1. For prospective new members, a word of warning: don't use common names like Dennis, Simon, or Kenny if you decide to create an account. Spammers have used them all before you and gotten those names flagged in the anti-spam databases. Your account registration will be rejected because of it.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Since it has happened MULTIPLE times now, I want to be very clear about this. You do not get to abandon an account and create a new one. You do not get to pass an account to someone else and create a new one. If you do so anyway, you will be banned for creating sockpuppets.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. If you wish to change your username, please ask via conversation to tehelgee instead of asking via my profile. I'd like to not clutter it up with such requests.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Due to the actions of particularly persistent spammers and trolls, we will be banning disposable email addresses from today onward.
    Dismiss Notice
  5. An option to display times with the 24 hour standard is now available. To change it, go to Preferences > Locale > Language and choose the 'English - 24 Hour Clock' option. If you prefer the 12 hour clock, you don't need to do anything, it's the default.
    Dismiss Notice

Those Blessed with Talent

Discussion in 'Questing' started by Darkened, Feb 26, 2015.

Loading...
  1. Anaerobie

    Anaerobie Making the rounds.

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    7
    [X] That's not how this works. First, don't fuck with people and their family when you're asking for a favor. Second, if you want anything then you apply yourself, prove yourself, to earn it. I'm not giving out free rides.
     
  2. BFldyq

    BFldyq It's pronounced Be-Fled-Ick

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2014
    Messages:
    14,378
    Likes Received:
    14,317
    This vote isn't going to go over well....

    Seriously, think about what your saying. This sounds like a threat. Remember, she's a slave. She's not asking not be able to slack off: she's asking not to be abused and mistreated.

    What your saying is "you don't don't want that? Work your butt off for my benefit".
     
  3. Arkeus

    Arkeus Crazy cat guy

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,175
    Likes Received:
    3,750
    It's a language she understands- all the other write-ins are not "empathy", they are "infantilizing/looking down on her". They are "Look how bad 'me who own you' are! we are alike!".

    This is not the best, but at least it's a honest appeal to a working relationship that she can understand and can like. The "not the best" part is because it's not going to begin as much of a friendly relationship, but it's one that's going to reassure her. It gives her a very clear out from her fears as well as provide her a framework for her to understand us.

    Trying to pretend she isn't out slave is just insulting to her.
     
  4. BFldyq

    BFldyq It's pronounced Be-Fled-Ick

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2014
    Messages:
    14,378
    Likes Received:
    14,317
    There's two write-ins that aren't like that: my own, which is partly a joke, and this one:
    Except...it's not? It's a threat, that if she doesn't please us, we'll mistreat her. Aka, the exact thing she's trying to get us not to do.

    And yes, I know that's not your intention, but that's what it'd sounds like, to her.
    Except that's not the issue? The issue is she's worried about mistreatment and abuse. The write-in not only fails to address that, it sounds like Little Bee will if she doesn't receive absolute obedience.
     
  5. rcnr

    rcnr Dangerously Chuuni

    Joined:
    May 9, 2014
    Messages:
    3,153
    Likes Received:
    3,026
    Isn't she doing that just by coming in here? If she acknowledges we have power over her, threatening us is just as bad as threatening her actual masters.
     
  6. Arkeus

    Arkeus Crazy cat guy

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,175
    Likes Received:
    3,750
    Explain why it's a threat?
    How so?
    That's why she is shivering in fear. She knows she is in deep shit and it's a bluff. The actual "pretend her plan worked" can also work, but if we don't go and do that, we then have to still play along with what she imagines we should do- in that case, we have to prove we aren't going to abuse her, hence that write in.

    EDIT: She was also told she belonged to us, so we are her master.
     
  7. Fredo

    Fredo Eternal Lurker

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2015
    Messages:
    404
    Likes Received:
    1,024
    She is worried about mistreatment and abuse. And she deals with that by attacking us in our sleep and threatening our life. She really is a moron. Almost any "normal" noble would have her whipped severely, if not executed, for this type of behavior.
     
  8. BFldyq

    BFldyq It's pronounced Be-Fled-Ick

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2014
    Messages:
    14,378
    Likes Received:
    14,317
    Reread what she says:
    Notice the "good little toady" bit: she'll work and act out our whims, but in return, she want reassurance that we won't mistreat her or Rocky. That's her deal.

    Now look at the write-in:
    Let's break this down, shall we?
    We're refusing to let her dictate the terms, aka we're refusing her deal.
    This indicates that she's in on our shit-list, and will refuse to be nice to her, because of her actions.
    She's already offered to be obedient in exchange for not being mistreated, and we refused that offer. Therefore, this indicates that if she wants anything, she'll have to above and beyond.

