With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[Someguy Somewhere]

"No, just putting together bits of existing technology. The interface comes from Hartford Jackson's Thinking Cap, and the memory storage is something I got from Thomas Morrow's advanced robots. Add a few bits and pieces from wherever I could scavenge them…"

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Huh.

Ok, I admit my own memory wasn't too great (Ha) but something felt off about this so I went back and looked to the first mention of this thing way back here.

Back then OL described it as "Human ingenuity and Martian biotechnology" and mostly seemed to have been working with M'gann on creating and testing it.

And I mean it makes sense if it's martian biotech that he could replicate with his ring based on say....part of her Ship's control interface, which non telepaths use. Or maybe she had some other martian tech with her for general use that could be adapted.....those memory storing pendents that the Martian Woman Hunter had would be something fairly close, but that came later...maybe she had the martian version of a usb stick?

Anyway....Um....either retcon'ed or he just forgot to mention the martian bits here? Don't think there's been anything that would actually be impacted by the difference, just pointing it out.

 

[Vaermina]

You do know that the only thing we know about Tollan space tech is that it may have taken a year to reach Earth?

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Stargate: SG1 - Enigma

NARIM
Omoc spoke the truth. By setting the position of your stars, we were able to calibrate the distance between Earth and the new homeworld. It is very far away, Samantha. Too far to hope for a ship in our lifetime.

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You're thinking of the episode "A hundred days" where it was mentioned that the Tollan could have a ship in the vicinity of the Edora system within a year. However that's functionally worthless as we don't know where the ship would have been starting from or where the Edora system was.

That may not be very fast compared to Asgard or Ancient travel, but it is still incredibly fast and most likely in the FTL range.

Not to mention that they were the most advanced human society we were shown.

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No, that would have been the Hebriadans.

Followed by the Aschen.

And the fact that the Nox were able to help them build a Stargate.

None of these are things a primitive people can do.

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You can build a working stargate with items ordered online making that yet another example that doesn't really tell us anything.

Stargate's really not a setting you want to argue with me about given how much research I've done about the setting for my own fic.

The Soul Hunters had no idea what was happening to the Ralgans, and the Ralgans said that they were evolving.

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No, they said they were evolving before the Soul Hunter's grabbed their souls.

Mind, this doesn't particularly matter for the point at hand given the Narn in question was not a Ralgan and still at the point where their telepathy would have been 100% biological in nature.

Except you have. For years.

True, power rings aren't all powerful, but they are still incredibly powerful.

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Nope, that is literally you putting words in my mouth.

And Power Ring power is highly variable depending on a number of factors up to an including whether it's a Zoat Ring, which have a number of capabilities canon Power Rings don't.

 

[NightmareWarden]

Is it possible Akhlys is partially responsible for this turn of events? She was freed from the Anti-Life by the dream of Hope and her own long-faded Hopes.

She isn't the sort of deity to have worshippers, but her own feelings after getting a reboot and any research on Blue Lantern's hospital visits could have resulted in this situation. She'd figure out that there are diseases outside of Alan and Paul's skillsets. There are a few gaps between A and B here, but this makes sense to me. That's mostly a motivation though. Maybe Hephestean shared some old blueprints of Paul's armor? Not sure how else this could have happened.

 

[GhostKing 666]

No, that would have been the Hebriadans.

Followed by the Aschen.

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Neither the Hebridans nor the Aschen could construct weaponry that could trivially destroy Goa'uld Hat'ak(at least before Anubis upgraded their shields). That was specifically why the Aschen used a bio-weapon against the Goa'uld in the original timeline.

Nor were they shown with phasing technology or the ability to construct bombs/power sources that could crack a planet badly enough to disrupt the orbital cycles of the rest of the star system.

 

[Vaermina]

Neither the Hebridans nor the Aschen could construct weaponry that could trivially destroy Goa'uld Hat'ak(at least before Anubis upgraded their shields). That was specifically why the Aschen used a bio-weapon against the Goa'uld in the original timeline.

Nor were they shown with phasing technology or the ability to construct bombs/power sources that could crack a planet badly enough to disrupt the orbital cycles of the rest of the star system.

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The Serrakins did, they very specifically fought the Goa'uld off which led to the formation of the Hebridin alliance.

And the Aschen's limiting factor was that their FTL sucked, but a we saw in the flash forward that they were perfectly capable of doing things like collapsing gas giants into stars.

 

[GhostKing 666]

The Serrakins did, they very specifically fought the Goa'uld off which led to the formation of the Hebridin alliance.

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No, all we know is that they beat the Goa'uld that was enslaving the Hebridans. We don't know how they did it or any specifics. Did they use special forces shenanigans like the SGC? Did they use overwhelming numbers? It's not likely that they had weapons on par with Tollan Ion Cannons...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZrgULzPpA0

Because if they had, Earth would have gone to greater efforts to get them. In the end, we don't know how they beat the Goa'uld and what we have seen is that they maintain a policy of being too much for any single System Lord to crush(at least without leaving them vulnerable to their rivals) but not enough of a threat to get the Goa'uld to attack them collectivly, just like the Tollan(which is another mark against the Hebridans/Serrakins being that advanced. The Hebridans did not give off the appearance that they were anywhere near as strictly non-interventionist as the Tollan were and if they had the ability to crush the System Lords, they likely would).

