CrazyNoVa
Not too sore, are you?
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Well, in canon, Final Crisis essentially says that the answer is yes, but in this story, who knows? Everything's been nerfed, so I don't know if that applies here or not.
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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
- Start date
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- self insert young justice
Well, in canon, Final Crisis essentially says that the answer is yes, but in this story, who knows? Everything's been nerfed, so I don't know if that applies here or not.
Darko
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Nope.
New Gods in this story are just powerful demigods, not avatars for some higher self.
hkim
Know what you're doing yet?
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Stsword
Versed in the lewd.
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That's post flashpoint continuity.
As a rule (This story has used bits and pieces, like Kon meaning abomination in Kryptonese), we have no truck with post flashpoint continuity here.
Mr Zoat
Dedicated ragequitter
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Did they steal that from Transformers?
Basically, none of that in canon here. As far as I'm concerned, each instance of Darkseid or whoever is only linked to other versions of that character in the same way that all other characters are. With the possible exception of Psycho Pirate.
boo600
Welp
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Ah, the Dalek Sludge. Yes, they were very poo-like. No, I didn't make the connection. I don't feel that name-calling is necessary; it's been over a decade since that came out, and I certainly haven't rewatched it. (Though I liked some of what they did with Missy before her inevitable return to being the Master, that was later than Clara).
hkim
Know what you're doing yet?
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Don't worry -
- it's not you being called a name there.
Prince Charon
Just zis guy, you know?
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Well, there are (disturbingly) always more serial killers to hunt...
Frozen20XX
Getting sticky.
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Don't think so.. though at least Transformers ditched the multivetsal singularity concept after they got sick of the conflicts.
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Motivations (part 29)
New
Mr Zoat
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16th August 2013
10:39 GMT
"…just left." Karsta Wor-Ul glances in the direction of the mainland and snorts. "I don't know what they think they're going to find, but as far as I'm concerned they're not my problem any more."
"A way for anarcho-collectivism to work successfully?" I wave my right hand dismissively. "They've been given the minimal supplies the Green Lantern Corps gives people. If they make it, fine. If they don't-."
"Nothing much lost." She nods. "I'm more worried about them raiding us when their food runs out."
"If you can't beat them with kryptonian powers and the Doomsday, I… Don't know what to tell you. Do you want me to give you guns or something?"
She thinks for a moment, then shakes her head. "No. That would just make things worse." She exhales. "Alright. How did it go?"
"Ah… The handover went fine. One of the Dominion's middle managers turned up to make sure they were in one piece and not carrying recording equipment, then they were on the transport back home."
"Did you hide any recording equipment on them?"
"No, they'd probably have found it and then they'd know what our equipment looks like. And they'd probably class it as provocation. I don't want to deal with the Dominion more than I absolutely have to."
"So, that's it? They get to report back everything they learned-."
"No." I frown. "Of course not. We had the g-gnomes right there. We edited their memories so that they wouldn't remember anything."
"That's reliable?"
"Not completely, but they're pretty good. Unless the Dominion has a really good telepath they trust with high security work, those memories will stay gone. And even then, the g-gnomes added enough nonsense that they won't be reliable."
"And what about the spy? Lyla?"
"Ah…"
"Is she dead?"
"… No. It's…" I sigh. "Timaronian law is based on Kryptonian law, right?"
She nods. "As far as I remember, for some things."
"Right, well, if a member of a human military did what Ursa Dou-Ka did, they'd be punished according to the full weight of the law, because any officer should know that they're not supposed to murder billions of people. But in Kryptonian law-."
"Legitimate orders." Karsta Wor-Ul nods. "A subordinate isn't necessarily going to know all the pertinent facts, and they're not qualified to make that judgement."
I nod. "The in-absentia ruling was that while she might have committed crimes against Krypton, the court didn't have jurisdiction over those, and all her lawyer had to say under Timaronian law was that she trusted in Dru-Zod's judgement. Not guilty."