    It also comes with the implication that we'll be abusing her during this time.
    This only reinforces the above: that she's our plaything, to be abused at our will, unless she can please us.
    Exactly: she's terrified. And the mere fact that she's doing this indicates she's terrified, feels trapped and is doing something stupid, because she sees no other option. Note what Quite Willow says after she acts out:
    this is from a servant of the clan. And here is someone who may as well be a member of the clan that owns her, set to rule over the place like it's her own personal fief. More importantly, she was likely captured and enslaved from raid that destroyed her home, likely by Mu Clan.

    She's going to misinterpret everything in the worst possible way.
     
  9. rcnr

    rcnr Dangerously Chuuni

    Joined:
    May 9, 2014
    Messages:
    3,153
    Likes Received:
    3,026
    I don't understand how the "we don't give out free rides" part of that writein is supposed to advance any of our goals.
     
    Anaerobie likes this.
  10. Darkened

    Darkened Experienced.

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2014
    Messages:
    3,552
    Likes Received:
    7,514
    Legally speaking, Little Bee doesn't really own much at all here. You don't know how much de facto authority you have, but de jure there's not really much you could do if you gave an order and everyone just ignored it. In terms of having Miren killed, who knows, she's a valuable commodity at C+ and someone who almost certainly outranks you probably paid a lot of money for her.

    How much of that Miren knows, you don't know.

    Edit: To clarify, Stone Soul's an active duty member of the army whose made her own arrangements. In practice, you have no real authority over her whatsoever, nor does anyone else at the estate.

    The staff members are employed by the Mu clan, and the clan is powerful enough to essentially be the law in a small community like this. As you've been sent here, you're nominally in charge, but you're not ultimately a clan member. If you really push them, as far as you can tell, they may go around you.

    Miren has the lowest overall status, but she's also a possession. If you were to harm her, it wouldn't be 'hurting a staff member' but 'damage so and so's possession'. In this sense, she has an unusual degree of bargaining power given her nominal status. Of course this doesn't apply so much if you're more aware of who her owner is.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2015
  11. Arkeus

    Arkeus Crazy cat guy

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,175
    Likes Received:
    3,750
    No- Her deal is that if we "fuck with her" or "her toy", she is attacking us.
    No, this indicate that these kind of actions would put her in our shit list, and she has to be good before she can ask for special favours.

    No, no she hasn't, and we haven't.
    No.
    Exactly, hence why either the default responses or this write-in works. All the other write-ins are basically incredibly creepy for her.
     
  12. BFldyq

    BFldyq It's pronounced Be-Fled-Ick

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2014
    Messages:
    14,378
    Likes Received:
    14,317
    Reread. Would it help if I clarify that the deal is "she's nice and obedient, but in return, she doesn't want us mistreating her or Rocky, and she'll attack us if we break the deal"?
    That's what you mean. What she hears is completely different: she's working off the assumption that we'll be cruel and tyrannical as the default. Everything said and done will be filtered through that lens.
    Yes, she did. That's what being a toadie means. And just because refusing is not the intention, doesn't mean she won't interpret it that way.
    Again, that's what she's going to think.
    Except this write-in is bad as well!
     
  13. rcnr

    rcnr Dangerously Chuuni

    Joined:
    May 9, 2014
    Messages:
    3,153
    Likes Received:
    3,026
    I don't understand what you mean by this, could you expand on it?
     
  14. Arkeus

    Arkeus Crazy cat guy

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,175
    Likes Received:
    3,750
    Reread.
    Exactly. And her lens are "this language I can understand". I like this write-in because it's a language that tells her "If you respect me I won't fuck with you", and it's not playing on how she has been lied to all her life/etc. It's direct, and she'll like that.
    No, that's not what it means.
    This write-in is tailored for her to understand.
     
  15. Arkeus

    Arkeus Crazy cat guy

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,175
    Likes Received:
    3,750
    Basically, most of the other write-in are either interpreting her words in specific ways and are about trying to pretend that we are completely innocent (which she will never buy) or it's about trying to pretend we have it a third as bad as she has had it. E.G, "what would you do if you were in my place". Asking for a slave to "put herself in the palce of the mistress of the house" is... Well, you get it.

    Your write-in was actually not bad, but it was still "Hey, I am not a princess!" defense, which when you are saying this to someone who is apparently at the end of her rope and you yourself are apparently a pampered lady, is... well, probably not going to get anything but hatred.

    What I like about this write-in is that it plays on her expectation: it doesn't pretend we aren't going to be what she thinks we are, but it instead gives her a clear way to get what she wants.
     
