General World of Darkness Discussion Thread QQ Edition

How should a normal human, like Tanjirou, feel around a Toreador Elder Vampire with a Humanity rating of 5? Do they scream predator?

What about his sister who may have a Humanity ratings of 7 or 8?

What would be their Demeanours as typical Toreadors?

 

What are some subtle ways to show that a consulting firm is being run by a Vampire or Vampires?


I've made a few ways for the firm:

• Regular Blood Drives which gives cover for the Vampire to feed on people without hunting
• Dim Lighting or Tinted Windows to protect from the Sunlight if they stay overnight
• Working hours are from 9pm to 5am and show
• The bosses are pretty pale and doesn't really age a day to long term employees

Other than that would you recommend some other ways to show that this firm is run by a Toreador Ancilla Vampire with a humanity rating of 8 7? Since this is now Tanjirou's company in the "After Story"

 

There's a lot of well-done art in the firm, the employees you *can* see are consistently 8s and 9s out of 10s, the employees you don't see seem to be perfectly willing to work for nothing if they were asked, the firm sponsors many museums and art galleries, there's a lot of office politics about earning the boss's favor...

Actually, scratch the last part, that's normal.

 

I think I'll change it to a Humanity rating of 7. Ideas on how to show this now?

 

I have another snippet from my Chronicles of Darkness/FGO crossover, and I need people to review whether Kirshtachia Wodime (from FGO) is acting like the canonical dork he is in said snippet:

Spoiler

“Why did you go along with Ken’s plan to bring our future selves or some form of them from a ‘Temporal Iris’ or some sort of mix between Changeling and Mage powers?” I already had a guess; was it accurate?

Wodime looked at us and said, “I wasn’t. Nor am I here to solve your problems for you, despite what I said earlier. I can provide what help I can, but you three - Daniel, Leon, and Ken - have to learn not just to pull your own weight, but also how to take on enemies stronger than you in raw capability and win, just like the Master of Chaldea won against me back in my section of the Multiverse.”

Ken looked at me and said, “Daniel, do not get flattered that we three all got compared to Ritsuka - Wait, Mr. Wodime, is the Master of Chaldea a male or female, and have you played Fate Grand Order as you got reincarnated into a world where it is fictional?”

In response, Wodime showed his smartphone and turned on the FGO app (the smartphone worked in The Hedge because my new mentor had ranks in Prime, Forces, Space, Spirit, and a whole bunch of other Arcana/Spheres that made him only somewhat less powerful than when he fought the Master of Chaldea/Rituska Fujimaru).

Apparently, he was playing the Master of Chaldea as a male, had named him RITSUKA (allcaps), and had gotten to the part where his former self was killed (not by Ritsuka, but by one of his own friends and compatriots) and because he was playing in the North American Server, had gone no further unless he had an account in the Japanese Server too.

Then he looked at Leon and grinned a little, saying, “You didn’t get past when I defeated the Master of Chaldea and his friends in Atlantis - Not the one in this universe, the one which may actually just be an invention by Magi reassuring themselves that no, the world was not always ruled by the Exarchs/Supernatural Concepts of Tyranny - but the cooler one with Mechanical Zeus and Super-Magitech, haven’t you?”

My brother scowled and said, “No, I didn’t, but you were pretty smug in that fight, so…”

 

Question would using Dread Graze, Awe and Entrancement work in the bedroom? And if so what happens if you use one or more of those powers? Does it change things?

 

Another few days, another snippet (Cross-posted from SB):

Spoiler

The Mangled Margrave cleared his throat and said, “So, now that you three have been tasked to take on the Maker of Crowns with your own power, and not borrow from others’ own, at least not without payment… What is your plan? What would you seek to buy from me to give yourselves a fighting chance?”

“I…” my mind had hit a wall, and from their expressions, Leon and Ken looked stuck in a rut as well, unable to think of an idea or a plan, although I did have a vague idea for a cloak of invisibility or some other way of sneaking into a True Fae’s domain for the purposes of stealing from them.

Then I had a very basic idea. I pulled out my own smartphone and spoke, “And as FGO is actually a recording of things that happened in another universe, I can transfer my FGO account to you as, unlike the other True Fae, you seem to be acquainted with Human technology and its principles, including what is needed to use a smartphone.”

The Mangled Margrave’s face lit up with small glittering lights at that, which I knew were a sign of agreement. His next words as he grinned widely, showing copper teeth, were, “Perfect, perfect! This will do nicely! Now, which of my many marvels and wonders do you ask for?”

I nodded and asked, “I want a cloak of invisibility that can deceive even the ‘Maker of Crowns’... As well as all the knowledge you have of that True Fae’s capabilities.”

