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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Reader mode
iamnuff said:
The idea of the future as something that already exists and should be protected is pretty stupid anyway.
People in the present should do everything they can to better their own futures, and if that means that some already-existing figure has to get retconned out of existance, then... too bad, so sad.
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Also it's potentially a viable stance to say that the most ethical thing to do is to always try to change the future. It just requires that you accept the experiences of those in the erased timeline as valid even after they cease to ever exist. Because then erasing timeline A to make timeline B is an act of multiplication.
 
moralrelativity said:
Yes. I got that vibe, big time.
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If that happened then I'm betting it's going to involve she and Paul talking, her coming to some realization, Paul asking a question or making a statement but not getting to finish it because she tries to attack him, and of course the chapter ends in a cliffhanger.
 
Mr Zoat said:
SI doesn't know that. I'll try to remember to have other characters parse it in that way
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Honestly, I'm a massive Legion fan, and I usually spell it "Legion of Superheroes."

Very tangential, but I met Keith Giffen (he worked on the Legion comics for ages) at a convention a couple years back. Got him to sign my copy of Legion of Substitute Heroes #1, but of course I babbled about loving the Legion, and his response was to interrupt with a drawn out, perplexed "WHHHYYYY!?" Apparently he really hates the Legion at this point, having to work on them for so long. To hear him tell it, it was nearly a punishment assignment, back in the day.

Anyway, it looks like the softball journalistic standards of her timeline infected Dana with some of that old school Legion naivety. And OL is not making this easy. Great stuff.

I don't think she's there to just kill OL, though. She doesn't seem to have the temperament, and there definitely have been Legion members who would. If she was just there to rewrite the timeline, she also wouldn't have talked about it, first. So either they've already tried and it hasn't worked, or she's there to talk OL into changing his plans, or helping her change go back and change the timeline. I'm not sure whether it would be good or bad to tell Brainiac 5 about hypertime...
 
iamnuff said:
If she says that the reach are 'supposed' to conquer earth, and that without that then the future doesn't exist... then i'm sorry but the future kind of has to go.

The idea of the future as something that already exists and should be protected is pretty stupid anyway.
People in the present should do everything they can to better their own futures, and if that means that some already-existing figure has to get retconned out of existance, then... too bad, so sad.
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Nah, it can always get worse.

If you stopped Hitler and the Holocaust but then later the Soviets and Allies would blow up everyone with nukes than the moral decision would be to reinstate Hitler.
 
Massgamer said:
What about Karate Kid? He doesn't have any powers either other than being a real good fighter.
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There have been many versions of the Legion, but as for the first incarnation... Not really a lot of detail.

Legion-origin-1.jpg
 
Massgamer said:
What about Karate Kid? He doesn't have any powers either other than being a real good fighter.
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He can fist fight kryptonians and can kick the ground so hard he causes an earthquake in a manner that cancels out an existing earthquake.

Karate Kid is someone who Charles Atlas'd himself into superpowers and no one pretends otherwise.
 
Mr Zoat said:
"They kinda want me to 'fix' the timeline?"

"How are they defining 'fix'?"

"That's…" She looks away awkwardly. "What do you know about the Reach?"
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So, this has the potential to be very stupid. If the Legion wants the Reach to win on Earth enough for there to be people out in the universe to found the United Planets later there's likely to be some vaguely super villainous stuff they want her to do.
 
w34v3r said:
Soooooo how does the legion deal with the Giff Conundrum?

I.e. how do you define super power when dealing with divergent species?
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Giff? What or who is that?
AmericanNumbers said:
If there's one super team that has absolutely no grounds to talk about time manipulation? The Legion it is.
Good lord.
Their entire reason for being is to derail a dark timeline.
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Explain? My LOSH knowledge is entirely based on the tv series cartoon.
CTrees said:
hypertime
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Hypertime?
Istaran said:
Records of Batman have lead to the conclusion he has powers.
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https://vm.tiktok.com/TTPdY5pdfD/

If Superman never got kidnapped to the future then Karate Kid might not have joined because it was Superman that recruited him. I only know the tv series.
 
