1. Due to issues with external spam filters, QQ is currently unable to send any mail to Microsoft E-mail addresses. This includes any account at live.com, hotmail.com or msn.com. Signing up to the forum with one of these addresses will result in your verification E-mail never arriving. For best results, please use a different E-mail provider for your QQ address.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. For prospective new members, a word of warning: don't use common names like Dennis, Simon, or Kenny if you decide to create an account. Spammers have used them all before you and gotten those names flagged in the anti-spam databases. Your account registration will be rejected because of it.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Since it has happened MULTIPLE times now, I want to be very clear about this. You do not get to abandon an account and create a new one. You do not get to pass an account to someone else and create a new one. If you do so anyway, you will be banned for creating sockpuppets.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. If you wish to change your username, please ask via conversation to tehelgee instead of asking via my profile. I'd like to not clutter it up with such requests.
    Dismiss Notice
  5. Due to the actions of particularly persistent spammers and trolls, we will be banning disposable email addresses from today onward.
    Dismiss Notice
  6. We have added another rule, please check the Rules post for more information.
    Dismiss Notice
  7. Due to some issues with Freenode, the QQ IRC Channel is moving. See here for more information.
    Dismiss Notice

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Discussion in 'Creative Writing' started by Mr Zoat, Jan 27, 2019.

Loading...
  1. mastermenthe

    mastermenthe Mint Thistle

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2018
    Messages:
    78
    Likes Received:
    453
    Obviously, if OL os thinking about preparing himself against the demonic invasion is running afoul of John Constantine's "do not come find me" warding spells! Which is also the reason why it took him so long to come up with alternatives, and why OL is being so ADHD about which ways they and he could help, because any "path to dealing with the demonic invasion" that runs afoul of "do not find Constantine" has to reboot and do workarounds to get past the forbidden access error.

    Hold up! That is why New Kara is sticking to OL so strongly! Kara Zor-L has had Torqueasm up and running non-stop ever since OL opened her pod! Torqueasm is protecting New Kara from Constantine's spell! New Kara can sense Constantine's spell affecting OL and is following him like a concerned dog following their human when they smell their human has a disease!

    Thing is, because of how OL... or rather, because of how Paul, any variant, naturally acts around others, his default reaction is to avoid betraying expectations, which means New Kara is right to blindly trust in OL, even if she doesn't know why she is right.
     
  2. crazygrox

    crazygrox I trust you know where the happy button is?

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2016
    Messages:
    930
    Likes Received:
    5,231
    Even if he is incomparably more powerful than the local version, which we don't know yet(just that he comes from a parallel where the 'demon corrupting Superman plan' was tried and worked), flash would still find it hard to deal with an opponent who can fly, defend themselves against thrown objects, and throw out area of effect attacks that are large enough that he can't see the edges of area from inside of it(the fact that the opponent is familiar with his weaknesses and counter tactics is just a cherry on top).
    Attacks don't have to propagate outward from a middle and thus be possible to outrun, they can take the form of a fence expanding inwards, covering an area larger than the what can be seen to the horizon, or appearing simultaneously throughout the entire affected volume, so by the time he sees it it's too late.

    The man has had serious fights with rogues who are essentially normal humans with signature weapons, powerlevels are less important than tactics. And while not trying to take the opposition alive is a tactical advantage, it's not enough of one.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2021
  3. Vaermina

    Vaermina Experienced.

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2015
    Messages:
    2,681
    Likes Received:
    8,731
    Yea but see... That's in a fight...

    With Flash's speed there is no fight... Because you're dead before you even realize you're being attacked...
     
    Cuchulin likes this.
  4. Zig

    Zig Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2016
    Messages:
    184
    Likes Received:
    793
    Is that the case anywhere other than the Pre Crisis CW Verse? We don't even know if it's the case after their crisis.
     
    Cuchulin, Xmaster3000 and Ardy like this.
  5. crazygrox

    crazygrox I trust you know where the happy button is?

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2016
    Messages:
    930
    Likes Received:
    5,231
    In second thought. I think this might make their relationship better?

    Not like I know how to deal with long-distance relationships, power imbalances, or imbalances in commitment to the relationship either though.
     
    Prince Charon and Xmaster3000 like this.
  6. Assblaster5000

    Assblaster5000 Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2020
    Messages:
    406
    Likes Received:
    1,658
    I... source? Because last time I checked both of those are fundamental forces in DC and, while I don't mean to downplay the Speedforce, Flash has never one-shot a Sun Eater, which Parallax Hal Jordan absolutely has. (Yes, I know there was more going on than just Spectrum stuff there, but the point stands)
     
    Cuchulin, Xmaster3000, Jaron and 2 others like this.
  7. Zig

    Zig Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2016
    Messages:
    184
    Likes Received:
    793
    Also, Speedforce isn't even a part of the Young Justice universe.
     