What I want to ask is: What are the probable consequences of giving a True Fae (well, a 'Charlatan' who has had his Fae nature altered or sealed by contact with the God-Machine, but that's pedantic) a copy of Fate/Grand Order, in a story where the Nasuverse exists independently of Chronicles of Darkness?

Also, I asked a friend for help in making a Changeling the Lost True Fae, but I want to ask you guys for general tips anyway. What exactly are the difference between Titles, Actors, and Domain/Whatever the Genius Loci part of the True Fae are called? And how does one steal, say, a Crown which allows you to usurp a Rank 5 - 6 Spirit or equivalent (technically, it's a Queen from Princess the Hopeful, the Queen of Tears herself, but semantics) from a top-level True Fae with minimum consequences?

 

If the Toreador is usually the most humane, high humanity or good clan where do the other clans fall? Which one is on the opposite side of the spectrum?

 

I don't have any idea were that came from... Toreador tend to be horrible (as do all other vampires).

Half of them are socialites spending their days scheming against other kindreds and using younger kindreds and mortals as pawns in their schemes for more influence, not caring who they hurt.
The other half are artist and everything is cool for the first few centuries or so, but damn nothing is more scarier than a Toreador who lost his muse, they will do anything to get it back, Like doing the most depraved things one can imagine.

So yeah I wouldn't see them as a "good" clan and "humanity" is something very personal, Clan only has a marginal influence on that.

 

Pretty much all clans are really horrible, lead by monstrous narcissistic sociopathic psyhopaths.

Only clan that could be ever considered as most humane and made of relatively "Good" Vampires would be Clan Salubri but they went extinct after thier leader, Saulot was diablerised by Tremere.

 

Children of Osiris maybe count too? Mostly because of their discipline, that requires high humanity instead of lower generation to unlock 6-9 dots

 

What necromancy rituals or powers do you think Rokkaku Sadayor should have?

Here's his discipline set as an Elder Toreador Vampire:

Discipline	Equivalent of dots in said discipline
Auspex	six
Presence	six
Celerity	six
Fortitude	Six
Animalism	One
Necromancy	One
Vicissitude	One
Dominate	One

I'm using V5 and V20 rules here. But v20 takes precedents over v5. So I'm open to options and thoughts. This is Taisho Japan.

 

Apologies for the sidetrack, but mind if I ask what Hunter (Hunter the Vigil, CofD/nWoD 2e) Conspiracy would Calvin from Calvin and Hobbes (yes, the Newspaper Comic) belong to, and what Conspiracy would allow him to keep Hobbes (as a Spirit-possessed Stuffed Tiger)?

Calvin will be aged up to 26, btw.

 

What should be a net worth of a Toreador with 3 dots in Resources?

 

I published a new fanfic relevant to the interests of people who like Chronicles of Darkness/New World of Darkness 2e!

SB Link.

QQ SFW Link.

 

Dude don’t bold and increase the font

3 dots is three dots no mattter clan or species

3 is reasonably well off businessman. Not rich but well off

just use this website
https://saligia.fandom.com/wiki/Backgrounds

 

It also does slightly vary by edition/line. Like the first versions of Vampire had Resources 0 be literally on the streets destitute, while V20 has it either that level of destitute or just the most basic of basics because becoming a bloodsucker removes most of the basic requirements for living from you.

 

The players in my Gehenna campaign *fought* an antediluvian (one of Lilith’s apostates)

Wizard Walt Disney summoned every character ever put to film by his company while the players and a Giovanni family reunion were sieged in Disney land by the entire population of LA transformed into the Ante’s zombies

They ended up grabbing Lilith’s pseudo-adopted daughter and running into the sewers to avoid the rain as it made people who failed a will save commit suicide and climbed through there to a hotel while calling a plane to do a fly by (most of the party has potence or movement of the mind) only for the windows of the hotel to be broken by possesssd owls that Kokomo (Toreador) set on fire with Daimonion.

The Ante got to the roof before them

Players: We can handle this, we’ve killed antediluvians

Me: While they were in torpor

Kokoro: I am a master swordsman, Za Warudo (Temporis) and Ultra Instinct (Focused Mind) *rolling over 12 dice to hit*

Me: She dodges

Kokoro: I have 6 more actions *manages one hit with no damage* Um

Me: So Erinyes was waiting since she didn’t want to strike the first blow in front of the kid. Roll to not die

Kokoro: *has her neck snapped and thrown at her boyfriend so hard Iskander’s arms are instantly broken*

Bruce: *heart punched out and thrown into the ocean*

Me: The plane you guys called is here, i will let you guys that are conscious act as Erinyes is just there smiling

Kokoro: Iskandar is just running

Basket: I pick up the child while flying and tell the plane to start shooting

Me: Abbas

Basket: Wait, our Lasombra friend has potence 9, he might be able to win

Me: Abbas throws the other NPCs up into the open plane doors, that takes up all of his actions since he is saving your ghouls

Basket: Can he jump?