Doccer said:
Hypertime?
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The universes of DC multiverse are static and independent, you could blow up Nazi Earth and not effect Batman is a Vampire Earth.

Hypertime is alternate universes of the "all possible decisions happen somewhere" type. It's an alternate axis of dimensional travel.

So there is a hypertime universe where Superboy got Chinese takeout and another universe where he got pizza for lunch, whatever.

Zoat, in this story, made it a new thing that allows alternate timelines due to time travel shenanigans to continue to exist, but in DC canon hypertime literally predates the creation of the YJ universe, so he took liberties there, writer's prerogative.
 
Wait didnt the whole Crisis on Infinite Pauls cause the downstream to now operate as a branching deal instead of erasing? So there is nothing to fix.
 
Someguy Somewhere said:
A few more that set the tone for some of the pony stuff upon their wandering through.
That did lead to 'Dumb ways to Die' sneaking in there.
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Ah... Yeah, I skipped any songs in the pony chapters.

Stsword said:
but in DC canon hypertime literally predates the creation of the YJ universe,
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Weirdly enough, this is not that straightforward. Hypertime was introduced in The Kingdom, which came out in 1999. Young Justice, as a DC comic line, started in 1998. Obviously, With This Ring follows the cartoon continuity rather than the comic continuity, but Robin, Superboy, and a teen speedster (Impulse), operating as a team in Happy Harbor, mentored by Red Tornado, in a series called Young Justice, predates the introduction of hypertime!
 
CTrees said:
Weirdly enough, this is not that straightforward. Hypertime was introduced in The Kingdom, which came out in 1999. Young Justice, as a DC comic line, started in 1998. Obviously, With This Ring follows the cartoon continuity rather than the comic continuity, but Robin, Superboy, and a teen speedster (Impulse), operating as a team in Happy Harbor, mentored by Red Tornado, in a series called Young Justice, predates the introduction of hypertime!
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Which would be why I specified YJ universe, since the age of the concept of Young Justice wasn't actually germane.

Earth-16 was created as an identical replica to New Earth in Infinite Crisis, 2005/6, and then was made distinct from New Earth in 52.

So again, Hypertime was a thing before the YJ universe even existed.
 
Future Tense (part 3)
13th September 2012
06:53 GMT -5

"I'm not letting the Reach win."

"Okay, I thought you'd say that, but hear me out. If-."

"I've spoken to Abra Kadabra. At length. I know what happens already. Or-"

She shifts awkwardly.

"-I know what would have happened except for my intervention. The Reach conquer Earth, take away metahumans for their metaweapon breeding programs and then eventually abandon the place once Larfleeze decides to eat them. Civilisations the Reach created go their own ways before eventually joining back up as the United Planets."

"Kadab-? Wait, which one was he?"

"The Flash villain? Pretends to be a magician? Turned him into a wooden puppet one time? I think he actually comes from further in the future than the Legion does."

"So… You know."

"So I know." I shrug. "Larfleeze has been disarmed and is undergoing therapy. Qward is in turmoil. The Orange Lantern Corps, the Darkstars and L.E.G.I.O.N. are making inroads into Reach controlled space. Events cannot happen in this timeline as they did in the one the… Legion appear to have come from."

I give her an exaggerated shrug.

"Sorry? Hard luck? This isn't something that can be fixed by Saturn Girl showing no respect for the sanctity of the consciousnesses of those around her. I've changed a lot of peoples' lives, yours not least amongst them."

Actually…

"No personal slight intended, but honestly, you're probably pretty close to being least amongst them. I mean, you missed the Sheeda invasion and I was in at the death on that one."

"Oh. Well. Ah, okay. I guess I… I guess they thought I could talk you into… I don't know, easing off or something. But I guess we're, like… Really far beyond that."

