With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Bandits maybe, but given what Pratchett had to say about elves, I really don't think they'd be that respectful...

 

I'm assuming that if elves from Earth 16 were to read this then they'd be offended with Sir Pratchett's remark on their nature.

 

Mr Zoat

Wait, Angelika is still bumming around Earth-16? Doesn’t Paul have the technology to send her back home?

 

He can send her back, but she chose to stay after discovering her beliefs to be largely false so she wanted to stay and learn more so she doesn't relapse.

She's apparently been following Raquel around to learn from her.

 

Been wondering since Overgirl is now on this Earth and she mentioned that Overman has travelled to parallel universes will he ever end up on this Earth in search for her?

 

He may decide to do that, or he could let her go since she said she was going to send him a message on what she's doing.

Whether or not he chooses to listen to the message and leave her alone is anyone's guess though.

 

She's not sure if she wants to be a nazi (Angelika: National Socialist) anymore, so she's spending time on a world that isn't full of them to develop her understanding of people who would be considered degenerates and undesirables and come to terms with the fact that her mentor is one of those deviant lesbians and her adopted father, overman, apparently doesn't like the nazi (Angelika: National Socialist) way of doing things.

 

Why is Angelika with them? I thought she was more Justice League alligned? Didn't she get boosted to the League yet?

 

I mean, probably not given she’s from an alternate Earth ruled by Nazis so I think the JL is just letting Paul rehabilitate her.

 

Paul and Raquel are essentially acting as her therapists.

Plus the League may not want to admit her in their ranks until she's completely gotten rid of her Nazi mindset and learned a non Nazi one.

They haven't admitted Canis in their ranks despite the fact that he's most likely an adult, hell he could be centuries old, and has battle experience, because of his way of thinking.

She's admitted that her previous way of thinking is wrong, but she's still learning a new way of thinking.

She may not join the League even if she develops a new way of thinking, but go back to her home so she can hopefully change it for the better.

 

Yeah, I got her confused with Blaze. I read Angelika as Angelica. My bad.

 

Yeah that's probably going to happen with a lot of people.

Angelica Blaze is with them since they're trying to figure out who can go to Witch World, because they may be gone for months, so they need people who can afford being gone for months.

Blaze is with them because I don't think she has a life outside of superheroing now and as an Angel she may give them an easier time dealing with the highly religious residents in Witch World, especially after Paul's sojourn to Hell during his ressurection experiments. Those hunters that came for Klarion found out about it and may have told others in their home, so they could now see Paul as a heretic.

 

Apokoliptians are weird.
Like, brutal warrior races that don't care about carving up 'lowlies' are a dime a dozen, but their reaction to themselves being threatened or attacked is what makes them come across as truely alien.

There was the scene where Grayven picked up the midget one in the Shade base and slammed her into a wall several times until she suddenly became cooperative, and Canis's scenes with Barda that stand out the most.

Violence establishes the pecking order, which is true in many places of course, but on Apokolipse, it's not looked down on or resented (much)
Violence isn't something used by brutes to get their way, it's the standard method for establishing your rank.

It's like... a military structure where it's natural for you to be able to give orders to people you outrank, except your official rank in the hierarchy isn't set by the medals on your chest or the stripes and pips on your shoulder. Instead it's based entirely on chokeslams and uppercuts.

If you meet someone new and you're not sure where you stand on the totem pole, just mouth off.
If they outrank you, they'll let you know.

 

At least Apokaliptians don't complain much when someone stronger than them gives them orders and beats them up.

Probably not even in their heads.

Other species that like to oppress and hurt people for no good reason, like the Citadelians and and Psions, probably always complain when someone stronger than them beats them up and orders them around.

Especially if it's an alien, who they tend to think as being some fun toy to break, or something to cut up while they're still awake and made to feel the pain tenfold.

Well the Psions probably used to think like that and complain about it happening to them before they were wiped out.

The eleven Citadelians that work for Amalak now, along with the ones that escaped, assuming they haven't already been killed by Kori, Kom and the rest of Vega, probably still complain, if only in their heads.

 

That's exactly what I mean. That's the standard way of doing things, so why would they be upset about it?
If someone beats you up, it just means that they outrank you and you should be doing what they tell you to do.

 

Instead of giving your ID to show someone who you are and how you outrank them, you just break their hands and you're good.

 

If you thought I needed reminding of one of the few times that Zoat came up with something even sillier than the source material, you're quite mistaken.