  16. BFldyq

    BFldyq It's pronounced Be-Fled-Ick

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2014
    Messages:
    14,378
    Likes Received:
    14,317
    No, her lens is "I am a slave, who can expect nothing but abuse and mistreatment".
    Toadie: a person who flatters and ingratiates himself or herself in a servile way; sycophant

    Synonyms: Yes man, bootlicker, flunkey, lackey
    But she already gave the terms: she's an obedient suck-up, in return for not being mistreated. We do so anyway, we die.

    And more importantly, she's not going to trust us if she doesn't think we're scared of being killed.
     
  17. rcnr

    rcnr Dangerously Chuuni

    Joined:
    May 9, 2014
    Messages:
    3,153
    Likes Received:
    3,026
    Oh, okay. That was what you meant by "reword that sentence"?

    In any case, if we're playing to her expectations, how likely is it that our kindness/apathy/not-abuse gets taken as her intimidation working? How are we going to avoid that?
     
  18. Pandemonious Ivy

    Pandemonious Ivy Making the rounds.

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2015
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    35
    I need to address this. This is the third or so time you've said this.

    I'm almost positive that she isn't as utterly glue-sniffingly idiotic as you're portraying her. The situation that is illustrated by "What would you do" is clearly and bluntly outlined. It's very very difficult to misinterpret that as anything other than "If I came and fucked with your friends, how would you react? You're doing that thing to me now. Imagine me reacting like that." Very. Very. Very. Very. Easy to understand. I'm not sure where this very abstract interpretation of my write-in came from, and while I don't mind disagreeing with it (you've been good about explaining your reasons), I do take issue with blatant misunderstandings.

    This isn't addressing social status at all. It's addressing something much more basic and easy to understand for everyone: You're fucking with my friends. How would you feel if this happened to you?

    Easy. Carry on with your lobbying against my write-in.
     
  19. Arkeus

    Arkeus Crazy cat guy

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,175
    Likes Received:
    3,750
    This seems I misunderstood you then, as I somehow didn't read it like that.
    Isn't that currently the scenario though? E.G, Miren is currently thinking we are going to fuck with hers, so what we are seeing right now is her reaction to that. Anyway, my issue is less with 'social status', and more with "How dare this little princess compare herself to me?", which, yes, has to do with social status, but is more of a emotional thing.
    Ahah, I am actually not lobbying, I just like talking about stuff I like too much <_<
     
    Pandemonious Ivy likes this.
  20. Pandemonious Ivy

    Pandemonious Ivy Making the rounds.

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2015
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    35
    Exactly. Miren is acting this way out of fear for her family. So we point that out. That's what my write-in is.

    Depending on how she interprets it, the most likely reactions are shame or fear. Shame for terrorizing someone so they won't do the same to her. Fear that we might retaliate in the way she thinks she would if we messed with her family. It's tapping into the fact that she's clearly anxious and not as in control as she seems, despite being relatively in control.

    She's afraid so she's acting irrationally. We point it out. Nothing more.
     
  21. Fredo

    Fredo Eternal Lurker

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2015
    Messages:
    404
    Likes Received:
    1,024
    [X] That's not how this works. First, don't fuck with people and their family when you're asking for a favor. Second, if you want anything then you apply yourself, prove yourself, to earn it. I'm not giving out free rides.
     
  22. LeoAbogos

    LeoAbogos Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2014
    Messages:
    1,140
    Likes Received:
    2,516
    I admit my write-in is a bit ambiguous, but that's at least partially by design (the rest of it is lack of sleep). My broad intention was to reject her strong-arm approach to bargaining above anything else. Then I turn around and basically offer her the same deal as she outlined; this was purposeful. The phrasing I used does imply that I don't accept her side of her offer as being as... fully genuine. I think it could be, but given her method of delivering her terms and demonstrated decorum, I am skeptical that her picture of fulfilling her side matches with a more popular view of what that should look like, so I am rephrasing them in a way that puts work ethic a bit more central. By no means do I expect her to become the perfectly obedient slave, but I think learning to perform closer to within the (positive) expectations of others would ultimately be to her benefit, and I'd like to get her started on that path sooner than later if possible.

    The somewhat rough phrasing of my write-in is also intended (at least partially in retrospect, I admit) to act as a gauge of Miren's personality. Right now, we only have a very general picture of her. I'm curious to see how she reacts to a somewhat hostile but ultimately reasonable offer(the parallels between Little Bee and Miren are pretty hilarious; kudos Darkened). I'm curious to see how she interprets it as well, because it could be taken a few different ways.