"Yes. Though as I understand it, the changes won't eliminate their present but rather create an alternate past where their history still happened so there's really nothing to worry about. So how long are you here for?"

"Whow whow whow." She shakes her head. "I'm still not over you changing time."

"Well it wasn't me personally. It was the combined effort of Time Trapper me, a giant tuning fork, a few hundred mes from parallel universes and a few hundred Jades. I'm sure at least one dated Mopey Arrow."

"And you've checked nothing got… I don't know, broken?"

"How would I do that? I can't return to Vanishing Point… Okay, I probably could; we've still got the time sphere in secure holding somewhere. Hopefully disassembled. But even if I got there I wouldn't know what I was looking at."

She stares at me for a moment. Then she cautiously stands.

"I… Should get going."

"But I want to get an all-Supergirl group photograph!"

"I should get going because this is way too crazy for me." She starts walking back towards the door, trips on her own feet and catches herself with her flying ability. "This is too crazy for me, and-"

She pulls the door open.

"-I need to check with someone-."

FZZZZZ!

The apartment's defensive shields flash into turquoise existence, a single grey bullet suspended in the air just in front of Dana's face.

"Agh! Oh, it's just a-"

I create a construct wall in front of her and construct-lasso her aside as the bullet bores its way though cruiser-grade shields and punches a crater in my construct!

"-bullet-."

Angle of fire… No, can't see anyone there. Nothing on visual perception, nothing on scan, nothing on empathic vision. Being in the middle of Gotham we're not exactly short on points that overlook the front door. Check cameras… No, they're designed for observing immediate surroundings rather than sniper perches.

Ring, analysis of the bullet?

Projectile entirely disintegrated. Novel energy field observed but did not last long enough for analysis.

"Did you make any enemies in the future?"

"Ah… Yeah?"

"Do any of them have access to time machines? Other than Persuader."

"I mean, Time Trapper? Ah… I don't think.. anyone else does?"

"There's probably a new Time Trapper now, so I can't vouch for their behaviour. Did you recognise the projectile?"

"No. I'm mean, I'm.. bulletproof. I've been shot by railguns and lasers and plasma before. There's no way that would have hurt me." She turns to look at me. "Right?"

"That shield would stop any Earth-produced projectile weapon, including my crumbler rounds. There are truly indestructible things, but I imagine that you're merely very tough."

I run a quick check on the shield emitters… Yes, they're fine. I then close the door, putting a new layer of armour between us and any attackers.

"Is it generally known that you're not kryptonian?"

"Ah-. Kind of. People just assume that I'm part-kryptonian."

"That bullet wasn't kryptonite. I'm not sure what it was. Do you have a contact in this era?"

"… No..?"

"Contact them and let them know."

"How do you know they weren't here for you?"

"They didn't take a shot at me. I was visible when I opened the door to let you in."

"So was I. I had my back to where that came from."

"I don't spend much time here and I teleport everywhere. I hardly ever use the front door. Who knows that the Legion is worried about changes to the timeline?"

"I… Ah. Think I need to call this in. Can..? I stay here for a little while?"

"Sure. But I need to grab some people to start our investigation."
 
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Mr Zoat said:
"Kadab-? Wait, which one was he?"

"The Flash villain? Pretends to be a magician
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Though now he is a real magician.

Mr Zoat said:
I think he actually comes from further in the future than the Legion does."
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From the 64th century if I remember correctly.

Mr Zoat said:
"Well it wasn't me personally. It was the combined effort of Time Trapper me, a giant tuning fork, a few hundred mes from parallel universes
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So it technically was still you.

Mr Zoat said:
I should get going because this is way too crazy for me
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That's what you get when dealing with Paul.

Mr Zoat said:
Ah-. Kind of. People just assume that I'm part-kryptonian
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Or anything else.

Kryptonians are far from the only flying brick species.
 
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