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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

21st year of the reign of King Randor I
Season of Chill
307th day, 16th bell


I lightly shove the book away with a frustrated sigh.

"So that's three sources that contradict each other. I know record-keeping went to pot after Hordak invaded, but I don't understand how these people can't agree about simple factual matters!"
The joy of investigating something that happened a long time ago. Especially in a world that has forgotten so much of that time. It's like modern archaeologists trying to piece together daily life in ancient Egypt from wall decorations and tomb-wards.

Evelyn -who is sitting on the edge of the table, bare right thigh facing me- pulls the book across to her and closes it, running her right forefinger over the front piece with a pale golden glow.

"It's not contemporary. 'Records of Desolation' is a glorified collection of folk tales woven into a narrative a century after the events it alleges to describe. You'd be better off trusting either of the other works." She looks away. "Not that either of them had any direct contact with him."
If there's one fashion trend in Eternia I approve of, it's the 'active ladies wear leotards.' Woof.

"Do you know anywhere better to-?"

She tilts her head back, making a show of looking at the ceiling.
And coincidentally arching her back and pushing her chest out? Yes, one guess what she's trying on Lantern.

"What do you think Nolar would do if I appeared at the festival in disguise?"

"Ah-. The terms of your parole aren't widely known, so I imagine that if he recognised you he'd try to let Sir Duncan know. And possibly try to follow you so he could foil whatever your evil plan was."
At least he won't be thinking with 'Little Blok' this time.

She looks down at me, left eyebrow arched. "I think that you're overestimating his rationality."

"Perhaps, but you did try and burn him to death. That sort of thing can overpower even the strongest ardour. But if we could return to the matter of Hordak?"
Yes, I rather think you've burnt any hope of reconciling with him.

"Did you know that I was there when he turned Keldor into Skeletor?"

I sit back in my chair, giving her my full attention. "No, I didn't. I always assumed that Keldor managed that himself."
...With his face melting off? That'd take some focus and control.

"Hardly."

"With a little help from yourself?"

"I just brought him to Hordak's temple. Ske-. Keldor, performed the summoning himself."
And a jumpstart from your magic. Though you only really played the role of 'starter motor'...

I raise my eyebrows. "Hordak physically manifested? I didn't think he could do that."

"There was a cloud of smoke in the shape of his face." She turns a couple of pages in The Codex of the End Times, stopping on a artist's impression of Hordak's face supposedly copied from a pre-invasion hologram. "Something like that. He's the reason why Keldor wasn't killed by his own acid."
And such an... Impressive face it is. Still a better interpretation that the toy version at the top of that page. Yow.

"Why his head is a floating skull."

"He just asked Hordak to save him. He never said how. Perhaps Hordak didn't like his face."
Or it was simply too damaged to put back together. You see his lips sliding off his mouth there, after all.

I frown. "Is his.. head actually a skull, or is his flesh just transparent?"

"It's actually a skull. His skin is cold to the touch and his flesh is shrunken. I believe that he's some sort of undead creature now, though I've never seen any record of something similar."
No neck either, you'll note. Wonder if the top of his torso has exposed flesh there, or is it a smooth lump with a hole for air and food to pass down?

"Are you having regrets?"

"What, about saving Keldor? Or not asking Hordak to do the same to me?"
...I don't think you quite have the bone structure for that look, dear.

"About Mister Blok."

She raises her eyebrows. "I regret not winning. Does that count?"
Entirely natural regret to have, especially since you were beaten by someone not using magic.

"You brought him up. Know anything else about Hordak that I'm not going to find here?"

"Did you know that Prince Adam had a tw-?"

"Twin sister, yes, I did."
He remembers that much from the eighties, I take it. Since he would have no knowledge of the Noughties version.

She frowns. "They told you? I thought they were keeping that-." Her eyes narrow slightly. "No. You found out. How?"

