"Realistic" superpower martial arts?

[Nerx]

Logic dictates a few things about certain abilities. And I'm putting them into broad classifications for these purposes. Very specific, rare, powers will not likely have generalized combat styles. And some powers have no potential style at all (like a girl with the power to change her hair color at will... if you can find a way to weaponize that, you're better than me- and, no, she can't select 'glows so bright it burns out the retina' as a color).

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Challenge Accepted.

If it works via changing pigmentation, then there's all sorts of potential chemistry and poison producing applications. Possibly implying she has a few required secondary powers (immune to whatever pigment her hair is currently using) that are of more interest. If it works via bullshit appearance magic, then growing her hair as long as possible and becoming a camouflage master sounds potentially viable.

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Arguably done right this is one of the most busted abilities available with not much uses on the surface, that makes it a target for underestimation.



Hypnotic patterns or the ability to induce seizures at will can be a huge advantage in a fight, honestly even something simpler while fighting sleeveless or just with boxers lets one fuck up the analytical abilities of their foes. Being unable to properly judge distance or power can lead to one getting tagged multiple times.



Misdirection, and feints are a big thing of the game after all. Take it from a current UFC middleweight champ who trains in a gym with the lightweight champ.

Being able to do it to a degree essentially makes your skin into a tv surface or screen, you can make yourself look more damaged/injured than it actually is to bait the fuck out of them

 

[TanaNari]

Damn, blasty from the pasty.

I would add endless stamina and stamina/sustenance drain for those opting for attrition or preserverance methods.

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Ooh, that's a good point. There's a lot you can do with endurance.

alternatively, go all-in on close quarters, don't let him get a full swing out, and stay right in his face and super-strength doesn't necessarily mean invulnerable. get them to punch something they shouldn't like live wires or support beams.

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The problem with that is body slams. Grapple-hugs. Be like fighting a grizzly. A real fight with a real grizzly, not a trained stunt animal.

Being able to do it to a degree essentially makes your skin into a tv surface or screen, you can make yourself look more damaged/injured than it actually is to bait the fuck out of them

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I mean, yeah, if you add more abilities. If you assume absolute control is possible and it doesn't require any thought or concentration, if you assume there's enough body hair and it's dense enough...

But the ability as originally stated doesn't include those sorts of things.

 

[The-Lewd-Dude]

Damn, blasty from the pasty.

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Wait that a weird thing to say for something that was posted maybe yesterday...
*looks at post date*
Oh shit I really didn't even look at that.

The problem with that is body slams. Grapple-hugs. Be like fighting a grizzly. A real fight with a real grizzly, not a trained stunt animal.

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Fair enough. Hontestly supersteghth is kind of one of those powers you cant really come up with interesting counters for since it's basically people +

 

[TanaNari]

Hontestly supersteghth is kind of one of those powers you cant really come up with interesting counters for since it's basically people +

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I mean, the one thing I can think of that could work is something that takes away leverage. Super strength doesn't necessarily mean super footing. A grizzly has a great deal of raw power, but they also have broad feet, run on four limbs, and outmass a human two to four times over.

With the boosted muscle power on a man's frame, well, ever try running in sand? You can do it, but damn is it a pain.

Actually, probably more like running on ice. All the power of a v8 engine. All the traction of a pair of sneakers.

A super-strength art probably spends a lot of time on teaching footing and use of environment to overcome that issue.

 

[2 Hot Crown Subdues the Sinful]

I mean, the one thing I can think of that could work is something that takes away leverage. Super strength doesn't necessarily mean super footing. A grizzly has a great deal of raw power, but they also have broad feet, run on four limbs, and outmass a human two to four times over.

With the boosted muscle power on a man's frame, well, ever try running in sand? You can do it, but damn is it a pain.

Actually, probably more like running on ice. All the power of a v8 engine. All the traction of a pair of sneakers.

A super-strength art probably spends a lot of time on teaching footing and use of environment to overcome that issue.

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Aerial Combat? Jumps & Rolls?

Or Ground Game, like Grappling.

Pankration.

 

[FTR2017]

Huh, this is quite the interesting thread--and inspiring, too!

My perspective is this: all martial arts use a baseline human who trains the hell out through years to gain the instincts required to go alongside muscle memory to fully take advantage of their training and physiques.

With superpowered people appearing in true mutant fashion? I figure that martial arts would change little aside from gaining some adepts depending on the classification that TanaNari already posted since tools would be the way to equalize apparently bad matchups.

Superstrength types would focus on their footing and how to make the impact matter more in terms of keeping the energy focused on the target--no sending people flying except upwards to make the most out of the landing impact with the help of that devious bitch called Gravity. Rebounds lessen the energy imposed on the target due to energy transfers onto the hard surfaces. Boxing and Karate seem like a good start for these, with technology to bridge the gap. Aka. A brute with a heavy gun can keep a blaster mutant at bay and even win in the exchange, as the brute would be a two-legged tank needing a different approach into defeating him. Tear gas, poison, narcotics, chemicals would be a good choice in subduing a brute.