Me: He does not have that much celerity to go around saving everyone and do that. He does take his sword and quote the Quran at the necromantic evil

Basket: Honestly, he might survive

Me: You also sense true faith, neither of them are moving as Erinyes is actually guaging if she wants to deal with true faith and if that is a new thing

Basket: I almost wish I let him doablerize me to get a power up

Me: If you made that sacrifice for the greater good, I might have done a full on Jojo ascent to heaven scene

 

Bruva Alfabusa/TTS/Hunter the Parenting crew did a 48m introduction video for WoD.

 

I updated my Chronicles of Darkness fanfics (links are in my sig)!

 

Updated my Chronicles of Darkness + FGO fic!

 

I think it would be funny to have a quest about a newly awakened Mastigos spending all of his time using magic to get laid while only occasionally paying attention to what the Panopticon wants him to do. Obviously, smut is nice, but I also think it would be pretty funny to have a main character who is wrong-genre-savvy. Acting like a QQ protagonist while living in a Cosmic Horror Story would inevitably lead to drama or comedy until it killed you.

It would also be a bit funny if the MC pretended he wasn’t evil after being recruited by a group of Seers who are pretending to him that they aren’t evil either.

Thoughts?

 

You’d probably want an info dump in the index to explain more but it sounds fun

 

I feel like if I was a good writer, I could reveal the setting info to unaware readers at the same time as the MC learns it in-character.

 

PlasticSoldier , you liked my fics, it seems. You okay with giving deeper commentary on them in their threads or here?

 

Some 1e MtAw questions:

- Is there anywhere that they actually said what degree of Wisdom sin it is to summon a Gulmoth? I know the Summoners book calls it an act of "direst hubris", but it never actually gives a number and it specifically notes that sacrificing humans to pay a summoned Gulmoth is Wisdom 1 which kinda implies summoning one without human sacrifice is not quite as bad.

- Did they ever clarify Phantasmal Weapon's limits? (i.e. can you make a gun or suit of armour that has +30 equipment bonus, or is it limited to whatever a nonmagical item of those dimensions gets, or the normal+5 of Alter Efficiency?)

- Was there any kind of definitive word one way or another on whether non-Banishers can use the spells in Banishers? Some of them are hilariously OP, and one of them was called out elsewhere in the text as something normal mages can't do.

- Is it just me, or are Mastigos a bit too good? Mind can do a very-large number of things quite well - buffs (Euphoria and Supreme Augmentation are amazing, and Gain Skill's very versatile), attacks (Psychic Assault/Sword are covert making them spammable, and Assault's also three-dot so you can do an extended sympathetic cast pre-archmastery which only Celestial Fire shares, plus straight-up combat mind control - I know Mental Shield is a thing, but that's also Mind and only Prime can substitute), and minionmancy (Goetic Evocation, one of multiple Arcana in Tulpa/Autonomous Servant/Manifold Presence/homunculi, as well as just mind-controlling people to help you), as well as the Wisdom-cheating spells - and Space is obviously great as a conjunctional but also has the rules-headache Apportation and Ban (the former because of the "teleport IED into enemy bedroom" and "steal magic items" uses, which could maybe be argued to require more than Matter 2 Space 2 but are utterly absurd if they don't, and the latter because you need more successes than the Ban to ignore it and "walk forward" isn't actually a rolled action so it's not clear how contesting being personally Banned is supposed to work), and again a lot of the countermeasures also need Space (even Prime isn't a huge amount of help against Apportation abuse).

- Lines of Power has a character with "Flaw: Sociopath". Anybody know what book this is from and what it does?

 

Pretty sure the Wisdom 1 sin here is the "sacrificing of humans" and not the summoning in itself. In general they need a "corrupted" space to be summoned, so if you can get that without losing Wisdom you are "fine" on that end.

The summoning itself is difficult I think there are arguments for Wisdom 3 to 1.

There is of course the "Tithe" the Gulmoth needs to be paid which depends on the individual (are Gulmoth individuals? Who knows). Oh yeah if you summon a Gulmoth and not on of the less problematic summons, that's probably because you need something only they can do... Most of which are at least Wisdom 2 sins.

Which Sourcebook that from? Can't say I remember it.