"Not all these books are particularly reliable. But I've seen enough pictures to know roughly what henchmen Hordak was banished with. If people matching that description turn up after fighting the Eternos guard in the modern era, that's worth noting. I take it that you were involved in that?"
And quite a motley and distinctive crew they are, for sure.

"I took part if the ritual used to bring them here. I was left holding the gateway open until they returned." Her nose wrinkles. "An unpleasant experience."

I frown. "If Hordak can sent soldiers through from his side whenever he wants, why doesn't he do it more often?"
Limited numbers of disposable troops? Management issues? Obscure rules enforced by cosmic entities?

"How would he maintain control of them? Skeletor ensures-. Ensured, that we were forced to compete for his favour and for the resources we wanted. That required us to stay put. If any of us were away from Snake Mountain for any length of time, we would build up our own resource base and so become less dependant on him. Personal loyalty is a fragile thing."

"So what were you in it for? He used the Ram Stone himself after you stole it for him. There's no way he would have shared the power of Grayskull with you."
Heh. He evidently hasn't been gone that long, if she still tends to refer to him in present tense... And if he's some kind of undead, there's no guarantee he's truly killable.

"What are you in it for? If Hordak accepted Keldor as his servant he would be perfectly happy to accept you."

A reasonable enough question. And at this point I'd guess that she's sufficiently invested that she's not just looking for an escape route.
The lady does have a taste for powerful men, doesn't she?

"There's a book series where I'm from, set in the fictional city of Ankh-Morpork. The city's ruler is a man names Havelock Vetinari, and the book describes one of the way he holds onto power as… Convincing powerful groups within the city that it's better to accept the same segment of a larger pie than try to claim the whole of a smaller pie with a knife in it. If he makes the city more powerful, then even if their power relative to other power blocks inside the city doesn't change, their absolute power does."

She nods. "A tenth of ten is one, but a tenth of a million is a hundred thousand."
And it did seem to work quite well for him, barring the occasional old-fashioned idiot trying their hand at rebellion.

"Right. When I joined, the Masters were the military elite of the city-state of Eternos. Now, we're the military elite of a continent-spanning alliance that Eternos leads. And if things keep going, with Keldor and King Hiss out of the way… Why not the whole of Eternia? Heck, as far as I've been able to discover-" I gesture to a small pile of books on the far side of the table. "-Eternia had a unified government before Hordak invaded."

"Your renown will be worldwide. But what would you do with it?"
Make the world better than it is. Which is a common theme amongst Orange-Ringed Pauls, I've noticed.

"Hordak wrecked Eternia's technology base so badly that advanced machines are ancient relics that we can't replace and only a handful of people like Tri-Klops, Sortech or Sir Duncan can even begin to understand it."

She frowns in irritation. "Every single time we've spoken, you've called me Evelyn, and yet you call Tri-Klops by his preferred name. Why?"
It's badass? I mean, he wears an obvious weakness on his face, yet rarely does anyone manage to hurt him...

"Because I have no idea what his name is. We have records of your father, and Kronis dealt in high tech weapons in Eternos's territory for years, but Tri-Klops..? No record until he appeared with Keldor."

"I suppose you can't have scoured every inch of Eternia for one man's name. Though for your reference, it's Trydor, and I'm still waiting to hear what you'd do with your fame."
Oh, no, it's even better than merely 'Trydor'. The Classic series of toys named him thus: Trydor Esooniux Scope. :confused: Imagine the childhood bullying.

"Rebuild the civilisation that Hordak destroyed. Make it so that the technology of your ancestors was commonplace again. Because the stronger Eternia is, the more secure I am. What matters to me is how good my life is; I don't care if other people have a life that's just as good. Surviving examples of the technology of that era are rare, and people hoard rare things. But if I'm trusted…"

I make a point of looking around the library, gesturing to it with my right hand.
...They'll hand you what you ask for, and thank you for the privilege of doing so. Perfect way to use people's own avarice for the better.