And the Aschen's limiting factor was that their FTL sucked, but a we saw in the flash forward that they were perfectly capable of doing things like collapsing gas giants into stars.

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Which is very impressive, no mistake. But the fact that they likely defeated the Goa'uld using one of their bio-weapons instead of conventional military force does suggest that as advanced as they are, their military technology isn't so far ahead of the Goa'uld that they can trivialize Hat'aks like the Tollan could. Nor do we know if they can make power sources as powerful as what the Tollan could make.

We never got to see the Tollan and Aschen interact with each other, so we don't actually know how they compare. Just that both are ahead of the Goa'uld and the Aschen have a much larger population(and industrial base) that the Tollan after what happened to the Tollan's original home planet.

 

[Mr Zoat]

5th April 2258
09:48 GMT

"Will there be anything else, sir?"

Kethen smiles at me, bowing at such an angle that her maid uniform displays her décolletage. I move my eyes away, both because I'm her employer and because I know how the brakiri reproductive system works and that's never going to happen. Yes, having a housekeeper tied to the Rooshnoon-Koravii Syndicate is useful. As a favoured client, her discretion can be relied upon as long as I don't act directly against her syndicate's core interests. She can cook, clean, perform basic maintenance and cover the vast holes in my knowledge of 23rd century, and that more than makes up for the discomfort I feel at her flirting.

"No, thank you, that will be all."

She curtseys-. That can't be a brakiri thing, right? She's copied that from something human.

Sitting opposite me, Mayan looks like she feels even more awkward about the situation than I do. She stares directly at the table as Kethen swishes past, stretching her shoulders and quietly clearing her throat.

"I know it's a little awkward, but please bear with it. I'll complete the basilica, and you'll be on Earth before your original shuttle would have gotten you there."

"I know that human culture is different to ours, but… Erotic interaction between members of different species is something that no minbari would be comfortable with."

I can't quite stop myself laugh-spluttering.

Mayan looks at me curiously. "I understand that a good deal of human humour relates to the violation of social conventions. What is it about what I said that amuses you?"

"Some minbari are comfortable with it."

She frowns, which… Minbari faces are almost identical in structure to human faces, but there's a slight ridge where the eyebrows would be, and the frown emphasises it. "I understand that such things are depicted in certain human… Entertainment media, but I believe that they use actors in costume."

"Probably, but that wasn't what I meant." I raise my left hand, a minbari genetic sequence appearing above it. "See this segment here?"

"I do, but I am not a geneticist."

"Me neither, but I can do a spot-the-difference puzzle." I display more. "See how it's the same across all of these minbari genetic sequences?"

"I do."

"Except." I point to one which is noticeably different from the others, even as it shares that one sequence. "This one isn't minbari. It's Commander Jeffrey Sinclair."

She blinks, pulling away. "What do you mean?"

"While it's technically possible that one part of the minbari population evolved exactly the same genetic sequence as one part of the human population- after all, there are only so many ways to process common chemicals- it's far more likely that they've got a common ancestor. At some point, either naturally or in a laboratory, minbari and human D.N.A. were combined, and the resulting hybrid was able to reproduce with regular minbari."

She staring at me, and her breathing is-.

"Are you alright?"

"Do they have any outward signs?"

"The males have beards. I didn't see any that didn't have beards, but there aren't all that many minbari on Babylon Five. And they're the only minbari I've seen with any body hair."

Her eyes dart around, and I think I've just exploded her world-

"A minbari not of Minbar."

-view.

"I realise that it's a bit of a shock." I dismiss the construct. "I didn't think that different intelligent species could breed. Earthforce actually has a list of species that it's safe to even attempt physical intimacy with."

Kethen sticks her head back around the door. "Are brakiri on it?"

"Yes, with certain… Warnings."

"Oh? Based on the human books I read on the subject, I thought that there wasn't much difference."

Ah…

"I realise that between.. different cultures, it's sometimes difficult to work out what's supposed to be taken literally and what is.. imagination, but I'm afraid… Female brakiri are a… Niche fetish." I frown. "And don't I look like a brakiri who's had a sander run over their face to you?"

Her eyes widen and her mouth hangs open for a moment, then she nods. "Yes! And I guess I look like a human who's had a run-in with a chisel."

I nod cautiously. "Something like that. So I don't-. If this is some you enjoy doing when you interact with people, that's fine. I just want to be clear that as far as I'm concerned the compatibility issues between humans and brakiri means that I'm never going to seriously reciprocate."

"No, I'm just playing a role. You're supposed to be a rich guy on a cruise. Having a saucy maid is just part of the look."

"And if I was in Syndicate space you would be perfect for that role, but as Mayan-" I gesture to her as she continues muttering to herself. "-is demonstrating, even the implication makes minbari have a bit of an episode."

"And ruining one of their landmarks won't?"

"Completing one of their landmarks. I'm sure that after having a little while to adapt, they'll get used to it. And as far as I'm any judge, it looks great."

