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Enter the Dragon (Harry Potter/Shadowrun)

Discussion in 'Creative Writing' started by Dunkelzahn, Jul 10, 2018.

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  1. Vallan.Mandrake

    Vallan.Mandrake Know what you're doing yet?

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    I think Hermione is still in the "Magical Britain isn't that different" cathegory. She likes rules and laws and thinks generelly everybody mostly obeys them, so there can't be slavers in Britain.

    I think the purpose of Su Li is to bring the downfall of these Asian operations - she gets a child/children, and takes/steals them, Harry reacts or visits and sees whats happening there, and then defeats everybody and ends up as king. Or something. Her manipulations are annoying - I hope Harry ends up with some other interests with better standing, so she decides a harem is the way to success and manipulates for harmony and friendship.
     
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  2. Skjadir

    Skjadir Experienced.

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    Pretty much what ContemplativeWyrm said I am just wait for the point where Harry stops being as naive as he is and connects the dots, drops her/ deals with the lose ends.
    Su-Li just doesn't fit into the crew even with Abigail being manipulative, Abigail at least has some morals and lines she doesn't cross.
    Su-Li doesn't seem to have any line she isn't willing to cross for the goal and said goal also being in direct conflict with everything the rest of the crew stands for just doesn't make her fit at all.

    For that Harry and the rest of his friends / guardians have to not understand what she is doing, for a pretty long time at that and I fully expect either Snape* or Abigal to sit down Harry when they connect the dots and give him a warning.
    For being the actual downfall of these operations so highly unlikely it isn't even funny as there will be more than enough people that are just waiting to replace them it will be at best temporary if he stomps on them.

    *I kind of expect for the two to talk a lot during the flight and there she might come up, Snape might just flat out connect the dots then and there followed up by a warning how they operate and what they goals are.

    As we are already talking about awful people and the stuff they are doing I really hope Harry gets involved in the stuff over in America and stays involved (company expanding over there for profit and helping combat the Aztecs in some form).
     
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  3. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    Hrm. The lack of any adults doing anything in the Hermione-kiddnapping situation is badly stretching my SoD. Why isn't Dumbledore or Snape just telling her that Harry and Abigail are right? What about her parents? Why is this decision, and attendant interpersonal conflict generation, being left entirety in the hands of a thirteen-year-old? Why are students who are prime kidnapping targets even allowed out where they could be kidnapped, if that's such a problem?

    As for the rest of the narrative, it's good stuff, but I agree it's moving perhaps a bit too slowly- even accounting for the episodic nature of web-forum posting.
     
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  4. Mashadarof402

    Mashadarof402 Experienced.

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    Snape is well aware of Su Li's objective. He's letting her swim because he is looking forward to the hilarity of her finding out the deer of the hunt is actually a dragon and all that entails.

    Basically the Clan expects Su Li to NTR Harry away, but Snape knows the opposite is far more likely.

    Dumbledore has already told Lucius that if he looks at Hermione cross eyed one more time, he's going to go on a suicide run on the Malfoy estate and leave nothing but ashes of the name behind.

    He doesn't tell Hermione because this is adult business, not pipsqueak time.
     
  5. JoelStew

    JoelStew Getting some practice in, huh?

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    The new chapter made a pretty strong point that any slaver would be interested in Hermione. Warning off Lucius won't protect Hermione from slavers who are only interested in the money.
     
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  6. Skjadir

    Skjadir Experienced.

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    Please the moment Snape or any of the other adults on the flight think about the consequences of what will happen when Harry finds out they will intervene likely just by flat out informing Harry of what her goals are.

    The problem is not Su Li succeeding but what happens when Harry finds out and how he is going to take things when she had plenty of time to build trust.
    A furious dragon that now might also have trust issues is not going to end well for anybody.

    It's not just Malfoy but their entire fraction (Death Eaters), he just stated that starts with the Malfoys.
     
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  7. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    Then why hasn't he reassured anyone, to keep stuff like the Abigail-Hermione conflict or the tossing around of silver torcs from happening? The 'pipsqueaks' are using their apparently significant resources to do things about this situation, and nobody is bothering to tell them they're hideously overreacting?