Fish grafts to explain regional phenotype differences? So that an entire city of people said to themselves "Let's have the women gestate, give birth to, and nurse whale babies!" Because here's one of Kaldur's fellow Atlanteans, Blubber- . Uh huh.

If ancient Atlanteans had the ability to choose their transformation, than those with the resources, magical, political, or financial, would secure the best transformations for themselves and the rest would settle for what they can get, and then their descendants would have been stuck with their choices, so hello class system.

Instead, it's regional variations. So one look at a Whale Atlantean and another Atlantean can say oh you're from the city of whale people. Or your ancestors were anyway, the capital seems to be the cosmopolitan melting pot of Atlantis.

As it is, Kaldur explained vaguely what happened to Atlanteans in the tie-in comic "We transformed ourselves with a combination of technology and magic. We started off the same, but over the millenia the city states evolved differently." Which tells us that in the greater YJ canon (the comics were written by the YJ writers after all), all the Atlanteans were "pure," but they didn't stay that way.

 

What? Fish what?

In the fic it its stated LITERALLY that it was a transformation SPELL used by the surviving Atlanteans as their lands went under, NOT GRAFTING literal fish parts to themselves as it happened.

You are either confusing things with another fic, or confusing modern Atlantean magic techniques that they use to heal, grow body parts, with the ancient spells they used to transform into the different regional classifications that exist. They are TWO very different things that belong to different specialities of magic.

Edit: Also in young justice canon it is INDEED a caste system, all the wealthy and racist assholes are pure bloods that hate on the misshapen rest, that is the core of that entire plot point in the original show. In Zoat canon all the wealthy and powerful people had access to the original pure blood spell (they kept human form, but became stromger than humans by a significant margin), while the poor made do with other transformation spells or bootleg copies of the pureblood one, after the sinking the reality of purebloods = wealthy was just too easy to keep the caste system that already existed in Atlantis pre sinking.

 

The SI has used the term "fish-graft" before, though contextually he was using the term colloquially, not literally. I expect they're misremembering that.

Here's Sephtian also using the term in the same conversation:

 

The problem with that theory is that I think you're ignoring the whole sinking thing.

Atlantis was going to sink beneath the waves and the spell that transformed many of them into more fish like creatures could have done so because they didn't have the spell to make them into purebloods.

The reason they didn't have this spell could be because communication between the city states was very, very difficult due to the whole upcoming disaster.

They were either given a partial spell because communications broke down or because the ones that gave them the spell haven't figured it out themselves and were hoping that they could do it, but they only managed turning themselves into fish people while the ones that gave them the spell eventually figured the rest out but couldn't give it to them due to the whole communication issue.

Or they were given something to help them transform, but it became corrupted, so it made into into fish people, kinda like what the author of Assimilation explained happened in his story.

Those with resources probably did get the best transformation, but there's only so much money and favors can get you when the only thing they have to save themselves is a spell that makes them part fish.

So they settled on just getting the best whale or mermaid transformation instead of pureblood, because if they didn't transform they were going to die.

They didn't really have much choice in what they became.

As for that statement made by Kaldur, it could either mean they were the same before the sinking and the alterations changed that, or whilst the spell made them into something like purebloods at first, it wasn't exactly like the actual purebloods spell, and later generations became more and more fishlike due to a fault in the spell they used, because spending a few millenia in the ocean is not going to make one a shark man by way of evolution.

It has been stared several times that the transformations may be grafts.

It also isn't exactly that big of a stretch to assume that they grafted parts of fish to themselves in order to transform.

I think the only thing in Zoat canon that was mentioned was that the purebloods had the right ancestors.

This doesn't mean their ancestors were wealthy, but that they were in the right city and the right time when the grafts were given out.

We've seen that the rulers of other cities are fish grafts, so assuming their families ruled when the sinking happened that kinda makes the rich and powerful people got the pure graft thing invalid.

The Purebloods, both racists and non, in the show and comics came from Poseidonis, the capital, so it isn't exactly that surprising that they got the spell seeing as the capital was where it was probably developed.

I also don't think it was actually said to be a caste system, and if it was then it was a poor one as their leader is a half breed and other cities had non Pureblood rulers.

Maybe 'mean'

 

’how hesitant’

 

One of these days paragon-Paul needs to befriend a Martian mage/priest to at least act as a researcher and expert, if not as a superhero. I’m curious how their magic and its interactions with biotechnology are comparable to this. I suppose it depends on if there are any magical creatures on Mars.

Unfortunately the Martian mind is really hard to crack, given their hang-ups. Perhaps a red-skinned priest will like the idea of founding a church on Earth?