Not really, Banisher Spells aren't "normal" spells so while they have ratings like Mind 2 (most likely for mechanics reason) or something a Mages Mind rating wouldn't help them cast the spell, that said while a Mage may not learn from Banishers they may be able to "invent" spells with similar affects. So I personally would allow a player to gain a Banisher Spell iff there is a RP aspect behind it of them trying to develop something over multiple sessions.

I don't have my 1E Rulebook here as I don't own it as a PDF so I will have to look up the exact texts later, so take everything I say with a grain of salt as it's mostly from memory (so chances are some is 2E stuff I got confused about).
-Yes those are all good mind spells, keep in mind they come with the drawback that whoever they use them on has to have a mind, so they are at heavly disadvantage against construct and stuff.
- There is also a Fate spell that protects against all supernatural abilities trying to alter ones Fate, which includes making someone do something against there will like mind control. So that should also work besides Mind and Prime,
- Most enemies tend to survive an "IED being teleported to them" (same goes for IED send forward in time to arrive at their meeting, live would be much easier otherwise) also in my experience most mages will just ward their places (or have someone else do that for them), not sure here but don't you also need a sympathic link to the location to teleport there anyway or was that 2E?
-I'm pretty sure "Ban" can't be ignored you can only get around with magic which will cause a clash.

That said you make it sound like other Mages can't learn Space or Mind Magic you can be Ancanthus and still have high Mind and Space stats

 

Yeah, that's exactly the same as what my gut feel was (since antinomian spells are Wisdom 3). It's just that there's no actual mention that I can find.

MtAw corebook. Phantasmal Weapon is a Prime 4 spell that makes, well, phantasm weapons (and armour).

That's the whole description. Note the lack of a limit on how many successes can be dumped into equipment modifier/armour points. For instant casting, of course, it's not really very relevant - you'll be lucky to get more successes than a mundane weapon's modifier let alone a Matter-boosted one, and that's without taking penalties for extending the duration (it's Prolonged). For extended castings, yeah, needs some clarification.

A lot of them are fine and even good (Call Eidolon in particular is a spell that should be available), but some of them are just lolworthy like Trojan Horse (imbue Sleeper with Thunderbolt, next person who casts anything near said Sleeper gets zapped, "The spell released in this way from a Sleeper requires no roll to hit. Damage caused by the spell is equal to the caster’s Gnosis + 3"), Confuse Language (removes target's ability to use language, but is resisted instead of contested and has full effect on one success), Pierce Magical Shield (Prolonged self-buff that gives "I ignore all Shielding"; this makes the arms race break decisively in favour of rocket tag), and Desiccate (transfers dots of Physical Attributes and Health from a target to you, stacks with itself, no duration listed).

It's not a spell, it's the ability Unfettered at Fate 4 that lets you reflexively counterspell. But yes, I hadn't noticed that it worked on mind control. There is also True Love, which is Fate 5 and amounts to "no mind control if the lovers are together" (because their dice pools to resist are added together, and you're not beating that). Neither works on Psychic Assault/Sword, though.

You do.

The issues with the Somebody Set Up Us The Bomb plan, from my POV, are these:

1) It's available too soon; sympathy murder otherwise requires four dots in an Arcanum (and even then it has to be Mind or Prime, since there are no other non-aimed non-touch attack spells at three dots; Life and Death need five and in Death's case that's Devouring the Slain which has some serious asterisks).
2) While you do get the penalty for sympathy, the reason sympathy murder usually fails (even without Wards) is because that penalty's stacked on top of a bunch of others (no-name penalty, resistance, Occultation, Magic Shield), and all four of those trigger off being directly affected which teleporting grenades doesn't do (okay, the no-name penalty applies to the scrying, but once you've gotten that through the Apportation ignores it). And you only need one or two successes per bomb despite bombs doing a lot more than two damage each (they do Force automatic levels + Force dice, and there are Size 2 explosives with Force 5+).

Ward does work, though, which is why I said you kind of need Space to block it.

I mean, that's one way of looking at it (the other way is that it adds extra stuff blocked to a Ward, which can be overcome with X successes), although that gets even sillier in terms of "you need Space/Prime to pass" hardstop. (The ultimate example is probably the "Ban one dude from one side of a motorway" trick where he gets squished against the Ban by his car's momentum, but there are a ton of other applications e.g. "Ban someone from an area that encircles him and now he's stuck with no ability to resist".) It is probably Life 4 to Ban people, though (not actually spelled out for some reason), so that's something.

Sure, but if X and Y arcana are better than others, then the Path that pays less for them is advantaged (Mastigos also don't pay 1 Mana for using Psychic Assault/Sword without the rote, and their spammability due to being Covert is the whole issue).