    Heck, if Dumbledore's threat really has dealt with the situation, Hermione is in the right here- she's in no danger and Harry and Abigail really are being pointlessly, intrusively paranoid.
     
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  8. Mashadarof402

    Mashadarof402 Experienced.

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    Because again, this is adult business and should have been done with no one the wiser that the threat existed to begin with. Has Harry even told Dumbledore about his worries?

    I'm pretty sure neither party is actually aware of the other's efforts.
     
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  9. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    The problem is that the threat is a standing one that some of the kids already know exists- entirely too well in Abigail's case. You think they shouldn't be told that it doesn't apply in this case? That this particular section of life is watched by competent minders?

    Harry, for one, has huge resources available to him- and he's throwing them at this problem. All of the adults involved in that seem to think he's got a solid point. None of them are willing to tell Hermione or her parents that this really is a major threat? Or inform them that Dumbledore and the other adults have it covered, Hermione is right and they're being stiflingly paranoid?

    It would certainly take a load of worry off Abigail's mind.

    People are really going on and on about Hermione's short-sightedness and lack of wisdom here... but it really, really looks like she's perfectly correct, and the adults have dealt with the situation like they're supposed to. The only folks telling her otherwise are fellow kids with their own kid agendas.

    (And where the heck are her parents?)
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
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  10. Skjadir

    Skjadir Experienced.

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    ...
    Both Hermione and her parents were warned (I think the same goes for all students that come from non-magical families) about the stuff that can and likely will happen to her and why Harry protecting her is such a valuable thing.
    Again problem is people not fully understanding the danger they are in, her parents not being part of the magical world make them actually judging the danger that much harder in fact the only real point of contact that her parents have with the magical world is Hermione and some teachers.
    It is fully realistic that they just mentally have this shelved under the school/harry got this covered after they talked about how they get Hermione under Harries protection/threat of legal lethal retaliation.

    Dumbledore takes care of the Malfoy and the people in their faction somewhat, that just doesn't cover protection from the slavers.
    Apart from all that Dumbledore is busy, really busy and can't actually offer the protection need for students that aren't in Hogwarts and Harry how is interacting with her much more got this only on short notice.
    That was pretty much the entire problem the short notice, which made warding their house not possible as that would take too much time, and she wanted alone time with her parents so competent minders/bodyguards are also out.

    The reason that Harry spend so much time on this is that he looked for a solution that he could live with (Hermione is protected and if something happens he can retaliate + get her back) and that also covers what Hermione wanted namely to spend some time with her family (just her and her parents).

    For why the school doesn't do more to protect the students outside Hogwarts likely off not enough resources/time, laws and politics.
     
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  11. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    And when those same folks start saying that in this specific situation, they don't have it covered, they... suddenly refuse to believe them?

    And when Hermione ask Prof McGonagall/Snape/whoever if the threat this summer is real and she's taking a serious risk? Or Harry or Abigail asks them to talk to her?

    And when the significant adult-handled financial resources start to flow on this at Harry's behest?

    There's a huge amount of ragging on the 'low Wis score' of a thirteen-year-old going on in the discussion, and not an ounce of discussion on how every adult around her knows of the problem and- in full knowledge that they cannot guarantee her safety, but that she herself can take steps herself to ensure it- aren't telling her anything. Or just exercising the fact that they're adults and she's a child and refusing to let her take stupidly risky actions! The only people paying attention are fellow kids.

    If it's as you say, it's not Hermione that's got the problem, it's her parents and guardians for ignoring all the imminent dangers to her.
     
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  12. hyperspacewizard

    hyperspacewizard Versed in the lewd.

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    I got to wonder if after Harry is an op dragon secret comes out if su li family becomes like a vassal to Harry to not get eaten that could be a neat way for Harry to gain an advantage in the Asian markets and help him create his mega Corp though I wonder what Harry’s mega Corp name logo and colors are going to be
     
  13. Mashadarof402

    Mashadarof402 Experienced.

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    Malfoy was warned because he posed a direct threat against the Granger family.