"So she ran off with the dominators despite the fact that she wasn't going to get punished."
"She's guilty of absconding, but even Amalak wasn't going to bother pursuing her over something that minor. Plus there's a good chance that whatever the dominators are doing to her is worse than the punishment anyway." I shrug. "She didn't know that she wasn't technically guilty. I guess she… Weighed things up and decided to take the risk."
Karsta Wor-Ul nods. "What about Dru-Zod and Lyla?"
"We… Established exactly how many people Lyla had mentally altered."
"Didn't Kon-El say that her people were only weakly telepathic?"
"Yes." I nod. "The scans I took of her brain showed that the dominators have made a lot of modifications. Some I recognised from other telepathic species, and others… I guess they were synthetic. Whatever they did to her cells to accept kryptonian organelles may have helped, though I've got no idea how it worked."
"Don't look at me. I learned basic field medicine."
"If I need to know how it could have been done, there are people on Earth I could ask. But I don't."
The only reason I'd bother is if Kon wanted to know, because if we could do that with human cells… Or Martian cells, then one of his problems would be as completely dealt with as it could be. Or M'gann could get a fully kryptonian form, which could be interesting. But he didn't seem all that interested.
"Anyway, once we undoctored Dru-Zod's memories, we discovered exactly how much of his decision was his own and how much was hers."
"Did you find out when the Dominion put their gate on Timaron?"
"She sent them a message before Dru-Zod left, but they only put it in after Krypton exploded."
"Makes sense. Even then we might have detected them opening it."
I raise my eyebrows. "'We'?"
She gives me a flat look. "You know what I mean."
"It turns out that Amalak didn't actually know that much about his people's legal system. He was halfway convinced that Dru-Zod was going to get away with it."
Karsta Wor-Ul frowns. "I wasn't a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that if someone mind controlled you into doing something, you weren't responsible."
"If they're literally puppetting you, no. But it's not like on Earth where someone under telepathic influence could probably argue that they weren't responsible for anything. Kryptonian law -and therefore Timaronian law- essentially says that if you were probably going to do it anyway and only the details of the crime changed, then you're still responsible."
"So Dru-Zod's going to fry."
"Dru-Zod fried. That's why I'm here. I thought I owed it to him to watch, but I didn't particularly want to stick around afterwards. Kal-El felt the same."
"So I'm getting my ship back?"
"In a day.. or two. Once they're sure that the Dominators have accepted the settlement."
"But you did destroy the gate-."
"Of course we destroyed the gate."
"Good. And Lyla?"
"Didn't commit any serious crimes. Not against Timaron, anyway. There was some debate about what to do with her. She didn't have any interest in going to the Dominion. We could have sent her back to her original homeworld, except that she'd end up ruling it as goddess queen in a few weeks… They eventually decided that probation was proportionate."
"On.. Earth? With the Justice League?"
I take a moment to imagine that. No, those gits would probably dump her on me if it came to it.
"Ah, no, no. With NEMO. We all get issued with mind shields as part of our standard kit, and the whole 'biggest war in the galaxy' thing appeals to her megalomania. So that's one problem dealt with."
I close my eyes. I breathe in slowly. I hold. I open my eyes. I breathe out.
"And now, back to work."
10:39 GMT
"…just left." Karsta Wor-Ul glances in the direction of the mainland and snorts. "I don't know what they think they're going to find, but as far as I'm concerned they're not my problem any more."
"A way for anarcho-collectivism to work successfully?" I wave my right hand dismissively. "They've been given the minimal supplies the Green Lantern Corps gives people. If they make it, fine. If they don't-."
"Nothing much lost." She nods. "I'm more worried about them raiding us when their food runs out."
"If you can't beat them with kryptonian powers and the Doomsday, I… Don't know what to tell you. Do you want me to give you guns or something?"
She thinks for a moment, then shakes her head. "No. That would just make things worse." She exhales. "Alright. How did it go?"