  8. Assblaster5000

    Assblaster5000 Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2020
    Messages:
    406
    Likes Received:
    1,658
    IIRC there isn't actually an official standpoint on it from DC, and the show runners have said that if you want it to be a part of it then that's just as valid as it not being in Young Justice.

    But yes, if it isn't a part of Universe-16 in Zoat's canon then that kind of removes a theoretical Demon-Flash as a threat.
     
    Cuchulin and Xmaster3000 like this.
  9. Zig

    Zig Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2016
    Messages:
    184
    Likes Received:
    793
    If you want there to be an invisible pink unicorn following OL around at all times that's also valid. I don't recall if Zoat has explicitly changed it, but Greg Weismann said there is no speed force in Universe 16, and that there is no reason for it to exist in the comics where it was stated to exist.
     
    Cuchulin and Xmaster3000 like this.
  10. Bramble Thorn

    Bramble Thorn Verified Silhouette

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2015
    Messages:
    385
    Likes Received:
    2,495
    From the context, references. I'm mean sure all her referees are also dead. But that shouldn't stop her from playing sports on earth in an of itself.
     
  11. Stsword

    Stsword Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2017
    Messages:
    1,110
    Likes Received:
    6,106
    I don't know why people keep misrepresenting Greg's position. It took one whole google search to show that has been inaccurate for over a decade now.

    And AGAIN, I'll restate what I've stated many times since, which is that no one on Earth-16 has HEARD of the Speed-Force. If you want to believe it's there, but they just don't know about it, more power to you.

    I don't know that I changed my position as opposed to nuanced it slightly. And even that I did years ago. I'm still not a big fan of the concept. But instead of saying/claiming it doesn't exist, I took a couple steps back and said that no one on Earth-16 has heard of the Speed-Force. Whether or not it "exists" becomes a SPOILER REQUEST.

    I also find it odd that people who grew up on Willpower being both solid and green for crying out loud have conniptions about the speedforce. Elementals like Swamp Thing and Animal Man use a scientific concept that was debunked in the 30s.
     
  12. gattsuru

    gattsuru Getting out there.

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2016
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    54
    It’s less that it’s goofy — it is, but so is a lot of other comic book stuff — and more that it doesn’t mean much, and authors haven’t really tried to make it mean much. Anything a speedster needs to do can be tied to the Speed Force, but you have to shake it pretty hard to get a weakness, a motivation, or a complication out of it. The Emotional Spectrum and morphogenetic fields were like that when they first came out, but Batman’s used a field disruptor on Swamp Thing and the rock-paper-scissors nature of the Emotions is often overused. The Speed Force or HawkGod, not so much.

    Some writers can get away with convenient explanations that always help sometimes. But it’s a spot that attracts focus.
     
  13. Zig

    Zig Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2016
    Messages:
    184
    Likes Received:
    793
    I was aware of the first post but had not seen the second. Still, if no one, which would Jay Garrick, Barry Allen, and Thawne, has heard of it, and you choose to believe it exists? Ehh I suppose you can, but it certainly isn't a given that it is, and given that his other answers on the subject have called it a stupid idea I'm not inclined to believe it does exist in his works. Then again, he did say "if there's a speed force why isn't there a strength force? or a smart force?" and now we have those other forces so maybe he did change his position on the matter. You've also got me curious to look up what he's said on the emotional spectrum.
     
  14. Threadmarks: Past Participant (part 6)
    Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2016
    Messages:
    9,990
    Likes Received:
    439,860
    16th September 2012
    12:37 GMT -6


    Liberty, Iowa.

    It used to be a medium sized farming town. Then farming techniques improved and farming itself became less profitable, and the vitality started ebbing away. And then some combination of John Constantine, the Resurrection Crusade and an actual resurrection of the town's war dead completely destroyed it. A few survivors were written off as delusional and are now either happily living somewhere else or guests of the state in various secure hospitals.

    A ghost town. My rune stone says that it's mildly thaumically active, noticeably above background. I don't know whether it's a literal ghost town or not. All known sites at which the Resurrection Crusade practised magic ceased functioning when the last of their elders were killed, but no one ever checked the place over.

    "Orange Lantern and Supergirl... Three, on-site. Beginning search."