"They will give you access, as the Sorceress did." She considers this for a moment. "Hmm. Not so different from my own plans, to tell the truth. I planned to follow Keldor's rise to the top."

"Keldor would never trust you with the power Teela Na has entrusted to me. Not even if he ruled the entire planet and had every artefact of arcane significance stuck in his backpack. And as powerful as he was, I'm not convinced that he has anything like the knowledge required to become more than the king of the molehill. And even if he did, if Hordak's still pulling his strings? Hordak's going to have his own inner circle that you wouldn't be a part of."
Because Skeletor thought small. Sure, he dreamed big, but he wanted everything on a platter immediately. To become truly powerful takes time. He always sought out shortcuts, ones which had big drawbacks that would bite him in the ass.

"True." She looks down at the glowing lettering on her right thigh. Her toned and muscular right thigh. "Despite the indignity, in the long run this may be the best thing that could have happened to me. And if you're being so noble about the command geas, there's no reason why you could not return tom-."

DOOOOOOONG!
An alarm bell? Or merely the sound of Lantern's erection hitting the table? :p

Oh, this is not going to encourage the Sorceress to take another night off anytime soon. Lantern had better not let Grayskull get invaded on his watch, or he'll never hear the end of it. On the upside, he has a lot more options for dealing with intruders than the Sorceress does, between a Power Ring and a hopefully friendly ally. It'll be interesting to see how Evelyn responds...
 
Evelyn -who is sitting on the edge of the table, bare right thigh facing me- pulls the book across to her and closes it, running her right forefinger over the front piece with a pale golden glow.

She tilts her head back, making a show of looking at the ceiling

She looks down at the glowing lettering on her right thigh. Her toned and muscular right thigh.

I can't tell if OL is being dense or obtuse.
 
It seems obvious that Paul and Evelyn are interested in each other, I don't know what that sound at the end was, keep in mind that I haven't seen the entire show, but I do like that you kept Adora and what Paul's plans are. What other alternates are you going to create? Heroes of Might and Magic? Dragon Age? Mass Effect? Witcher? Skullduggery Pleasant? Star Wars? Also, will Paol from warhammer fantasy have to deal with the events from the total war games like the comet or Ursun being held captive? If so I see his mindset making negotiating with the dragons of Grand Cathay easier than most. Sorry about having so many questions all at once but I am curious.
 
I can't tell if OL is being dense or obtuse.
The last person she seduced early got set on fire. Also, as stated, he's in a position of mystically-enforced authority over her.
It seems obvious that Paul and Evelyn are interested in each other, I don't know what that sound at the end was, keep in mind that I haven't seen the entire show, but I do like that you kept Adora and what Paul's plans are. What other alternates are you going to create? Heroes of Might and Magic?
No.
No.
No.
No.
Skullduggery Pleasant?
What?
No.
Also, will Paol from warhammer fantasy have to deal with the events from the total war games like the comet or Ursun being held captive? If so I see his mindset making negotiating with the dragons of Grand Cathay easier than most. Sorry about having so many questions all at once but I am curious.
The Cathay from the game doesn't exist, since it contradicts existing lore and the themes of the setting.
 
The Cathay from the game doesn't exist, since it contradicts existing lore and the themes of the setting.

The incredibly minimal lore? There's already more written for this version than for all prior descriptions of Cathay put together. Like the old French Revolution version of Bretonnia, it's retconned because the old version didn't work. Themes is a more valid point, but I don't see how it's a problem there.
 
What are the chances of Evelyn betraying Paul mid conflict? Are the magical bindings guaranteed to prevent that?
 
The incredibly minimal lore? There's already more written for this version than for all prior descriptions of Cathay put together. Like the old French Revolution version of Bretonnia, it's retconned because the old version didn't work. Themes is a more valid point, but I don't see how it's a problem there.
Psst, that was Mr Zoat for "They are too powerful and my SI wouldn't be able to just walk all over them.".
 