"Ah… The handover went fine. One of the Dominion's middle managers turned up to make sure they were in one piece and not carrying recording equipment, then they were on the transport back home."
"Did you hide any recording equipment on them?"
"No, they'd probably have found it and then they'd know what our equipment looks like. And they'd probably class it as provocation. I don't want to deal with the Dominion more than I absolutely have to."
"So, that's it? They get to report back everything they learned-."
"No." I frown. "Of course not. We had the g-gnomes right there. We edited their memories so that they wouldn't remember anything."
"That's reliable?"
"Not completely, but they're pretty good. Unless the Dominion has a really good telepath they trust with high security work, those memories will stay gone. And even then, the g-gnomes added enough nonsense that they won't be reliable."
"And what about the spy? Lyla?"
"Ah…"
"Is she dead?"
"… No. It's…" I sigh. "Timaronian law is based on Kryptonian law, right?"
She nods. "As far as I remember, for some things."
"Right, well, if a member of a human military did what Ursa Dou-Ka did, they'd be punished according to the full weight of the law, because any officer should know that they're not supposed to murder billions of people. But in Kryptonian law-."
"Legitimate orders." Karsta Wor-Ul nods. "A subordinate isn't necessarily going to know all the pertinent facts, and they're not qualified to make that judgement."
I nod. "The in-absentia ruling was that while she might have committed crimes against Krypton, the court didn't have jurisdiction over those, and all her lawyer had to say under Timaronian law was that she trusted in Dru-Zod's judgement. Not guilty."
"So she ran off with the dominators despite the fact that she wasn't going to get punished."
"She's guilty of absconding, but even Amalak wasn't going to bother pursuing her over something that minor. Plus there's a good chance that whatever the dominators are doing to her is worse than the punishment anyway." I shrug. "She didn't know that she wasn't technically guilty. I guess she… Weighed things up and decided to take the risk."
Karsta Wor-Ul nods. "What about Dru-Zod and Lyla?"
"We… Established exactly how many people Lyla had mentally altered."
"Didn't Kon-El say that her people were only weakly telepathic?"
"Yes." I nod. "The scans I took of her brain showed that the dominators have made a lot of modifications. Some I recognised from other telepathic species, and others… I guess they were synthetic. Whatever they did to her cells to accept kryptonian organelles may have helped, though I've got no idea how it worked."
"Don't look at me. I learned basic field medicine."
"If I need to know how it could have been done, there are people on Earth I could ask. But I don't."
The only reason I'd bother is if Kon wanted to know, because if we could do that with human cells… Or Martian cells, then one of his problems would be as completely dealt with as it could be. Or M'gann could get a fully kryptonian form, which could be interesting. But he didn't seem all that interested.
"Anyway, once we undoctored Dru-Zod's memories, we discovered exactly how much of his decision was his own and how much was hers."
"Did you find out when the Dominion put their gate on Timaron?"
"She sent them a message before Dru-Zod left, but they only put it in after Krypton exploded."
"Makes sense. Even then we might have detected them opening it."
I raise my eyebrows. "'We'?"
She gives me a flat look. "You know what I mean."
"It turns out that Amalak didn't actually know that much about his people's legal system. He was halfway convinced that Dru-Zod was going to get away with it."
Karsta Wor-Ul frowns. "I wasn't a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that if someone mind controlled you into doing something, you weren't responsible."
"If they're literally puppetting you, no. But it's not like on Earth where someone under telepathic influence could probably argue that they weren't responsible for anything. Kryptonian law -and therefore Timaronian law- essentially says that if you were probably going to do it anyway and only the details of the crime changed, then you're still responsible."
"So Dru-Zod's going to fry."
"Dru-Zod fried. That's why I'm here. I thought I owed it to him to watch, but I didn't particularly want to stick around afterwards. Kal-El felt the same."
"So I'm getting my ship back?"
"In a day.. or two. Once they're sure that the Dominators have accepted the settlement."
"But you did destroy the gate-."