In a totally different manner a finger-reliant powered mutant would need to a)bridge the gap as quickly as possible for direct physical contact, or b)use feints and trickery to let his enemy move closer without risking his neck even further. Tai-Chi, non-competitive Karate with a focus on open-palm strikes, Snake-Style Kung-Fu or Tiger-Style which is brutal with its hand strength being able to rip out necks.

A speedster would need to take into account drag and inertia to fully take advantage of his speed, so boxing, kick-boxing, Leopard-Style Kung-Fu, or even Penkat Silat, with perhaps the use of sharp knives due to their reduced drag for lethal applications to slice enemies to ribbons or cut off their tendons, compared to batons which have greater drag but give in return blunt damage which can be massively amplified depending on speed and weight of said baton.

Flyers though? They generate their own footing and would benefit greatly from hit and runs or the use of the environment or tools to do the damage for them, perhaps the use of batons in Savate. Using a trash bin to blind the target, then grab them by the arm and neck and fly--only to imitate the eagle that caught the turtle and letting the target go greet Madame Gravity. For brutes, they'd need tools since they don't have the means to survive close contact with a brute that can squeeze the life out of the flier.

Is this post appropriate to the context of the thread? I'd like a confirmation, just so that if needed I can edit this post to make it fit properly.

 

[TanaNari]

Is this post appropriate to the context of the thread? I'd like a confirmation, just so that if needed I can edit this post to make it fit properly.

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No, it's all pretty much on point.

 

[FTR2017]

No, it's all pretty much on point.

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Oh, that is good then!

I'll make this addition to my previous post, since it involves my own perspective regarding mutants with indirect environmental manipulation--remote levitation powerset--like psychics and magicians or area-of-effect powersets, with the dreaded precogs saved for last!

Mutants with the capability to manipulate the environment and change it to their pleasure would be a nightmare to approach since they can affect the footing of anyone coming their way--or in the case of AOE mutant powers, they can simply raise the density of attack power to remove any advantage gained by cover.

All this while not needing to get into close range.

Due to this, their worst matchups are with riflemen, snipers, gunmen, explosive experts with lots of smokebombs, fliers, proper fans of parkour and kick-focused artsteams with the capability to distract the mutant and play sleigh of hand against him. For one of these who wants to shore up their close-combat weakness, Judo, Aikido, Brazilian Jiu-jitsu and Muay Thai are appropriate choices.

All these are appropriate to punish anyone who manages to get too close to comfort who is within the range of humanly strong and tough while making sure that the throw gains distance once more. Two for their channeling of their enemies' strength away from their body while making distance, and the third to deal catastrophic damage focused on the head and shoulders.

Naturally, dealing with brutes in close combat is a fool's errand for these people. Bury them in rubble, or make them slam repeatedly onto the floor while applying maximum pressure with every impact to reduce the dissipation of kinetic energy. AOE can dig a ditch to bury the brute in or any use of their powerset to distract, overwhelm, and contain.

Precogs on the other hand can plot in advance how they will strike, where will they strike, how will they use the environment to aggravate any injuries or enrage their adversary into becoming sloppy. These would benefit the most from Vietcong-style Training using punji pit-inspired traps, Penkat Silat, Savate, and the Russian military martial art Sistema for their human-tier mutant and normal human enemies who get in close contact.

Otherwise? Battlefield control, sabotage of elements that the opposition wants to use--or to remove any control for their benefit, trapping, distractions, psychological mind games are fair game to distract and confuse the superpowered foe into beneficial actions. The use of tools is a must to ensure an advantage or to bridge the gap.

Precogs do not fight fair ... and neither do area of effect powers and explosives that can be used to counter them damned precogs!

 

[Nerx]

I mean, the one thing I can think of that could work is something that takes away leverage. Super strength doesn't necessarily mean super footing. A grizzly has a great deal of raw power, but they also have broad feet, run on four limbs, and outmass a human two to four times over.

With the boosted muscle power on a man's frame, well, ever try running in sand? You can do it, but damn is it a pain.

Actually, probably more like running on ice. All the power of a v8 engine. All the traction of a pair of sneakers.

A super-strength art probably spends a lot of time on teaching footing and use of environment to overcome that issue.

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Super strength comes with a built in counter, there is a reason why most muscly dudes dont pick combat sports as their main career choice.

Stamina, since the hearts gotta pump all that blood to feed all those muscles with oxygen. Gotta be efficient in fights.

Like those fighters bragging about round 1 knockouts having problems in round 11 breathing.

 

[TanaNari]

Super strength comes with a built in counter, there is a reason why most muscly dudes dont pick combat sports as their main career choice.

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I operate on the assumption that superpowers rely upon a non-biological power source. Otherwise, every flyer would have about twelve seconds of airtime before they die of heart attacks, and lasers that couldn't even break skin would consume about a kilogram of body fat per second.