The last person she seduced early got set on fire. Also, as stated, he's in a position of mystically-enforced authority over her.

No.

No.

No.

No.

What?

No.

The Cathay from the game doesn't exist, since it contradicts existing lore and the themes of the setting.
Good point, he really should be cautious but I don't see it as an impossibility

Pity but OK

Alright

Surprising but alright

Very well

It's an urban fantasy book series about a skeleton detective and his partner as they solve some mysteries and save the world, multiple times. Said detective is flamboyant egotistical dapper gentleman and very funny.

Missed opportunity in my opinion but your decision

Oh well, you're the boss but is there anything from the games you will include?
 
Thank you, corrected.
The incredibly minimal lore? There's already more written for this version than for all prior descriptions of Cathay put together. Like the old French Revolution version of Bretonnia, it's retconned because the old version didn't work. Themes is a more valid point, but I don't see how it's a problem there.
Warhammer dragons are animals. They can't talk or use magic. That's a fairly big departure.
What are the chances of Evelyn betraying Paul mid conflict? Are the magical bindings guaranteed to prevent that?
It would be very difficult for her to betray him. Not completely impossible, but very difficult.
Missed opportunity in my opinion but your decision.
I don't like any of the new stuff, and don't remember the old Star Wars books I read in my youth well enough to use those.
Oh well, you're the boss but is there anything from the games you will include?
...

No. Nothing. We're in the build up to Storm of Chaos.
 
It would be very difficult for her to betray him. Not completely impossible, but very difficult.
So she would have either had to have been preparing for a good chance to do it for a while now, and would have to decide that it's worth it to cut a deal with the attackers, or planned for something to happen that day, and been preparing specifically for it. Quite hard to do any of that when she is likely being watched and having her actions, intentions, and loyalties questioned semi regularly.
 
So she would have either had to have been preparing for a good chance to do it for a while now, and would have to decide that it's worth it to cut a deal with the attackers, or planned for something to happen that day, and been preparing specifically for it. Quite hard to do any of that when she is likely being watched and having her actions, intentions, and loyalties questioned semi regularly.
She would have to create a shell personality without using magic, and hope that Teela Na was careless for months at a time and have plan which gave her no way to receive instructions and didn't require her to attack any Eternian.
 
Wrong, that's literally stated to just be the common view of Warhammer Dragons.
Umm... I'm not sure precisely which part says it's a common view of dragons, but since at least 2005's Old World Bestiary for 2nd Edition Fantasy Roleplay, they could talk (Quote at the start and reference 2c). Although IDK if there's anything earlier and given Storm of chaos is before 2005 it might not have been made canon from before the cutoff point Zoats using?

(Responding to Vaermina)
 
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Umm... I'm not sure precisely which part says it's a common view of dragons, but since at least 2005's Old World Bestiary for 2nd Edition Fantasy Roleplay, they could talk (Quote at the start and reference 2c). Although IDK if there's anything earlier and given Storm of chaos is before 2005 it might not have been made canon from before the cutoff point Zoats using?

(Responding to Vaermina)
Ironically that very book.

Each creature entry has two to three different viewpoints of quotes about the creature in question. "Common View", "The Scholars Eye", and for sentient creatures "Our Own Words".
 
Ironically that very book.

Each creature entry has two to three different viewpoints of quotes about the creature in question. "Common View", "The Scholars Eye", and for sentient creatures "Our Own Words".
Wait, by "that very book" are you referring to the bestiary that I used as a reference or storm of chaos?

Given how you're talking I'd assume the Beastiary but that wouldn't make sense as an argument.

(responding to Vaermina)
 
Wait, by "that very book" are you referring to the bestiary that I used as a reference or storm of chaos?

Given how you're talking I'd assume the Beastiary but that wouldn't make sense as an argument.

(responding to Vaermina)
The Bestiary.

Contrary to what Mr Zoat might like to claim, there isn't actually any retconning in Warhammer. What there is, is a boatload of unreliable narrators.
 