    The rest is simply a consequence of the society they live in and the Grangers are no more vulnerable than any other witch or wizard who attends Dumbledores school.

    Take Lucius out of the equation, which he did, and Hermione is at much a risk of slavers as Amelia the nobody and Barry the anonymous.

    He's Dumbledore, not Superman. You're asking him to run around the nation exterminating every last slaver and slave profiteering family that ever existed.
     
  14. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    Sure, sure. In which case there is a still a clear threat to Hermione... and the rest of the adults, in full knowledge of it, are putting it on her to decide to walk right into it when there are numerous alternatives.

    Where are her parents and guardians? You know, the ones responsible for setting the summer itinerary of a thirteen-year-old? Have they not been informed of the risk? Are they informed, but disregarding of it? Have they been told that Harry's patronage is addressing the problem and are relying on that... when it's Harry himself telling them not to?

    In shorts, why in the world was the response to this chapter two pages of discussion on how Hermione was a horrible short-sighted low-Wisdom idiot for ignoring Harry and Abigail, when it's literally the duty of every other actual authority figure she knows to set her straight- or simply outright forbid her from doing what is?

    Or, alternatively, is the risk (with Dumbledore's intervention or no) really actually rather low, and Harry and Abigail really are being as over-paranoid as Hermione believes?
     
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  15. Skjadir

    Skjadir Experienced.

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    I am not sure if you get it but both Hermione and her parents how are also her guardians when she isn't at the school were told the dangers.
    So we got that out of the way yes. The thing is neither Hermione nor her parents can't actually protect her in any way because Shadowrun crossed over with HP is "nice" like that.
    She is also in the exact same danger like pretty much every other kid from a non-magical family (and quite a few magical ones).

    Harry how knows a bit more than most what is going on naturally doesn't like the same happening to her.

    The reason for the contract (and why Hermione and her parents even think about agreeing to something that is pretty darn close to a magical slave contract and in many cases is just that) is that Harry actually has the ability to protect her both from being magical powerful enough to stomp on pretty much everything in his way until the other great dragons wake up (and how boy will that get FUN) and politically.
    The reason why that didn't happen before ? Because it will flat out kill her rep and pretty much her future outside of working for harry even with the silver torc.

    You just don't understand that said risk is just flat out part of the setting/is the same for pretty much every other kid not from a powerful/wealthy family and not something unique to her and?
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
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  16. Acolyte

    Acolyte Getting sticky.

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    Fairly sure deagons can't have have children with humans because their babies come from egss that have to be taken care of by a great dragon.

    Also, this is excruciatingly slow. Cqn something intresting happen please.
     
  17. Dunkelzahn

    Dunkelzahn No one of consequence

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    That little tidbit is known to Su Li, who has had an insider's briefing on the economics involved. Abigail suspects, but as far as anyone else knows, Hermione is no more at risk than any other muggleborn in her class.

    Again, this is an information issue. Snape is aware that Su Li is interested in pursuing Harry, but he believes it is the normal sort of pursuit --- strong husband, familial alliance, wealth, etc. --- he has no idea that she is pursuing him in bad faith. He's looking forward to the girl pursuing Harry aggressively only for the tables to turn when she learns of his nature.

    Her parents are back in Crawley running their dental practice while their daughter is away at boarding school. As far as they know, she's fine and everything is normal.

    A point: Malfoy was warned because he was responsible for planting the diary on Ginny Weasley which then almost killed her while she was at school. That was an attack on one of Dumbledore's students while she was under his aegis, which prompted the warning. No one outside the Malfoy family (and their thugs) knows that Hermione was under threat.
     
  18. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    The entire source of the present angst- and the entire reason we had two pages of griping about how 'unwise' Hermione is- is because there apparently is something she could do about it. To whit, don't go running around in the muggle world this summer, and stick to Harry like glue.

    Her (rather, her parents') refusal to take that option is what has lead to the whole torc business.

    I understand it perfectly fine. What I don't understand is how, if the threat is real and the characters in-story are aware of it, the children involved are the ones responsible for addressing it.