 

[Nerx]

I'd also put moisture draining, specific and touch based but exceedingly lethal

Lots of fighters tend to due by massive weight cuts during their press cons, less moisture also makes it easier to knockout someone

Dehydration and Rehydration is one of those things that caused sports wide concerns, and there are new rules made

Some big promotions use IV drip methods afterwards and other safe measures

 

[Somebody]

I had an idea for a fight that directly invokes this.

Basic gist, it was speed+durability vs strength. Both fighters had super strength but no flight, which meant they were forced to find ways to stop themselves from sliding backwards when hitting each other, which would reduce the force they were exerting. Speedy guy did so by Rock Lee'ing it, hurling themselves at their opponent and using their momentum to offset the force being exerted on them, while strongman was a grappler who turned strength into torque. While speedy guy didn't have a lot of mass their speed and durability made up for it—the direct comparison was to a metal bat, which could still break bones despite being lighter than a wooden bat and hollow besides.

But it was also noted that the strongman was still the more efficient fighter. There's an upper limit to how hard he can be hit before the force overcomes his inertia and kinetic energy makes him move. The only way to counter that would be to hit him from the opposite direction, which would then restrict the angles of attack for speedy guy. Meanwhile, strongman could convert more of his strength into direct force because his grappling kept all the forces balanced in the body—all that energy would directly translate into joint-breaking instead of forcing the opponent to move.


Also, I feel like not enough people consider just how incredibly useful flight can be to improve your CQC skills. Almost every striking martial arts that I know of relies on efficiently transferring forces through your body, needing solid footing to brace yourself against the ground. On unsteady ground, martial artists can lose more than half of their strike force simply because of being unable to carry out that efficient force transfer. But flight?

It's like you'd always have your feet planted on the ground. You could carry out perfect blows from the most awkward of positions—imagine throwing a front kick while being horizontal with all the force of if you'd been on solid ground. Imagine throwing punches upside down, or diagonally, or moving forwards. Imagine someone trying to throw you only for you to simply decide nah bro, you're fine where you are. Imagine fighting like you're out of the shittiest martial arts flick possible, the sort where the wire work doesn't even make sense and the guys are just flying around flailing their limbs and doing everything but sitting down for a quick cup of tea midair.

You could be that. You could be the shittiest Jackie Chan movie.

 

[Avernus]

A few thoughts on fighting with super strength.

The fact that the fighter's strength is so much higher compared to their (and their opponent's) mass is going to make a number of moves possible that wouldn't work for a normal person. I recall how in Cobra a method of Cobra cyborgs getting behind their opponent was to jump up, kick off the ceiling and come back down behind them. Or how in the Mistborn novels the man training the small female protagonist in super-strength combat described fighting her as like "attacking some weightless insect"; he was still stronger, but her strength was so high compared to her mass that she basically ignored inertia. I also recall how in the fanfic Assimilation an Amazon knocked on her back dodged an attack by grabbing the ground to her side and literally just yanking herself out of the way.

A related tactic I thought of is something I call "punch juggling". A sufficiently strong person fighting another brute type could kick or throw them into the air, and (possibly repeatedly) get under them as they fall to punch them back up again. They get to use their full strength braced against the ground, and their target is probably too disoriented to retaliate until they finally hit the ground and get on their feet again.

Grappling would also be important against high-durability opponents. That both lets you use your full strength and potentially lets you render someone helpless who is too tough to actually be disabled by punching.

Low level telekinesis could be used to guide projectiles to their target. Also potentially a reason for someone to prefer older projectile weapons over guns, if bullets are just too fast to "hold on to" with TK.

Damage resistance could be combined with various dangerous things to make the fighter harder to deal with. Somebody immune to poison could use poison themselves far more liberally than would be practical for a normal person; at the extreme literally coating themselves with something toxic so the enemy is scared to touch them. Somebody immune to fire could douse themselves in Greek Fire or napalm and try to grapple with the enemy. Or for a more modern version someone immune to radiation could wear highly radioactive accessories that would kill any non-resistant person who tries to get close to fight them.

A power whose combat usefulness is typically neglected in fiction would be low-light (or infrared, or whatever) vision, which is kind of funny since we have that in real life now so we know how much of a force multiplier it can be. It's not just the stealth advantage; trying to fight somebody who can see you just fine while you can barely see them or not at all is a losing proposition. Especially in pre-electric-lighting days, when "just light everything up" wasn't an option.

Very specific, rare, powers will not likely have generalized combat styles. And some powers have no potential style at all (like a girl with the power to change her hair color at will... if you can find a way to weaponize that, you're better than me- and, no, she can't select 'glows so bright it burns out the retina' as a color).

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IIRC there's a type of squid or octopus that in fights creates stripes on its body that shift in the opposite direction of its movement to make them harder to target properly. Long hair that did that would likely provide a small edge at least.