I don't like any of the new stuff, and don't remember the old Star Wars books I read in my youth well enough to use those.
I haven't gone through everything in the Legends Timeline either but I agree that it is much better than Disney's works in general, while it did a good job in some cases it failed too badly in others. I'm sure if you were too look you would find videos or articles like wiki pages that might jog your memories like Luke's wife and son but while I am holding out hope it is still your decision.
 
The Bestiary.

Contrary to what Mr Zoat might like to claim, there isn't actually any retconning in Warhammer. What there is, is a boatload of unreliable narrators.
Ok, that might work for in canon or in story reasons but that isn't literally true IRL.

Unless you genuinely believe that Warhammer exists IRL either in this 'world' or another.

(responding to Vaermina)
 
Ok, that might work for in canon or in story reasons but that isn't literally true IRL.

Unless you genuinely believe that Warhammer exists IRL either in this 'world' or another.

(responding to Vaermina)
Unreliable narrators is also the reason GW has given for any narrative inconsistencies.
 
I wonder what a version of OL that landed in the DCU of the recent Harley Quinn series would be like.
 
Star Wars Legends has way too many dumb elements and terrible writing to be of actual use as a basis of a serious story.

I would keep what was written by Timothy Zahn and stuff from the x-wing series, and trash pretty much anything else.
 
Vantavendi (part 9)
20th October 2012
17:34 GMT -5


I look up at the long list of superheroes who've died recently from bullets matching the ones Miss Carlyle was firing. The police had already linked the murders, but she doesn't appear inclined to leave witnesses alive to identify her personally.

Batman looks along the line of youth team members.

"Almost all of the dead were newly active superheroes unaffiliated with any larger group. A few had partners, but there were no groups larger than two. It's the three who were members of the Alliance of the Just that interest me."

He expands their records and dismisses the others.

"Adrian Chase. Vigilante. Noted for using firearms. He had killed alleged criminals on several occasions, but the police ruled those instances justified on the grounds of defense of another. He joined the Alliance shortly after the Manhattan chapter opened, and there was a noticeable drop in his lethality."

Unlike Marvel, Earth 16 doesn't actually have hundreds of superpeople in New York. I remember that in the Justice League/Avengers crossover they noted that DC's New York was actually considerably smaller, but as far as I could see it just sort of merges into the surrounding urban area so I don't know exactly what that would look like. Neither Diana nor Alan are grade-A criminal investigators, so there's a space for a street level superhero ecosystem to develop. I haven't spent enough time there to bother finding out much about them.

"He was found dead two weeks ago from close-range gunshot wounds. Evidence at the scene suggests that his body was moved before it was found, but the police haven't been able to find out where from. They also haven't been able to track his movements in the two hours prior to his most likely time of death."

He walks along to the next image.

"Daniel William Ducannon. White Dragon."

A short way down the line I see M'gann cringe slightly at the flames in his image. New Kara spots me looking and waves, smiling broadly.

"He joined the Chicago branch of the Alliance after several confrontations with local police over his use of his flame control powers during his arrests and his apparent racism. Before he died, he had significantly improved his self-discipline to the point that even officers who'd been critical of his actions spoke of him favorably in the press."

"Lastly, Susan Linden. Black Orchid. Unlike the other two she had no record of excess violence. I haven't yet had time to go through her entire repository of case files, but they appear to be extensive. She also joined the Alliance of the Just recently, and according to their reports did so primarily to gain access to their intelligence-sharing apparatus."

"The Justice League will be pursuing the new Crimson Avenger. I want the team to focus on these three cases. Find out what made them special that she chose to deviate from her usual victim profile. Aqualad, I leave the mission planning to you."

He turns and stalks towards the zeta tubes, leaving us looking at the three holograms.

Kaldur takes a step forward, then turns to face the… Class.

"Orange Lantern, can you brief us on Crimson Avenger's abilities?"

"Recognised, Batman, Zero Two."