    The crux of the issue is that Hermione, unlike many others, has a method of avoiding the peril she is in... and doesn't take it. Instead, she goes for a choice that is both less effective and involves the cultural equivalent of a promise ring.

    In both cases, why is she the one having to make such decisions, and thus prompting the ire of a dozen posters on how she's such an idiot in turning down the 'easy' option?

    If Harry knows 'a bit more', why haven't the numerous, effective, trusted adults that also know that 'bit more', ones that Hermione encounters daily, spoken up about this situation and told her to shut up and take the protection offer? Why is Harry, the fellow kids with fellow-kid agendas like 'I want my friend to hang out with me during the summer', the only one trying to tell her that the world's a rougher place than assumed and she should take the offer of close protection up and catch up with her parents in safer circumstances? Why does Abigail need to make her impassioned plea to Hermione, rather than Hermione's parents?

    If we're looking for "high int and low wis", maybe we should start with the people that actually make the decisions, here?
     
  19. tj10209

    tj10209 Making the rounds.

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    Remember that targeting Hermione started as bad information where Narcissa and Lucius thought it would be a hit on the Weasleys'. With Potters purchase of Hogg's Haulage and going into competition with them it may be assumed by others that it is just another move in the usual trade/influence wars and not the screw up in information it is. It will be interesting to see that once it is known that Hermione is under contract to the Potter's if they try and stop the abduction attempt, push it forward, or try to burn any and all connections that may even remotely associate them with it.
     
  20. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    And that risk is enough for Harry and Abigail to take action... but not enough for any other adult to tell (or order) Hermione to pick the safer option of sticking close?

    I'm really getting the vibe that, whichever way it's sliced, Hermione is either perfectly in the right to think Harry's got a touch of paranoia going on... or she's being massively and simultaneously failed by every adult in her life.


    ...So, is there an informed adult guardian involved in Hermione's care anywhere? Who is in charge of deciding if her (apparently quite high) risk of kidnapping is worth hanging out in the muggle world this summer?

    Really, though, the chapter comes out fine. A bit slow, could use perhaps fewer sideplots. Still, perfectly serviceable, especially for a big long-runner like this story that really needs its worldbuilding.

    It's the following pages of responses ragging on a character who's either at least mostly in the right, or being mushroomed by every adult in her life, that gets my goat.
     
  21. plaguewolf

    plaguewolf Getting some practice in, huh?

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    This is great and I always get super excited when i see a new chapter posted to this story. Don't feel to bad about the pacing, frankly I'm loving the hell out of it, world building, filler, fluff and all. S'Great! Wish there were more stories that were more than just bite sized 50k words long. In my humble opinion a story doesn't really leave the short story category until after the first 100k anyway. To find one that's this well written and approaching 500k? Super rare and much appreciated!
     
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  22. Mashadarof402

    Mashadarof402 Experienced.

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    Because:

    1. Her parents prefer the status quo which hasn't hurt them yet. They are aware of the risks but see no practical alternatives and as long as the risks don't manifest, don't feel the need for excessive change of habits.
    2. Harry has not talked to her parents about this.
    3. Harry's concerns are not rooted on any firm identifiable enemy action. From an outside point of view, he looks like a paranoid ranting about the statistical risks of being kidnapped.
    The last is very important because without any actual target you can point to as impending enemy action, Harry's argument comes across as "never go out on your own, always stick behind a dozen armed guards and shoot anyone who looks at you funny or the grue will get you."

    No matter where you live, I bet kidnappings, murders and street thefts happen there too don't they? Yet you still go out now and again don't you?

    Does that make you an idiot then?
     
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  23. Skjadir

    Skjadir Experienced.

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    I think it is kind of sad that I think it is more likely that the adults noticed and just don't tell, so he learns rather hard lesson when it comes to trusting people rather than them not noticing.

    The problem here is that Su Li is acting openly, in rather obvious ways that show that she has knows at least some of what she is doing to anyone with some experience and Harry is quite important, is a kid, is head of his house, and doesn't have family to point certain things out to him.
    Someone approaching him like she does (ignoring all her internal dialog) should raise all kinds of red flags for people that know just how fucked up the world is, knows about how fucked up politics can get, so it just screams bad faith and is at the very least worth to point out and give a warning for.