    "What are we looking for?"

    "Anything that looks like a demon. Anything that looks like it comes from a parallel universe. Anything-. No."

    I roll my eyes as Kara points to herself.

    "Unless you're secretly a demon and want to mutter about no one else having 'the mark'."

    She taps the middle of her chest with her right forefinger.

    "I have the mark. It's the symbol of House El."

    "I'm not sure it counts if it's worn on clothing, but well prepared."

    Scanning for intruders… Nothing, but that's hardly a surprise. If you're establishing a bridgehead into hostile territory you either flood the place or you send a small team who won't be spotted easily. And with there being no one around…

    "Are you seeing anything odd?"

    "I don't know. I've never been here before." She sniffs. "There's a strange smell, though."

    Ring? Oh. Chemicals consistent with burned flesh. Burned human flesh. Doesn't seem to go anywhere, though it does suggest that something strange is happening. Incendiaries were used when the town was destroyed but the residue shouldn't be airborne after over a decade.

    "Do you know what it is?" She sniffs again. "It smells like bacon. I think I like it."

    Ring, anything unexpected but not demonic?

    Ah. Recent signs of habitation. A couple of the cars are out of place from where they were abandoned when the survivors fled the town. Wood has been removed from some of the less intact buildings, and it looks like someone has gone through the gardens.

    Someone or some people has/have been living here. Living here for a while… But then Truggs didn't tell me how long Demongirl had been here for.

    "Ooh! And I smell people!" Kara flies off to the north. "Over here!"

    I fly after her, generating construct armour to go over my power armour. Nothing on infrared, nothing on sonics, someone is definitely hiding themselves. Only question is, are they magic-using hermits or are they our target?

    "HELLO!"

    I consider remonstrating with Kara as she puts her hands to her mouth to announce our presence. But we're hanging here in the open sky within easy view of the ground. Just announcing ourselves isn't a terrible way to go, especially if whoever is there is nothing to do with the Demon Earth.

    "IS THERE ANYONE THERE?! WE'RE SUPERHEROES AND WE'RE HERE TO HELP!"

    Kara bows her head slightly and closes her eyes. Trying to hear a response. I'm still not picking anything up, but I could try more exotic forms of scan if this doesn't-.

    Kara's eyes snap open and she points to a house in reasonable repair. "That one."

    "Sure?"

    She nods. "The sounds don't match what I can see. And the-" She sniffs again. "-smells coming from it are weird."

    "Weird how?"

    "Like… There's one smell… And then there's a different smell? You know?"

    "No, I don't know. Is the kryptonian sense of smell actually sensing chemicals in the air, or does it work in some other way?"

    "I don't know. I've only had it for a couple of days, silly."

    "Alright."

    I free the hellwraith from my ring and send it forward towards the detached house indicated. Huh. Actually, this would be a decent place for a superhero base, if the superhero in question could do long distance teleportation. An attacker would find it very difficult to hide their approach, there's plenty of space and-.

    "Mastaaaaaaaah!"

    I watch as the hellwraith is consumed in golden fire as it enters the house's garden. I instruct it to pull back but the flames don’t relent. It burns for a few seconds and then it's gone.

    I give it a moment, but there's no sudden rush of knowledge that would come from it returning to my rings. I try deploying it again and nothing happens.

    Couldn't happen to a nicer demon.

    I create a megaphone construct.

    "Whoever's in the house! This is the Justice League! Please come out with your hands visible and carrying no arcane paraphernalia! You have until the count of five to comply or reply, then we will force entry!"

    "Stop! Stop!"

    "Sir?! Are you under threat?!"

    "I can't-! He won't let me take it off!"

    I can't locate the speaker. Even looking right through the windows reveals nothing.

    "Sir, please come out of the house, and we will endeavour to render aid."

    "O-okay! I'm coming out with my hands up! Don’t shoot, or whatever you do!"

    I generate a construct railgun and load mage slayers.

    "Sure!"

    Kara frowns disapprovingly at me, and I dismiss the megaphone construct.

    "I won't shoot. I just want it in place in case he does. This is a very precise instrument. I can use it to negate defensive and offensive spells without killing the caster, or injure them without killing them."

    "Oh. Well, that's okay then."

    "I'm at the door!"

    "Alright sir, you can come on out."

    The door swings open as far as its hinges will allow it, slamming into the house's outer wall and bouncing back. A man with pale skin dressed in loose fitting cotton and denim clothing slowly walks out, my eyes immediately drawn to the golden skull-helmet covering his entire head.

