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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Man, we are really ignoring Jade lately, is this Zoat beginning the transition to Zatanna or is this the start of Jade finding someone else?

An angry orange lantern, especially an enlightened one, would be an interesting mini arc
The story is focused on Earth, where she's not. She and the SI are still spending time together, there's just nothing plot-relevent happening with them.
 
Also, Zatanna's 16, Paul's 30. I'd love to see more Zatanna (and I'm always up for more Magic), but there's no way that they're dating.

Well. Not unless Paul decides to give up on rather important moral convictions, and Zatanna takes leave of her senses. After the Star Sapphire incident in Hoard, I very much doubt that that will happen unless Darkseid feels like experimenting with shipping and the Omega Sanction.
 
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Also, Zatanna's 16, Paul's 30. I'd love to see more Zatanna (and I'm always up for more Magic), but there's no way that they're dating.

Well. Not unless Paul decides to give up on rather important moral convictions, and Zatanna takes leave of her senses. After the Star Sapphire incident in Hoard, I very much doubt that that will happen unless Darkseid feels like experimenting with shipping and the Omega Sanction.
If I recall, when Zatanna discovered that he's older than he looks, she noted that she thought his age would be an impediment but her counterpart Zorina from Earth -16 is apparently happily married. So the age is something both of them would be able to overcome, given the appropiate circumstances.

Not that I think it will happen or anything. It was my original ship for this story, but I accepted its irrevocable sinking.
 
If I recall, when Zatanna discovered that he's older than he looks, she noted that she thought his age would be an impediment but her counterpart Zorina from Earth -16 is apparently happily married. So the age is something both of them would be able to overcome, given the appropiate circumstances.

Not that I think it will happen or anything. It was my original ship for this story, but I accepted its irrevocable sinking.
If i remember correctly, isn't that one of the evil counterpart realities? I vaguely remember reading stuff that implied a degree of mind control being involved in the evil counterpart reality's marriage...
 
If i remember correctly, isn't that one of the evil counterpart realities? I vaguely remember reading stuff that implied a degree of mind control being involved in the evil counterpart reality's marriage...
I don't remember any mind control, I do recall that Zorina's interest came not just from liking Blue Lantern but mainly from wanting a husband that would help her inherit the branch of the Zatara crime family that belonged to her farher and that wouldn't just usurp her position. Or something like that? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
 
I don't remember any mind control, I do recall that Zorina's interest came not just from liking Blue Lantern but mainly from wanting a husband that would help her inherit the branch of the Zatara crime family that belonged to her farher and that wouldn't just usurp her position. Or something like that? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
I remember one of the Blue Lantern segments mentioning something along the lines of him originally being against it, but one day finding himself with a completely flipped opinion on it overnight, and trying to not think too hard about his sudden shift in preferences/priorities, but honestly it's been awhile since we've had a Blue Lantern segment. I do remember it being one of the more recent Blue Lantern segments, though... Insofar as you can even describe that as 'recent'
 
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Zorina (crime syndicate reality -14). said that the reason she joined the Young Offenders was to find a dupe to mind control into being her 'boyfriend'. Instead she met Paul and spent the rest of her time convincing him that the age difference didn't matter. And convincing her father that Paul hadn't 'seduced her with his older man wiles'.
No on screen mention of Blue Paul being odded out and gong out of his way not to think about him changing his mind. By all appearances Zorina really did wear him down.
Edit: the most recent blue Paul segments was about his daughter being reincarnated of a specific anime character who was herself a reincarnation (keep her away from nazis/socialists at all costs, is the only bit I can remember about thay character.).

Tanya something?
 
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Ripples (part 23) New
24th July 2013
09:44 GMT -5


Mr. Queen swivels on his heel with an arrow on his string pointing straight at me.

"Green Arrow. I apologise if I-." He lowers the arrow. "-caught you at a bad time."

"No, you're fine." He goes back to his vigil, overlooking Star City. "Thought you were Hal."

"Did you hear me?"

"No. Spotted your shadow. Lanterns glow, so it looks different to the other fliers." Finding nothing amiss in his city, he looks up at me. "So on a scale of zero to doomed..?"

"Oh, no. As far as I know, nothing special is going wrong in Star City. It's about Arsenal."

He snorts, smiling. "Hal never got me a spaceship."

"Um. If you want a spaceship, NEMO is capturing a lot of ships from deniable Reach assets that we don't need ourselves. I can probably get you one if you want it."

"Ah… Thanks, but I think I'll put off my midlife crisis for a few years." He frowns. "I thought Roy seemed kinda down for a guy who just got a new starship."