 

Isn't a large element of Paul's battle style w.r.t. exotic threats based on using various types of rounds stored in his subspace pocket? And iirc he carries most of his important possessions there too.

 

Nah, they’re just his signature. Specifically crumbler rounds, given their general versatility and power as well as effectiveness against Lanterns.

 

The issue is basically that Ahri'ahn was a massive Poseidonis-supremacist and saw an opportunity to render in flesh what he believed about the people's spirits. This is not widely known in modern Atlantis.

No, I think that's okay

Please note that above link is used for lexicographical purposes only and the content is not for discussion here.

 

'him. This' You're missing a . there.

White quote marks for Dr Balewa.

So he may know who he is is if he called him John?

They could have not told them that she was a former demon, assuming the ones that came to Earth didn't discover that.

That or just ask Zauriel to come.

'who could'

He wasn't nearly as insulted as you were, so it's expected he wouldn't be as mad as you are.

Hell he actually defended Nabus actions.

'get it in'

I knew n52 Ahri'ahn went insane, but I never figured your version was like that. Granted we haven't exactly discovered all that much about him.

And before you say that he wasn't insane, having the beliefs he had aren't exactly what a sane guy would have, as well as his actions not being that of a sane guy.

 

Thank you, corrected.

Giovanni used to go by 'John' for professional purposes.

Which would be fine if they were muggles, but they're magic users.

 

An unholy mixture of steampunk aesthetics, biochemical atrocities and sacrilegious mystical space-time wedgies? Something that should not be? Something out of 'Girl Genius'? That about sum it up?

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

If OL's at a loss for words, however momentarily, you know it's a mess.

And I am amazed he's not thinking of Hex, from the Discworld. It sounds like all it needs is a goat skull to complete the aesthetic.

Sounds... meaty.

Before I looked at the video, I immediately thought 'The Thirteen Ghosts of Scooby Doo'... the original cartoon, not the modern movie.

Surprised to see OL and Batman on the same page for once.

Which must be refreshing to him, at least. After thousands of years, there must be days when he thinks he's seen it all.

I'm just waiting for the faint 'ping' of something deep inside releasing tension... And everyone assuming something broke.

Calling in all the guns for this one, eh? His book learning should be helpful, at least...

"Aaaah..." Oh, I'm sorry. I thought we were just making thoughtful noises for fun.

Honestly, it might be worth waiting that long, if only to be sure it's safe. From the description, this thing sounds like it'll pop something when it actually spins up to speed.

Well, then... Why not try the 'suck it and see' approach? You're going to have to try sooner or later.

I do hope they at least cleaned the stains up in the months since.

Yeah, that's not bringing back bad memories or anything, nosirree.

...Yet another surprise for Doctor Mist. What a day.

Yay for the most hax magic available to the League being back in action.

I take it the system is controlled remotely somehow? OR the Sivanas set up a timer... They made it, right?

Okay, logical reasons all. I suspect anyone operating conventional tech would have performance issues, if only for the weather of Witchworld favouring gloomy and foggy most days...

No-one else from the team, eh? Looks like a milk run, for the most part. Good synergy with Stewart and Alan, too.

Joy of still working with human senses, OL.

Yeah, I would have taken the whole situation a lot less kindly... Unless the league sat down with Giovanni and explained that they were making plans to free him, but OL got there first. That would probably go a long way to, if not atoning for it, at least start making up for it.

Because of course the Witchworlders are watching them. Paranoia and caution go hand in hand.

Especially if it takes a day or more to set up and cast. Some things you just can't rush.

You do realise Batman almost certainly heard that too? Even if not directly, he's surely got the place bugged.

Alan's seen some shit, yeah. Be glad he didn't get sucked into that alternate 'Sliding Albion' from the Authority series. That was a messed up parallel universe.

Old-school aesthetics, man. Got to respect the theatrics of Science!

Cue stargate 'Whoomph' sound. Hopefully not the whole bubbly eruption of warped space...

And the group is getting underway. Now, OL is going along, isn't he? He'd want first-hand experience of the place, and he did say he was going to be getting books and such from the locals. Let's hope his subspace pocket works right. Otherwise there might be quite a mess at the portal when they pop, big ol' packrat that he is.

...solidly welded levers and cranks...

Feels off here. Perhaps 'really be tainted' works better?

Mr Zatara's eyes alight...

John Quinn turns a dial and pulls two levers...

 

Heh, there's seven of them.

MUAHAHAAHAAAHAHAHA.