    "Please, help me. It won't let me take it off."
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2022
  15. Syphi

    Syphi Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2016
    Messages:
    114
    Likes Received:
    1,070
    Lovely. Someone invited an alternate Nabu
     
  16. Ngamer11

    Ngamer11 Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2019
    Messages:
    1,332
    Likes Received:
    6,969
    That's a shame. The hellwraith is actually useful in some situations. Hopefully Paul can buy a replacement from Mammon in the future.


    Are we doing alternate Nabus now? Or did he keep a spare helmet somewhere?
     
  17. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2019
    Messages:
    12,240
    Likes Received:
    143,987
    Kinda hoping that after the whole reveal that magic is real that they've been released.

    Though after seeing what Constantine does they'll probably need therapy.

    Prepare to no longer eat bacon after this, Kara 3.

    And probably embracing veganism.

    Ah, super voice.

    One of the many, many powers of Silver Age Kryptonians.

    Hmm, if this is demon related then one smell may be a host and the other a demon that's possessing said host.

    Okay, so this may be Angelic in nature, somehow.

    Nabu?

    So he either somehow came back, or someone is here to avenge him, or the Plane of Order sent someone else to take up his duties and they didn't have a great start.
     
    Finerc, Ardy, Cuchulin and 9 others like this.
  18. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2019
    Messages:
    12,240
    Likes Received:
    143,987
    If I remember correctly after Kent and Nabu stopped working together, Kent made his own weaker version of a Helm to help in crime fighting, so there are technically spares around.

    And now that you mentioned alternate Nabus, I'm getting the feeling that this is Nabu from Demon Earth, and he's here to either seek help, or just to flee from the Hell his world has become.

    Or help the demons if he's been corrupted somehow.

    Though the golden fire may point to him not being corrupted.
     
    Finerc, Ardy, Cuchulin and 10 others like this.
  19. Assblaster5000

    Assblaster5000 Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2020
    Messages:
    406
    Likes Received:
    1,658
    My concerns are grand and (mostly) all encompassing.

    [Insert Among Us Joke Here]
     
  20. Michael Vonica

    Michael Vonica Know what you're doing yet?

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2021
    Messages:
    140
    Likes Received:
    449
    I believe the golden fire simply represents the orderly alignment of the magic used. Order and chaos do not equate to good and evil. Something can be both orderly and evil, like a ritual sacrifice, as long as it's done methodically.
     
    Finerc, Ardy, HearthBorn and 13 others like this.
  21. crazygrox

    crazygrox I trust you know where the happy button is?

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2016
    Messages:
    930
    Likes Received:
    5,231
    I am fairly convinced that this is demon-dimension Nabu.

    But he's setting up anti-hellwraith wards, he might be opposed to the demon earth, and coming to warn the local heroes.
     
    Ardy, Cuchulin and moralrelativity like this.
  22. Stsword

    Stsword Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2017
    Messages:
    1,110
    Likes Received:
    6,106
    Jay had been a speedster for over 50 years before he had ever heard of it in the comics, and Barry was already dead. It's not necessarily like the tv show where the Speed Force shows up for tea.

    And no it's not my position that the Speedforce exists in YJ. IT's my position that unless one is writing a YJ fanfic then one should do everyone a favor and stop with the "It doesn't exist in YJ" as if anyone's opinion but the author's is actually relevant as to what is true in an author's creation.

    Unless someone is doing a Quest and "Does this story use the Speedforce?" is a vote put forward, of course.

    As for the Emotional Electromagnetic Spectrum, last I checked he stated that Sinestro was a GL villain, but claimed SPOILERS when asked about the rest of the rainbow lanterns.
     
    Cuchulin, HearthBorn, zeebza and 5 others like this.
  23. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2019
    Messages:
    12,240
    Likes Received:
    143,987
    Golden fire is typically used by the Silver City, so that's why I think that he may not be demonically corrupted.

    Unless he is corrupted but figured out a way to use theurgy without damaging himself, which may be possible.
     
    Cuchulin and moralrelativity like this.
  24. NightmareWarden

    NightmareWarden Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2015
    Messages:
    492
    Likes Received:
    2,019
    Hellwraith!

    Another construct lantern lost… Hey I wonder if some impression of Teekl and other fallen lanterns survives in the Honden. Or we could learn what Ophidian and Hellwraith talked about over the ages it was inactive.

    Huh. I had a thought. Is there any chance Paul will turn a villainous supergirl into a construct lantern going forward?
     