    The kids and Abigail are unlikely to notice the because they just flat out lack the experience, but I fully expect the staff to notice that how she is acting and the topics that were/are raised should get them to at the very least warn him about Su Li doing this in bad faith. Her not being local makes this worse not better as sad as that is as it is hard to know how is pulling her strings, goals are unknown, etc.

    Apart from that Su Li is not even half as good at actually manipulating people as she thinks she is (at least from what was shown), she doesn't actually have direct adult supervision with already gathered information to point her at a target, help smooth things out and help plan things out, she also had to gather seemingly most information herself.
    Basically she seems to be lacking all the support infrastructure someone would get if they were actually an important/valuable asset.

    That all point more towards her being an asset that they can stand to lose without gaining anything and maybe get some information about the local politics.

    Edit:
    There is also the interesting part where she finds out he is a dragon, because it could mean that she just flat out flips or at the very least tries to talk with him and hope he is reasonable before he finds out that she was working in bad faith and bad things start to happen.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
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  24. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    Two-thirds the posts immediately following the chapter say "yes!", this gem in particular.
     
  25. The Unicorn

    The Unicorn Experienced.

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    That and because the ven diagram of "Malfoy's enemies" "Dumbledore's enemies" and "people willing and able to attack Hermione" is large enough to be a concern.
    If people knew about Dumbledore's plans someone would try and setup an attack on Hermione so Dumbledore would go on that suicide run.

    In addition to the security issues I mentioned above, there are plenty of other people who might attack her so the precautions are not pointless. Dumbledore ensured Malfoy won't be orchestrating attacks deliberately pointed at students, but that doesn't mean some slave trader won't look at Hermione and grab her to make a profit.
     
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  26. RedX

    RedX Not too sore, are you?

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    Sure, I can see it. She's under no specific threat, but lots of muggleborns go missing in general. So there's still a serious threat to her, even if a general one.

    So why haven't the various adults backed up Harry's idea told her to stick with him over the summer?

    Really, it all comes down to whether Hermione is right and Harry's being paranoid and clingy... or if Harry's right and every other adult in the setting is dropping the ball on her safety.
     
  27. The Unicorn

    The Unicorn Experienced.

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    Because with the specific threat removed she's not in any more danger then the average muggleborn, possibly less (since even if Harry's influence is unofficial anyone checking will find out about it, and think twice if they want to piss off Harry).
    If Harry had asked them to help convince Hermione I'm sure they would, but as it is I doubt they know what's going on between the kids, and as others have noted most muggleborns aren't kidnapped so they figure she'll probably be fine...

    What Hermione is planning is risky, but it's risky like "going to a frat party and drinking the punch" not "playing Russian roulette". The chances of something bad happening are, in an absolute sense, very low. They are however high enough that it is sensible to take precautions.

    Nope. Danger isn't a binary situation, and all the adults except Hermione's parents have dozens of children to worry about.

     
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  28. Ayashi

    Ayashi Well worn.

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    i'll admit she's also a pain in the ass to read. So fucking much repetition and pointless exposition makes it more than just boring to read. I think you could cut out half of her PoV and have the text remain functionally the same.
     
  29. Hk473

    Hk473 Getting out there.

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    When harry shapeshifts, he becomes that species, so we are likely to see both human kids, centaur foals, Veela, merfolk orcish, elven, or other species children running about the lair eventually
     
  30. Shance

    Shance Know what you're doing yet?

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    From what I understand the adults do not know what granger is planing, also? They have no right to interfere.

    now, it is weird that no one is trying to convince her parents about the danger, have them force herm change plans.

    From my POV take out magic and suplant for a simple world with all these dangers. What do you expect your teacher to do? Warn you, okay, but that is all they will do, and they already did it. They have their jobs and their lives, they won’t be going around following all their students and trying to make them safe. Were this year soecially dangerous, they might, but this is an everyday danger.

    she is no their family or loved one, why put that much effort into one of many? It’s not like she is unique.
     
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