewards.

B°)What were the three-group reward for D-rank goblin Glade the day before yesterday (EXP/JP). This is important if we want to try and find the perfect way to get all our grou tp level 5 tomorrow.

C°) How far are Shimah, Sera and Anshelm from level 5 and C rank?

Now, i will make a bigger posts about Job ranks for longer terms things..

 

90/10/90 for the two man E rank Ogre's

70/6/80 for the three man goblin D rank

Around the same range Alice is on job and skill ranks, variance within a few points of each other. For experience Sera is about fifty ahead, Shimah is about even, and Anshelm is around forty XP from leveling due to his personal skill

 

[X] Shopping
- [X] Buy 1 Ether

[X] Find Copyist to give your master copy of the Guide
[X] Ask Maya if there are new Blessings opened for a 5th level Branded

[X] Ask Shimah and Sera about Ogre's den before you meet up with Anshelm
-[X] If they think E rank was easy enough for us to solo:
--[X] Split the party
---[X] Anshelm, Al, Sera all solo Ogre's Den E rank
--[X] Shimah and Maya stick together and run D rank Ogre's Den. (Or some other dungeon if they'd rather)
-[X] If they don't think the E rank was easy enough to reliably solo:
--[X] Stick together and run Ashen Grotto D rank
---[X] Make sure Sera's using lightning magic and go in with hopes of catching an Uroktor or something better if it appears.

This should get us to level 5 in the morning if we split. Doing that, then running something like Glade C rank in the afternoon for Maya and dashing back to town, outfitting ourselves with wind magic (Swapping job to water elementalist) and maybe getting Sera earth to complete our set, would let us smash Graveyard tomorrow.

Significant is that we won't split the party if our timid and practical member don't think we can hack it we won't try, so before people scream about risk, this should only be a contingency that triggers if it's low.

Skipping blessing because we're buying an ether and I'd rather ensure we have the gilder for wind mage tomorrow, besides it might not work out if our afternoon dungeon goes south and our party's probably broke enough at the moment since 3 of them just spent 400 gilder on a new job+whatever they need for pots to solo Den.

 

So, now, questions on Jobs and Fusioning Jobs yrsillar.

Because, as it stands, fusioning jobs seems like a flat out loss at lower levels. By that, i mean, 'fusionning a job before you get your first to A level'. Of course, it all depends on the numbers, and it also depends on whether we could ever manage to get a second job slot, but as it is:

A°) Our rank of skill cannot outlevel the rank of our highest job in the 'main class' it belongs to (Divine, Magic, Warrior, Thief).
B°) If we want to fusion and job and use our new job, it means we need to:
-Get Secondary Job (Water, for Example), to C
-Slot in the new, uncommon element.

The big issue here is that our magic skills will keep levelling, and unless (15+C=>B) on our magic skills costs more than Water E=>C + 'Uncommon Element' E=>B', then this means our Ice Magic will stale at C rank for a long time when it has the XP to level up. Most likely our Water Magic, too. The only exception would be for the Skill given to use by the fusion element.

So, from what i am seeing, it stands to reckon that there are three possible choices:
-The Job benefits and the Skills given by the Uncommon Element vastly overpower the ones of the common elements, meaning that being stalled at C-rank on our Ice/Water magic is not a big deal given the Job benefits from the uncommon elements will make the different in power alone (The job benefit here is very important, as even if we did get a power skill from polar adept, we could stay with Water/Ice Job and keep levelling those to B-rank +). It is especially important there for the 'B rank' skills not to utterly overpower uncommon/rare C ones.
-The JP needed is exponential, and the difference between skill and jobs get larger, meaning that we will get the opportunity to level several jobs to B before we get one skill to B.
-We can get two Jobs, meaning we can keep levelling our high and very quick to level common job to make sure our skills can continue levelling (almost impossible).

This is especially true because we have seen rare Divine Eye takes much more EXP to level than common passive skills, and as such, if switching to a green/blue job means being stuck to C-rank skills when everyone else as A-rank ones, there should be a way to tell us how much of a trap (or non-trap) it is. It's very possible the green/blue jobs itself gives benefits as said above, but we can level the green/blue skills with out initial common jobs, so if the jobs themselves don't make a immense difference...

Oh, and in the past yrsillar talked about fusing skills and jobs, not just jobs. It's very possibly we might be able to fuse Ice/Water in order to gain 'more slots', though of course it comes back to it being a E-rank again.

In the short run, it might very well be wisest to do the minimum possible with fusion, not equipping the fusion jobs for long, and even try to buy uncommon jobs instead of creating them.

Of course, this wouldn't explain why everyone after a while seems to have green/blue titles. This would mean either the job themselves are worth it, or that they all levelled up their starter jobs (or another common job) to A rank before switching to the Jobs that offered them the types of benefits they wished for.

 

Worth noting is that we can fuse polar adept and then turn right around and buy another ice elementalist crystal and start leveling that up to A.

IE: We'd take a detour to level water (a not insignificant one), but we could then raise polar adept's active skills while raising Ice Elementalist to A. Or we could do Ice>B, Water>C, *Buy polar*, Ice>A.

Given that we know fusioning is expensive (we may be able to cheat this if Alice finishes the book) it's possible we might need to wait anyway.

If we keep going, we're going to want to fuse/swap jobs more than once. Even if they outpower now, not getting a basic job to A while that job is still competitive is going to make it harder to EVER get a job to A before we're high level and rocking a blue-purple job.

So far, it seems to be a straight doubling at each level, at least on jobs and their active skills. (I didn't track E rank cat's eye or magican blood). If higher level jobs are harder to level, it makes sense to farm up ice elementalist soonish, rather than waiting forever.

I imagine they do, but because we're going to be constantly switching jobs for a while (to hopefully eventually land a purple fusion) we'd be having green/blue active skills at their cap since we probably won't go far beyond C on most jobs. Ergo, it makes sense even if the jobs are great, not to cheat ourselves out of that JP.

It seemed like their needed to be crystals. Appraise is a crystal you can buy, so they fused that, rather than fusing an active skill attached to another crystal.

Again, fusion's costs are probably mostly in the cost of fusing. Once we get polar adept, the cost to replace our ice/water elementalist crystals is 800 gilder.

The cost to get polar adept is 800+the green fusion fee and the cost to get something polar adept fuses too would just be 1600+2xgreen fusion fee+blue fusion fee.

Leveling jobs takes time, replacing jobs fused away just takes money (unless we need a rare drop job for fusion.)

So it makes sense to fuse a green job earlyish and work on its active skills.

Leveling up a starter job probably isn't that hard.

So far we've earned about 100JP.

Going from E>D required 35, then 70, next is probably 140 and then 280. 35+70+140+280=525JP.

By contrast, if a green job follows the same pattern but starts at a modestly higher 50 JP for E rank, we'd get 50+100+150+300=600.

If it costs a full 70, we'd need 70+140+280+560=1050JP.

In short, it's probably easier to just level up the E rank to A given that most other green jobs will be transitory on our way to a blue, though we can still easily get the green job and start leveling it, given the negligible cost to replace an E ranked crystal.

 

It is kind of a trade off.Fusing early means being stuck at C rank for awhile after all, but yeah Uncommon jobs have significantly better passive benefits than white ones, really this is kind of a matter I specifically left vague so you guys could experiment with it, rather than giving a clear 'optimal path' Do you value having more variety and passive bonuses in skills, or do you want to crank one particular magic to max? It's kinda up in the air.

 

All those optimizers are now dribbling tears at the lack of information to min-max properly.