    I considered a more empathetic approach, but I think that both Little Bee and Miren are a bit too focussed on the traumas of them and theirs, and I don't want it to devolve into a contest of who has the suckier life.
     
    Darkened likes this.
  23. redaeth

    redaeth Stubborn pedantrist

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2013
    Messages:
    8,108
    Likes Received:
    6,255
    Poor Rocky, he doesn't even have a specialty. I can see why Miten wants to protect the poor girly boy.

    Some interesting information on leveling, ranks and classes from just looking over these barebone statsheets. Looks like some D ranks simply get no specialty classes, while actually leveling up isn't something that is only combat oriented. Which makes sense of course given we received XP for running at the very start. Though we haven't seen much of that afterwords.

    My guess is XP gains are largely based on class. We get combat XP more often then we get life XP simply because of we are a combat oriented leader. Of course you can tell that combat and being pressed to be your very best makes a huge difference. Stone Soul is one level above the highest servant on the grounds... and that is Green Stone who is 62 years old. That is a huge difference in age and time spent accruing XP.

     
  24. Darkened

    Darkened Experienced.

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2014
    Messages:
    3,552
    Likes Received:
    7,514
    This is correct. It's also the case that you're going to see a lot less work that could really challenge a utility or craft class as level increases. Sure some classes like artists are primarily pushing against their own limits, but, particularly lower ranking servant types are just not usually going to see the kind of housework that's at level that often.

    It's also potentially the case that the army is a hellishly competitive hellhole for prodigies, where constantly striving to stay ahead of the age/level curve is vital for success for all but the best connected elites.
     
    Anaerobie and Arkeus like this.
  25. Arkeus

    Arkeus Crazy cat guy

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,175
    Likes Received:
    3,750
    Poor Stone Soul, being releated to kitchen duty and losing all her hope for promotion.

    Clearly she must suck up to us for when we become empress.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2015
    LeoAbogos likes this.
  26. redaeth

    redaeth Stubborn pedantrist

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2013
    Messages:
    8,108
    Likes Received:
    6,255
    Hmm, the vote is tied. And given no one has voted in a couple days we need a tie breaker.

    Vote Tally : Those Blessed with Talent | Page 29 | Questionable Questing
    ##### NetTally 1.1.5
    [5] Ask her, if she were in your shoes- weary, stressed, and in an unfamiliar place- how would she react to having her friends threatened directly in front of her face. : (Pandemonious Ivy, john doe, PineTreeq, redaeth, wayne82444)
    [5] That's not how this works. First, don't fuck with people and their family when you're asking for a favor. Second, if you want anything then you apply yourself, prove yourself, to earn it. I'm not giving out free rides. : (LeoAbogos, Anaerobie, Arkeus, Fredo, rcnr)
    [3] Refuse! The streets have taught you that if you give anyone an inch ever, they're going to just walk all over you. How can you let the staff do that? : (Falconis, Jiven, massdefect76)
    [1] I had no reason to fuck with either of you before you choked me and hurt my friends. I still have no reason to fuck with you if you put me down, because I understand being afraid for the sake of your friend or whatever Ox is to you. If you hurt me, we both die. So let me down and leave me alone. : (DOOMPOTATO)
    [1] write-in/plan Sirrocco/micromake : (Sirrocco)
    [1] Isn't this jumping the gun? I mean, your a crippled 11 year old. You won't be fucking anyone for years yet. : (BFldyq)
     
    Pandemonious Ivy and Darkened like this.
  27. Seventeen

    Seventeen 7th in primes, last in doing-things-with-my-life

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2014
    Messages:
    1,123
    Likes Received:
    1,359
    [X] That's not how this works. First, don't fuck with people and their family when you're asking for a favor. Second, if you want anything then you apply yourself, prove yourself, to earn it. I'm not giving out free rides.

    Just discovered this quest. Not bad.
     
  28. BFldyq

    BFldyq It's pronounced Be-Fled-Ick

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2014
    Messages:
    14,378
    Likes Received:
    14,317
    [X] Ask her, if she were in your shoes- weary, stressed, and in an unfamiliar place- how would she react to having her friends threatened directly in front of her face.

    Because the other option is worse.
     
  29. Raron

    Raron I trust you know where the happy button is?

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2015
    Messages:
    662
    Likes Received:
    331
    [X] Ask her, if she were in your shoes- weary, stressed, and in an unfamiliar place- how would she react to having her friends threatened directly in front of her face.
     
  30. Darkened

    Darkened Experienced.

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2014
    Messages:
    3,552
    Likes Received:
    7,514
    Going to give the vote 9 more hours and hopefully update at work.
     
Loading...