 

So I got my 1E book now, means I will not have to guess anymore, which is nice. Also I probably should say that I'm more in it for the RP aspects and tend to not care that much about actual combat, so someone cheesing some encounters isn't a problem for me, so I may not recognize some of the balance problems.

There are two possible interpretation here:
1) only the first roll with a success can count towards the armour/weapon creation, so player gets to choose how many of the successes he wants to use on the spell and how many on other "modifiers" all other rolls are for the "modifiers" from the extended casting only <- This interpretation is closer to the rule insofar that the first success normally is equal to the instant cast process
2) After applying all the "modifiers" you get a target number once that is reached the spell comes into affect, the number of extra success you have on the last role to get you over the target number are the successes you can use for armor/weapon creation

To me it's less about how strong (or silly) a spell is and more about what "Banisher" Spells are supposed to be

I always took that as those are "no traditional" spells so if a PC wants to learn them he has to create them via a similar Trial and Error process. It also means if someone wants to learn Banisher Spells he would have to come up to me as the ST and we would figure out how the process goes, which gives me a way to look them over and be like "Yeah that one is okay" or "Sorry, I don't think that would work for a PC the spell is a bit to silly, maybe if we modify it like this..." Not like people come up that often wanting to learn Banisher Spells, it happend once.

Was thinking of "Warding Gesture" which is a Fate 2 spell in 2E

Okay let's assume that you could get the scrying going (because for some reason you have a low penalty, maybe you are betraying someone and are familiar with their place) and you get it timed in such a way that the person you are scrying on doesn't notice and counter spells you instantly, than you could send a bomb through via Apportation. And after that you can use your scrying to interact with it and make it explode (you probably wouldn't want to have it rigged to explode beforehand, as you would have a bomb about to explode next to you in case you fail the scrying, also would allow you to bring over multiple explosive before alerting everyone (cause once bombs are starting to go up people will notice and start getting turns). Of course the "enemy" should get a chance to notice after every cast of Apportation as it's very vulgar magic cast "near" them.

P.S. I'm not sure what Matter rating a bomb has as a complicated mechanical device it has to be at least 4 maybe even 5. So you would also need a high Matter rating to send it in the first place.

You could do that, if you also have a high enough life rating (4 or 5 I guess depends how you want read it, probably is easier to stop a part of the car and have him crash because of it), I would argue that if Ban is used in that it would become vulgar meaning that at this point you could just have create an actual wall in front of the car.

Yeah but it's not like X and Y arcana are supreme it's more like X and Y arcana are better for some tasks. E.g. average Mastigos wouldn't win a direct fight against a average Obrimos. So the Mastigos would try to not get in a direct fight most likely while the Obrimos wants to do so, at this point it becomes a game where they try to set up a scenario in which they have the upper hand.

I mean punching someone in the face is also spammable (and with one cast of "Kinetic Blow" a Force 2 spell you can even have it cause lethal damage)

 

I'm very confused by your #1. Is that something from 2e? Because nothing ever works like that in 1e extended casting.

#2 is a mechanic that does exist in 1e (it's how you check for exceptional success, and in the unofficial errata it's how you soak up Paradox for extended spells), but it's not at all how I'd read it. The successes are either Potency or a unique primary spell factor; either way, extended spells have no primary factor, so you decide how many you want, adding to the target number, and then you start rolling to achieve them. The obvious analogy is Forge Thaumium (which, now that I look at it, actually has the same "no listed limit" issue).

I mean, yes, that's the sensible way to rule it, as I said to begin with. It's not at all obvious that this is the case from the spell, though.

I'd dispute the "wouldn't win in a direct fight". Forces and Prime have few combat-relevant buffs (Magic Shield being the big one), and Supernal Dispellation isn't a very good combat buff-remover because it has to beat Potency and the Potency of extended-cast buffs is usually too large for an instant-cast dispel to win (this is the best thing about Eyes of Ain Soph - they have a no-roll Supernal Dispellation as third attainment, so they can remove buffs mid-combat). So the Obrimos has Magic Shield giving -Prime to all the Mastigos' direct magic attacks, but the Mastigos has +Mind to any that are rotes (because Supreme Augmentation) and doesn't drop until full agg (because Euphoria) and gets better boosts from Willpower (because Supreme Augmentation raising capacity to 10 and Zeal giving +5 dice/+3 resistance per point). Mana for attack spells is a wash; the Obrimos has All Of The Mana and can recover it in-combat, but the Mastigos' Psychic Assault, Psychic Sword and Psychic Domination are covert/costless. Thunderbolt is very good, though (at least, in the lethal form which ignores Defence), so I don't think the Mastigos would outright have an advantage.