Of course it looks great. It is sublime!

Ah, you're back. Please remember the rules from now on.

You are correct. I apologise.

Did you hear that bit about bearded minbari?

Children of Valenn?

They're descended from your prophet?

Our most notable prophet, yes. What of them?

The beards come from D.N.A. they share with humans. I'm not sure how it got-.

Bleuroughoughrruh!

…

She's just been sick in my head. Marvellous. Other minbari?

We're thinking about it.

"What..?" Mayan appears to have recovered, while Kethen has left. I think they've learned to recognise when I'm consulting the peanut gallery. "What do the departed say?"

"The idea that the 'Children of Valenn' have human D.N.A. is causing a certain amount of disquiet. Ah. Is that something that I should mention to your government, or avoid mentioning to your government?"

"Avoid, for now." She takes a deep breath. "I need to meditate upon this."

"Okay. Ah. One last question before we head out. How big is the Grey Council?"

"The Council is made up on three minbari from each caste."

"Ah. Well, it's nice to know that they're taking Babylon Five so seriously."

"Any attempt to avoid a repeat of the futile slaughter of the Earth-Minbar was should be embraced. But I do not follow your reasoning."

"Ambassador Delenn. She's a member. I originally thought that maybe the Council was a large legislative body, but if it's nine people that can't be the case."

Her eyes widen slightly. "Membership of the Council is a secret. How do you know?"

"It's written on her forehead." She stares. "The triangle? I see it both as a triangle and the name. Is it..? Not visible to anyone else?"

"No. It is not." Mayan takes another deep breath. "It seems that I have many things to meditate upon."

"Right, but you're coming to see me finish the basilica first, right?"

"I would not dare leave you on Minbar unattended."

 

[Mr Zoat]

Huh.

Ok, I admit my own memory wasn't too great (Ha) but something felt off about this so I went back and looked to the first mention of this thing way back here.

Back then OL described it as "Human ingenuity and Martian biotechnology" and mostly seemed to have been working with M'gann on creating and testing it.

And I mean it makes sense if it's martian biotech that he could replicate with his ring based on say....part of her Ship's control interface, which non telepaths use. Or maybe she had some other martian tech with her for general use that could be adapted.....those memory storing pendents that the Martian Woman Hunter had would be something fairly close, but that came later...maybe she had the martian version of a usb stick?

Anyway....Um....either retcon'ed or he just forgot to mention the martian bits here? Don't think there's been anything that would actually be impacted by the difference, just pointing it out.

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I mostly forgot that. Assume that he either based the general design on martian technology built with human parts, or that he made the original with martian biotechnology and later created a purely human version.

 

[BR549]

"Probably, but that wasn't what I meant." I raise my left hand, a minbari genetic sequence appearing above it. "See this segment here?"

"I do, but I am not a geneticist."

"Me neither, but I can do a spot-the-difference puzzle." I display more. "See how it's the same across all of these minbari genetic sequences?"

"I do."

"Except." I point to one which is noticeably different from the others, even as it shares that one sequence. "This one isn't minbari. It's Commander Jeffrey Sinclair."

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Interesting. I wonder when he got that, or was he just casually scanning everyone?

Because...

"While it's technically possible that one part of the minbari population evolved exactly the same genetic sequence as one part of the human population- after all, there are only so many ways to process common chemicals- it's far more likely that they've got a common ancestor. At some point, either naturally or in a laboratory, minbari and human D.N.A. were combined, and the resulting hybrid was able to reproduce with regular minbari."

She staring at me, and her breathing is-.

"Are you alright?"

"Do they have any outward signs?"

"The males have beards. I didn't see any that didn't have beards, but there aren't all that many minbari on Babylon Five. And they're the only minbari I've seen with any body hair."

Her eyes dart around, and I think I've just exploded her world-

"A minbari not of Minbar."

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Mayan caught on fast to the implication, and she's right.
...interestingly this is probably more than Delenn knows right now, since all she knows is the Triluminary lit up when they were examining Sinclair at the Battle of the Line, indicating that Minbari souls were apparently reincarnating as humans.
But with the genetic evidence...that cat's out of the bag.

(EDIT: Of course, the fact the Minbari demanded Sinclair be given command of B5 indicates that, presumably, at least somebody had a hunch.)

Children of Valenn?

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"The idea that the 'Children of Valenn' have human D.N.A. is causing a certain amount of disquiet.

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'Valen'

Ah. Is that something that I should mention to your government, or avoid mentioning to your government?"

"Avoid, for now."

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You could say that, yes.

"Ambassador Delenn. She's a member. I originally thought that maybe the Council was a large legislative body, but if it's nine people that can't be the case."

Her eyes widen slightly. "Membership of the Council is a secret. How do you know?"

"It's written on her forehead." She stares. "The triangle? I see it both as a triangle and the name. Is it..? Not visible to anyone else?"

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...goodness, there's all kinds of felines being released from their carrying containers today, aren't there?

"I would not dare leave you on Minbar unattended."

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Welcome to the club of Paul-Whisperers, Mayan. Here's your complimentary flask of Romulan Ale and an icepack for the headache, you'll need it.