"It's not actually new. It had a recent refit, but the original hull is over a hundred years old."

"Ooh, one-" He nods. "-of those."

"Ah. The designer built it and then spent the rest of his life in an insane asylum. So I'm not sure if he was a classical modern mad scientist, or just an early rocketry pioneer."

"Alright. So what's Roy's problem?"

"I'll send you the full report and mission videos, but the short answer is that I got into a fight with an Old God and he couldn't contribute."

"Ah, no?" He frowns for a moment. "Wait, that's why he's bummed out?"

"He made what turned out to be a poor decision in combat, but it was perfectly justifiable. It just.. turned out to be incorrect."

He nods. "And then you had to deal with it while he just stood there. Yeah, that's a kick in the gut."

"So is it the sort of thing he'll just get over, or should I do something?"

"You told him it wasn't his fault, right?"

I nod. "Yes, of course. And I suggested several things he could do which might let him-" He winces. "-be less.. likely-. What?"

"Okay, look. If you said there were things he could do to get better, then he's probably beating himself up for not doing them already. And if the ideas come from you… Well…"

"I realise that a power ring's not for everyone."

"So let me guess… Super magical power armour?"

I nod. "That was one of my suggestions."

He holds up his right hand and beckons me down. I land just in front of him as he leans back against the railing around the edge of the roof.

"You remember the assessment you gave everyone on the League?"

"Yes, I don't think anyone will let me forget."

"I-." Something occurs to him. "Hey, have you done one for Mister Atom yet?"

"I.. tried, but it turns out that he's being maximally effective. And aside from one or two things which he struggles to understand due to being an A.I., there isn't much I can help him with because he's a lot more intelligent than me."

"Ah, shoot. Ah. Point is, I got kind hurt when I got a 'D'."

"That's not exactly what I was trying to communicate."

"Yeah, yeah, I know. But then I got thinking about it, and I ended up saying to myself: Ollie, you're a guy with a bow. What did you think you were going to get?"

"Well, everyone can improve."

He smiles ruefully. "You're not exactly the best advert for self-improvement, Paul."

"I have become far more effective than I was when I started. I have fewer vulnerabilities."

"Do you have a..? Life, outside the job?"

"How do you mean?"

"When was the last time you went on holiday?"

"I went on a tour with Jade… Last year? I-. We kept tripping over work to do."

"Any friends who aren't part of the community?"

"… One? Karon's dating Catwoman's… Ward?"

"No one completely outside of it?"

"Does Bleez count?"

"No."

"Then… No. Ah… So… What you're saying is..?"

"I've got my city. Obviously I don't know everyone in it, but I know a lot of people. And everyone knows me. If something happens I know who to talk to, what to do… I guess I'm a fish in a pond that fits my size, you know?" I nod tentatively. "And I read what you put in that 'big League' outline. I think I could handle wrangling a team."

"You're literally the first League member to talk to me about that."

"But I don't think I could stand spending all my spare time chasing more power, and then… Dealing with the consequences, and then going from place to place without… Settling down or seeing a familiar face. I don't think I wanna do the things I'd have to do to become you. Or even Hal."

"Lantern Jordan isn't-."

"Him flying all over the Sector is why him and Carol broke up. You see a lot of Jade?"

"Not as much as I was. But I don't want to.. be too far away from Earth for that.. long."

"Right."

"I could probably… I mean, the Watchtower has a fracture pulse transmitter, so it should be alright… It's not like we don't speak…"

"I'm getting déjà vu here. Look, maybe… Send me your mission report and I'll have a talk to Roy about his professional goals. Maybe drag William into it. But-. I know your heart's in the right place, but I don't think you're the guy to help with this. Okay?"

"Okay. Ah, thank you. I'm… Going to go and visit Jade now."

He smiles. "You do that. See you around, Paul."
 
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There are several acceptable, worthwhile ways to write Oliver Queen. Mr Zoat, I'd hug you for how you have used him in Young Justice, if not for the risk of making you uncomfortable. This is a guy with a Wisdom of 22 (and a dexterity of 26 or so) if we were using DnD 3.5 ability scores. Thank you, so very much. You really took to heart what the writers of Justice League Unlimited were doing with him throughout the series, and the kind of man he'd need to be make that final JLU episode speech.
 
Heh. Go Green Arrow.

I don't think Paul is wrong by trying to help everyone constantly improve themselves. That is a motivation a lot of people lack and desperately need.

But it can be taken too far. Or pursued in exclusion of other things.

Very nice. Love this angle.
 
24th July 2013
09:44 GMT -5


Mr. Queen swivels on his heel with an arrow on his string pointing straight at me.