"Of course we destroyed the gate."
"Good. And Lyla?"
"Didn't commit any serious crimes. Not against Timaron, anyway. There was some debate about what to do with her. She didn't have any interest in going to the Dominion. We could have sent her back to her original homeworld, except that she'd end up ruling it as goddess queen in a few weeks… They eventually decided that probation was proportionate."
"On.. Earth? With the Justice League?"
I take a moment to imagine that. No, those gits would probably dump her on me if it came to it.
"Ah, no, no. With NEMO. We all get issued with mind shields as part of our standard kit, and the whole 'biggest war in the galaxy' thing appeals to her megalomania. So that's one problem dealt with."
I close my eyes. I breathe in slowly. I hold. I open my eyes. I breathe out.
"And now, back to work."
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Darko
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"wave"
They already had one powerful telepath.
"have made"
"Imagine"
Ngamer11
Experienced.
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I'm very curious as to how much Lyla can help and whether or not she'll ever be considered for OLC membership.
deccan2008
Getting out there.
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Wait, that's it? How does Superman get his powers back?
Darko
Connoisseur.
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I'm guessing they just gave him a Sun Stone.
She may have drained his power, but she didn't exactly steal it.
Chojin Patriarch
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So a bunch of the former inmates just left once they were sorted out? I suppose that was an option - no need for them all to stay at the colony proper - but it does weaken the remainder...
Honestly, if the colony can't stand on its own feet against that, there's not much hope otherwise.
Little disappointing it ended so quick, but all the shooting parts were basically done.
Not right now, anyway. Once the Reach gets sorted...
And their computer systems? No, I suppose tampering there would be noticed.
That's taking a chance, given they had the time and knowledge to modify Lyla. Who's to say they haven't developed a telepath capable of unscrambling their memories in the decades since she was made?
Still curious about Ursa, too...
Ah, getting bogged down in digressions and explanations...
Though that puts a lot of trust towards the superior officer being qualified and on-task in turn, rather than mistaken or working for their own agenda.
Still hoping that Karsta actually has Ursa hidden away on board somehow.
Though while in their hands, she basically has to trust that they won't kill the golden goose that is her and her unborn child. And that's a big amount of trust for her to put in aliens.
Before she got picked up by the Dominators, yes...
So she's actually fairly lucky nothing went wrong with the augmentations all these years. I wouldn't be surprised if there were a lot more people taken alongside her and she was the only survivor of the process...
Heck, it's probably not as useful as some of the crazier ideas folks like the Sivanas could put forwards if he asked...
He's probably comfortable as he is. And maybe doesn't want to take the risk of upsetting that stable status-quo.
Playing it safe, of course. Long enough ago that the Timaronians were long gone and that the Kryptonians wouldn't notice.
To be fair, the Science Council probably wouldn't have cared by that stage.
Telepathy is always a complicating factor for things like these.
Honestly fairly sensible. If a little unconcerned with details. But then, they worked out that Zod would have done something drastic, it was just a matter of where.
Not wasting any time, I see. And that's a fairly final result for him, at least for now.
Surprised she tolerated them doing even that much. I suppose diplomacy is a bit of a game of favours, though. And doing this now makes it less likely anyone goes looking for their colony anytime soon.
Not gonna leave something like that laying around to be exploited by anyone.
Hopefully with a suitably explosive punishment for playing up.
So cutting out the middleman anyway and taking her into custody yourself.
Ah well, space legal shenanigans were fun while they lasted.
And so the episode ends with a quiet chat. Bit rushed, but I hope we do see Clark getting checked over at some point. I guess it was a straight energy leeching, similar to what the Parasite would do. Getting zapped like that isn't a common thing for him, so he might be feeling a bit frustrated for a bit, perhaps... At least he got to take care of some of Krypton's unfinished business.
BR549
This is filth! FILTH!!
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While true, functionally it's not that different than how Earth military law once was, pre-Nurenburg as opposed to post-, and it worked reasonably well right up until the Austrian corporal with the funny mustache ruined it for everyone else.