    Ardy, Cuchulin, Wheenesss and 2 others like this.
  25. DrThoth

    DrThoth I trust you know where the happy button is?

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2016
    Messages:
    634
    Likes Received:
    2,617
    Have the Controllers managed to revert any construct Lanterns yet? What happens if they're destroyed like all of Paragon's constructs are now? (Except for the Saremite, I think, who he made into a construct ring?). Do they pass on into the afterlife or whatever happens when beings like them normally die?
     
  26. Chojin Patriarch

    Chojin Patriarch Veteran Lurker

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2019
    Messages:
    1,291
    Likes Received:
    20,748
    So, an average Constantine event. I would laugh if this turned out to be where John's hiding out while he takes care of Nabu-related business, and OL's accidentally overcome whatever kind of 'not now, do something else' effect John might have set on him... On the other hand, it sounds like a prime site for a Daemonic invasion...

    See? That's really getting kind of annoying... I can understand the place going relatively unnoticed, though. Giovanni was probably rather busy with more notable sites, if he got alerted to it at all. And I doubt other magicians remotely wanted to stick their nose into a Constantine mess...

    Well, anything other than Kara-1 herself. On the upside, she's probably a good choice to have along, with her super-supers-senses.

    ...We can't really rule something like that out, after all. Her arrival was still rather suspicious...

    I suspect placement matters. Truggs at least showed there isn't a mystical component, though. So just painting the 'S' on your forehead should do.

    On the other hand, any life-signs would be very noticeable in the quiet... Unless they're smart enough to use stealth magic.

    Let me guess... It smells like bacon?

    I don't think you will, once you learn what it is. But the fact that it's fresh is.. concerning. :confused:

    Squatters, it seems. Ones who needed to patch up their pad. Time to look for houses with signs of repairs.

    Oh hell, there goes the hope of surprising anyone.

    Oh, right, super-lungs: When she projects, she really projects.

    At least she kept the volume down low enough that anyone in the path of her call won't be bleeding from the ears...

    Well, at least those super-duper-senses are coming in handy, even if she basically has a negative wisdom value...

    Tasty weird or nasty weird? There's a big difference.

    ...Okay, be nice. Remember, she probably doesn't know the names for the scents she's picking up...

    Okay, if you both survive the next few days: Get her up to speed on... Just about everything about Earth.

    Who knows what's been built underground by now? Seriously, if I were moving into a town like this, I'd definitely have a secret underground lair set up inside the first few weeks.

    ...Well, that's not bad. Someone has extensive warding, yes. But given it was a demon, those wards are likely Orderly or Theurgistic in nature...

    ...Wards that can destroy Construct Lanterns outright? Oh, dear...

    How very sensible. Don't know what the wards will do to flesh, after all. Could be anything from a simple Magic Circle Against Evil, that acts like a solid wall to 'evil' creatures, to a wall of Disintegration...

    Judging by the amount of yellow, I would say he's definitely stressed...

    Big-time cloaking wards. Whoever's in there clearly has some significant magical know-wots...

    Huh, I'm impressed that worked. So, whoever's inside is likely not hostile... To them at least.

    Rule 1: Be prepared for anything. Just because they sound friendly does not mean they are.

    Plus, it's more than likely that if they aren't killed outright, he can put them back together without too much hassle.

    Well, this shouldn't take to long to sort out...

    ...Or not. This could be a problem...

    Okay, well... We at least know it's not Nabu-16, as John Quinn presumably has the helmet with him. So this is some alternate universe Nabu, or some being who chose a similar method of existence. It's likely that this might be Nabu from Earth-Hell, somehow remaining untainted by the demonic energies, if only by rule of narrative convenience. I guess we'll see, tomorrow.
     
  27. Vaermina

    Vaermina Experienced.

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2015
    Messages:
    2,681
    Likes Received:
    8,731
    The Speed Force controls the Time, Space, and Movement of everything.
     
    Cuchulin likes this.
  28. transhumansage

    transhumansage I trust you know where the happy button is?

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2016
    Messages:
    866
    Likes Received:
    2,332
    kerleth and moralrelativity like this.
  29. Doccer

    Doccer Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2019
    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    1,013
    Where did that pic come from?
     
    kerleth likes this.
  30. Assblaster5000

    Assblaster5000 Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2020
    Messages:
    406
    Likes Received:
    1,658
    Again, source? Not saying that isn't the case, because this is comics and it probably is (despite there almost certainly being five different things that contradict that), but you're just saying that without a single link or anything to back it up.
     
    Doccer, Ardy, Cuchulin and 1 other person like this.
Loading...