"Green Arrow. I apologise if I-." He lowers the arrow. "-caught you at a bad time."
A fine instinct for the average gang goon, and probably a hard one to fight even when he knows the person he's drawing on isn't going to be bothered by anything short of a nuke. I'm guessing he's letting Ollie know about the Roy thing so he can do some mentoring.

"No, you're fine." He goes back to his vigil, overlooking Star City. "Thought you were Hal."

"Did you hear me?"
Old thing between them, or is he feeling a bit off lately, I wonder...

"No. Spotted your shadow. Lanterns glow, so it looks different to the other fliers." Finding nothing amiss in his city, he looks up at me. "So on a scale of zero to doomed..?"

"Oh, no. As far as I know, nothing special is going wrong in Star City. It's about Arsenal."
A reasonable assumption that something's going awry when OL turns up, given how many times it has previously.

He snorts, smiling. "Hal never got me a spaceship."

"Um. If you want a spaceship, NEMO is capturing a lot of ships from deniable Reach assets that we don't need ourselves. I can probably get you one if you want it."
I'm sure there's plenty of small squad-level skiffs and shuttles about OL can confiscate.

"Ah… Thanks, but I think I'll put off my midlife crisis for a few years." He frowns. "I thought Roy seemed kinda down for a guy who just got a new starship."

"It's not actually new. It had a recent refit, but the original hull is over a hundred years old."
And pretty damn spiffy. Really, give it a coat of red Candy paint, rename it the Red Dart and bam, Roy's a space-hero!

"Ooh, one-" He nods. "-of those."

"Ah. The designer built it and then spent the rest of his life in an insane asylum. So I'm not sure if he was a classical modern mad scientist, or just an early rocketry pioneer."
Why not both? The kind of sciences involved in early rocketry probably seemed 'mad' back in the day.

"Alright. So what's Roy's problem?"

"I'll send you the full report and mission videos, but the short answer is that I got into a fight with an Old God and he couldn't contribute."
Even with his upgrades, he's just not gonna be fighting on that level anytime soon. The drawback of teaming up with a cosmic-tier buddy.

"Ah, no?" He frowns for a moment. "Wait, that's why he's bummed out?"

"He made what turned out to be a poor decision in combat, but it was perfectly justifiable. It just.. turned out to be incorrect."
I mean, what hero hasn't shot some high-tech gubbin out of the bad guy's hands? And how many times has it bitten them in the ass?

He nods. "And then you had to deal with it while he just stood there. Yeah, that's a kick in the gut."

"So is it the sort of thing he'll just get over, or should I do something?"
I bet Ollie's had a few of those moments, though not necessarily his fault. That's what happens when your team includes multiple flying bricks, a wizard or two and the goddamn Batman.

"You told him it wasn't his fault, right?"

I nod. "Yes, of course. And I suggested several things he could do which might let him-" He winces. "-be less.. likely-. What?"
OL, remember how people tend to come to you for advice about improving their options? Sometimes, that's not what they really need.

"Okay, look. If you said there were things he could do to get better, then he's probably beating himself up for not doing them already. And if the ideas come from you… Well…"

"I realise that a power ring's not for everyone."
Probably also a bit of 'why didn't you say something sooner then? Maybe if I'd had that, this wouldn't have happened!' recriminations going on.

"So let me guess… Super magical power armour?"

I nod. "That was one of my suggestions."
To be fair, Power armour is always handy, magical or otherwise. Especially for someone speccing from bows into firearms of all kinds.

He holds up his right hand and beckons me down. I land just in front of him as he leans back against the railing around the edge of the roof.

"You remember the assessment you gave everyone on the League?"
I'm sure a great many Leaguers still feel the sting of that session.

"Yes, I don't think anyone will let me forget."

"I-." Something occurs to him. "Hey, have you done Mister Atom yet?"

"I.. tried, but it turns out that he's being maximally effective. And aside from one or two thing which he struggles to understand due to being an A.I., there isn't much I can help him with because he's a lot more intelligent than me."
Perhaps he really could manage to take over the world someday, then. Once he gets his head around managing Humanity's desire for independence yet willingness to be led...

"Ah, shoot. Ah. Point is, I got kind hurt when I got a 'D'."

"That's not exactly what I was trying to communicate."
Again, comparing himself to guys like Superman and Batman. Compared to that, Ollie is a talented amateur.

"Yeah, yeah, I know. But then I got thinking about it, and I ended up saying to myself: Ollie, you're a guy with a bow. What did you think you were going to get?"

"Well, everyone can improve."
...Wonder how the Renegade's Awakened Ollie is going? That was a thing, right?

He smiles ruefully. "You're not exactly the best advert for self-improvement, Paul."