His name is Dru-Zod, not Benjamin Parker; odds are he'll be back at some point.
Darko
Connoisseur.
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Not necessarily.
Lots of supervillains that die and come back in comic books are just dead in this fanfic.
Ras al Ghul, Bane, Queen Bee.
All of them died and so far they're still dead.
No one really has any interest in Zod living.
The Chosen One
Making the rounds.
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Well, maybe Lor, but time travel doesn't work that way anymore.
Mr Zoat
Dedicated ragequitter
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Thank you, corrected.
She didn't remove his organelles, she just copied them and drained his batteries. All he needs to do is get back under a yellow sun and wait for a few hours.
There was a D&D/Harry Potter crossover I read a few years ago, where the muggle police were constantly getting confused as to why hooligans broke into police stations and destroyed their computer monitors but left the computer itself unharmed. This was happening because wizard aurors charged with enforcing the Statute of Secrecy were sort of aware that computers existed but had no idea that the thing with writing on it wasn't where the writing was stored. As a result, British police had significant records of magic-related crime that they didn't remember writing, which was a bit of a giveaway.
Dominators are good at computer record keeping. Dominion reports were getting backed up to the local command ship at the very least.
Meneth
Getting some practice in, huh?
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Sounds like Harry Potter and the Natural 20.
Slake Mothman
inveterate theorycrafter
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I agree that it was pretty ambiguous exactly what Lyla was doing there, though I figured that was intentional and details of 'the cistern' would be expanded on later. If there's no intention of doing that, then a small insert might help to clarify things:
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Silverias
Not too sore, are you?
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That fic bummed me out how it sorta fizzled and died.
Duke Long
Glomerulus
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'Timaronian'? That's how it's said for the rest of the chapter.
Also, Karsta asks about Lyla here, but then Oh El talks about Ursa, and she asks about Lyla again when he's finished. Was that deliberate?
'Dou-Ka'
'than'
'people's'?
That would be jolly good fun. She would be really annoying, but she didn't seem super evil.
She did make Dru-Zod attack Timaron rather than some other planet. Even if that's not considered a serious crime (which I find mildly surprising but certainly possible), I imagine that Amalak still despises her.
That was a great fic.
Mr Zoat
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Thank you, corrected.
Not particularly. He just felt like he needed to explain the whole thing and the thought process behind the decision.
Lord Ernest
At the End...
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Wait, so how is Lyla noy guilty of anything? Wasn't she spying on Krypton for the Dominion and essentially affecting how people were reacting to the knowledge that it would explode? And isn't she essentially accomplice to Zod deciding to raze Timaron? I think I got that he was going to do so anyway, but didn't she influence his decision to choose said planet or something? Then she aided in the escape of a detained individual (although apparently Ursa would have been found not guilty) and assaulted members of the Justice League as well.
Unless I completely misunderstood her involvement in all of this, how is she getting away with just "probation"?
Unless I completely misunderstood her involvement in all of this, how is she getting away with just "probation"?
BartlettMagic
peekaboo, you fucks you!
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so wait, pregnant Ursa ran off with the Dominion? am i the only one concerned that they now have a lot of Kryptonian genetic material to work with?
Ardy
I trust you know where the happy button is?
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They've had that for literal centuries at this point through Lyla spying on krypton, having more doesn't do anything for them
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The fuck? Didn't they establish that Dru-Zod wanted to kill a world, but Lyla was the one who picked Timaron specifically? It'd be hard to imagine a more serious crime against any given world.
Mr Zoat
Dedicated ragequitter
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As explained in the segment, under their legal code that was Dru-Zod's fault for deciding to destroy a planet. The fact she influenced some peripheral matters like the specific target isn't legally significant.
Huttj509
Getting sticky.
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Asks about Lyla, the response is about Ursa, then Lyla is addressed later. I think the bolded is supposed to be asking about Ursa.