I nod, walking out of line until I'm in the middle of the room and then turn, connecting my ring to the hologram projectors and creating an image of Miss Carlyle.

"Miss Carlyle appeared at all times to be surrounded by a cloud of red mist. I can't tell you if that's just because she emits it all the time or because she needs to put it somewhere first in order to teleport there. She can make herself selectively intangible, not sure whether it's at-will or automatic."

"Oh El?"

"Kid Flash?"

"You've got plenty of anti-magic weapons. How come you didn't take her down?"

"My priority was getting Mister Grant to safety, and my anti-magic attacks can be a bit lethal. I didn't know quite how big her kill count was at the time. I'd probably have been able to square an amputation with myself if I did."

Canis leaves the line to walk right up to the hologram, staring into its eyes. Birth of the Author.

"Based on what we've learned, removing her desires probably wouldn't do anything. The guns are talking to her inside her head and she's obeying. With no desires of her own she'd be less able to resist than she is now. Returning to Kaldur's original question, her aim is supernaturally good. She was able to hit me with a round from a Colt nineteen eleven at a range of approximately one and a half miles, her bullet punching through my environmental shield and armour when it hit. There's no way she could have known the wind speed in the intervening space when she fired."

Canis steps back from the hologram. "It is hollow artistry."

Kaldur takes a step closer to him. "What do you mean?"

"Her shots. Her nature. A simple machine can create an image, but art requires a direction of passion. She has none, alive but possessing nothing of life."

"Do you believe that she is completely under the control of the guns?"

"No. If the spirits bound to the guns provided purpose, I would see it." He shakes his head. "I have seen more spirit from Lowlies."

"And you can tell all that for sure from a hologram?"

"The ability lies in me, not in the subject. I can tell."

Richard approaches the hologram, apparently trying to see what Canis saw. "Oh El, can you play it through?"

"Sure."

We all move a little further away and I play the whole encounter through. Richard studies it closely while Canis is far less interested, having formed his opinion already.

Richard shakes his head as it reaches the point where I left the room and the image freezes. "I want to say that she's not moving right, but I don't know if that's true. She's not moving right for a gunfighter, but the guns could be moving around on their own. Or just working the muscles they need."

Artemis shakes her head. "She doesn't think anyone can hurt her. Wonder Woman couldn't. She doesn't need to minimise her profile if no one can attack her."

Wallace looks curiously at her guns. "I didn't think it was possible to dual wield pistols accurately like that."

Raquel shakes her head. "It's not. You can spray a load of lead if you're using automatics, but the recoil means that it won't stay on target."

A few people look curiously in her direction, prompting her to shift awkwardly.

"I hung out with some bad people."

"I tried that at a range, and she's right. Nothing about how she moved suggested to me that she had super strength, and even with super strength the gun would move a bit. She's moving and changing where she's aiming… Something else is going on."

"Hm." Zatanna looks at me. "Did you know his guns were possessed?"

"Not for certain. And I really didn't know where they were."

Richard looks at me. "Where were they?"

"Pass. Though if no one was using them, that suggests that the voices are fairly quiet."

Kaldur nods. "We have three people to investigate. Batman will investigate the other aspects of the case."

"Ah… Do you think that it's worth finding out about the Alliance of the Just more generally? What they're saying to superheroes who come to them with a body count? I know some people who are involved."

Kaldur considers, then nods. "I believe that may be useful."
 
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Umm... I'm not sure precisely which part says it's a common view of dragons, but since at least 2005's Old World Bestiary for 2nd Edition Fantasy Roleplay, they could talk (Quote at the start and reference 2c). Although IDK if there's anything earlier and given Storm of chaos is before 2005 it might not have been made canon from before the cutoff point Zoats using?

(Responding to Vaermina)
In 5th edition, the death of a dragon's rider resulted in a role on the Monster Reaction Table, to see how the dumb animal reacted to the death of it's master/mother figure.
 

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