"I have become far more effective than I was when I started. I have fewer vulnerabilities."
No, you've simply traded old ones for new ones you don't realise you have yet.

"Do you have a..? Life, outside the job?"

"How do you mean?"
Good question. OL is one of those guys who's on the clock every waking moment...

"When was the last time you want on holiday?"

"I went on a tour with Jade… Last year? I-. We kept tripping over work to do."
Busman's holidays don't really count, though.

"Any friends who aren't part of the community?"

"… One? Karon's dating Catwoman's… Ward?"
I suppose that's the best term for it. She wasn't dressing in spandex and running around as 'Kitten' or anything like that.

"No one completely outside of it?"

"Does Bleez count?"
She's technically a Thanagarian Intelligence asset. So no.

"No."

"Then… No. Ah… So… What you're saying is..?"
You need some regular, human friends. People not likely to get into the cape life. I'm not saying you should go looking, but...

"I've got my city. Obviously I don't know everyone in it, but I know a lot of people. And everyone knows me. If something happens I know who to talk to, what to do… I guess I'm a fish in a pond that fits my size, you know?" I nod tentatively. "And I read what you put in that 'big League' outline. I think I could handle wrangling a team."
OL kind of set himself up as a medium-size fish in a really big pond, though. And kind of spreading himself thin by trying to be, like, three different fish at once.

"You're literally the first League member to talk to me about that."

"But I don't think I could stand spending all my spare time chasing more power, and then… Dealing with the consequences, and then going from place to place without… Settling down or seeing a familiar face. I don't think I wanna do the things I'd have to do to become you. Or even Hal."
The life of a Sector Lantern was a lonely one, I suspect.

"Lantern Jordan isn't-."

"Him flying all over the Sector is why him and Carol broke up. You see a lot of Jade?"

"Not as much as I was. But I don't want to.. be too far away from Earth for that.. long."
A reasonable feeling, given how things have gone since he first arrived. And the orange Light connections he feels to it is a pretty strong one.

"Right."

"I could probably… I mean, the Watchtower has a fracture pulse transmitter, so it should be alright… It's not like we don't speak…"
Worst case, there are plenty of Lanterns who could make contact. All the local greenies have your 'number', of course. And Alan, Arisia, Gh'iata.... Heck, even Batman can call you in if he'd need to.

"I'm getting déjà vu here. Look, maybe… Send me your mission report and I'll have a talk to Roy about his professional goals. Maybe drag William into it. But-. I know you're heart's in the right place, but I don't think you're the guy to help with this. Okay?"

"Okay. Ah, thank you. I'm… Going to go and visit Jade now."

He smiles. "You do that. See you around, Paul."
I wonder if Jade will be all 'what happened this time?'

A surprising denouement but like the episode name, any 'ripples' will be bouncing back and forth for ages yet. And it seems OL's finally noticed that he's gotten kind of married to the mission, as it were. I can't see him just wandering about without the Ring, meeting people, but he does kind of need some 'on the ground' perspective now and again...
 
Hah, nice. He finally managed a good response to OL's critiques.

"Regular fish in a regular pond" mixed with "Buddy, do you even have anything outside of... this? Like, actually?" might prompt a degree of introspection.
 
I honestly enjoy that OL is married to the job. There's something wonderfully pure about how he mind-whammied himself into being a good-optimizer AI in Lantern form and I like how everyone starts noticing that in different ways over time.

Probably my favorite bits, which is a bit of a shame as it means I hate when Jade or Alan try to normalize him.
 
Yeah... and there's honestly...

How do I put this? There's a whole spectrum between 'trains like a motherfucker on the bow and arrow, and fights crime and has a life and Nothing Else,' and 'Orange Lantern, who had to rework his brain for the ring and because he internalized the Ophidian that one time and now only does What He Wants to do.' OL gave them those grades, and then they finally got the wards he developed that let them ward off magic attacks... and they never stopped by Atlantis and asked, "Are there any other wards we could just attach, with a minimum of time and effort on our part and for a reasonable fee, that could help with bullets or poisons or diseases?" Just... basic competence in any D&D party. And if Ollie had done that, he wouldn't have been taken out immediately in the wargames. Lack of bio-criminals or no, just a basic checklist of general hazards that are easy to ward against would have saved him, if he'd shown the preparation of thirteen-year-olds around the damn world.

You don't need to constantly grasp for New Power - hell, OL isn't really expanding his power outside exotic uses of the orange light anyways! He isn't working on expanding his metaphysique, or mastering his unique way of grasping magic! He isn't hunting down powerful creatures that cause harm to others who he'd be willing to assimilate and which would provide him an actual benefit in combat, or who could cast spells - like Satanus did, once assimilated, with Orange Hellfire that mattered against Finality Man - or trying to modify his genes to see if one of his clone-bodies can become a meta.

Hell, he isn't even testing his Transubstantiation ability - where he literally turns himself into orange light - to see what being a construct can do in combat! Can he multithread his consciousness, Megan-as-Star-Conquerer style? Can he boost his ability to use Quintessence Waveform Scans, if he goes Swamp Thing and builds extra brainmatter for temporary comprehension? How about just asking Hinon what she thinks the biggest weaknesses in his kit are, and how she'd deal with them if she knew what she knows?

It's important to have a life, and take care of your mental health - but Paul is mentally healthy, and happy. He Does What He Wants. And maybe he could spend more time with Jade... but really, Ollie? It sounds like you're making excuses to cover your own laziness, because you don't need to ruthlessly grasp for power at all times to go shopping and occasionally explore covering your weaknesses. That's something I'd expect of anyone who regularly risks their lives, and who knows other people depend on their protection. I'm not asking you to coat bugs in capsaicin, or (gasp) study something new!

Arsenal could get Dannered. Hell, he could get the Garrick Formula! But he's not going for raw power - OL recommended Magic, or armor with magical scanners, so he'd have a better awareness of What Things Do around him. The very upgrade that would prevent him from taking an action that released an Old God upon him. He's literally taking the minimum effort to learn from his fucking mistakes!

I mean, god. Superman had the Fortress Of Solitude, where his father's mental clone knew about kryptonite, and had a shield that could be put on a belt. Paul literally just handed him a slightly better version of the thing that he already had access to... because instead of asking his kryptonian guide or checking his Kryptonian databanks about the Kryptonite that hurt him, and destroyed Krypton, the very catastrophe that his father knew about and predicted so he could send him to Earth to save him from that-

He made a lead suit, which he couldn't have all the time. And that's innovative! Against a novel threat, coating yourself with the substance that stops the radiation that's hurting you makes sense!

But he never checked with the Guy Who Knows This Stuff, or made use of his own Vast Resources. He had a WIn Button against kryptonite, and didn't press it... because that'd be unsporting? He'd find it boring? He wants people to use kryptonite to make him vulnerable when people need his protection, so they don't use something less effective?
No, because he smiled and took a shield immediately when it was offered. He knows that scenes like the Russian Roulette scene in the latest Superman movie could happen, on the field, if he ran into someone far less monstrous than the Joker. He understands that being immune to kryptonite is Good Actually.

He just wasn't willing to ask for help, from Atlantis for a Ward against Kryptonite or his Actual Dead Father. He wasn't willing to look like he was grasping for power, even though his power is exactly what he leverages to do what he does - help people.

It's lazy. Depressingly realistic, but lazy. And he never talked with Jor-El and mentioned that he encountered Kryptonite? "Hey, son, how's your day?" "Some guy zapped me with a rock, but otherwise good!" "What rock? Oh, Kryptonite? I have something for that-"

I don't consider what Ollie said to be wise. OL meditated because he understood that mental balance is important; he started looking for a girlfriend when he decided he didn't want to be alone.
But it does explain why OL has stagnated - because he's happy and powerful, and the people around him are basically walking mouthpieces for Boss Smiley.
 
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"Him flying all over the Sector is why him and Carol broke up. You see a lot of Jade?"

"Not as much as I was. But I don't want to.. be too far away from Earth for that.. long."
You know, Ollie has a point. This might be fine from OL's warped sense of priorities, but that's got to be very hard on Jade. They should break up. Then Jade can find someone interested in a relationship where they see each other more than semi-annually, and OL can find someone more on his wavelength. I seem to remember a certain, eligible spiderqueen who was interested? Maybe give her a call..?
 
You know, Ollie has a point. This might be fine from OL's warped sense of priorities, but that's got to be very hard on Jade. They should break up. Then Jade can find someone interested in a relationship where they see each other more than semi-annually, and OL can find someone more on his wavelength.
Well-.
I seem to remember a certain, eligible spiderqueen who was interested? Maybe give her a call..?
Ah. Never mind, then.
 
Actually you've become less effective because you want from problem solver to face puncher.

To be fair, face punching and problem solving tend to overlap a lot. ESPECIALLY in the DC universe. Sometimes, problems just can't be solved without punching someone in the face, and sometimes, punching someone in the face also solves a problem along the way.

Besides, let's be real here: despite all the flak that we give to face punchers around here, being a face puncher isn't always a bad thing, because punching the right people in the face can save a lot of lives.
 
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