General World of Darkness Discussion Thread QQ Edition

[Wwind]

Essentially Beast: The Primordial if they were Baali

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There is some semblance with Devouring.

Maybe one that wants to "liberate" vampires by turning them inside out and wrapping them around an avatar of their Beast.

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Sounds more like early edition Tzimisce. When Viscitude was alien infection.
in general yes - these are not Baali. that is why I do not consider 5th edition to be WoD at all. It is some sort of an adjacent new thing like CoD, but worse.

 

[Vague Wanderer]

I think it's more to do with the Chrysalides being a Seer Legacy, and the Exarchs being famously Monkey's Paw assholes about several issues.

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Yeah, on second thought that absolutely fits with the Seers.

The test could be stamina (with the difficulty increasing as they get extra freaky - if they fail they still get beats but also damage) or willpower (otherwise they get emotionally attached to their partner and swooned works only with them).
Another idea could be a camgirl that gooned herself into mind control power and technomancy - this also would work really well as a Chrysalides

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I think the main trick is figuring out how this makes sense in setting. Like, someone learning because they either did something really well (exceptional success) or fucked up really bad (dramatic failure) makes a fair amount of sense. Things just clicked, or you learned from your mistakes. Accomplishing an aspiration or the end of a session are obviously not as fitting, but they're kind of an RPG staple. So how does fucking around with conditions help someone learn?

The most obvious analogy is weight training. You do exercise with weights on, you get more out of the exercise, only here the "training weights" can just as easily apply to the mind as the body. That doesn't really link it directly to sex/ecstasy, but that's fine, because a Mage ending up doing that in pursuit of their obsessions is perfectly plausible.

So to sketch things out, a small town prostitute awakens. The exact nature isn't super important, though ideally it leaves her wary of the supernatural and inclined to keep her head down - an encounter with a Vampire or Werewolf perhaps. Regardless, she awakens a Thrysus, can suddenly see that everything is alive, but she ends up with something of an obsession for tantric magic. She's wasted too much time fucking strangers for money. There has to be something there that makes it all worthwhile, and she is going to find it. And she does! Talking with a spirit of a brothel or something, she figures out that some mindfuckery on herself can help her grow her powers and expand her mind.

Except there is a cost. Altering a sapient's nature long term is a medium Act of Hubris, and she burns through a fair amount of Wisdom doing this constantly, perhaps bottoming out at Wisdom 3 and finally realizing things have gone wrong, and gaining a new obsession for seeking wisdom. But at the same time, she's seen this technique does work. Her power's grown in leaps and bounds, and she doesn't really want to stop. She quite likes the idea of sex as a path to power, after all.

So she starts to build a Legacy. She's Gnosis 3 at this point, so she can, and the fun thing about Legacy attainments is that they're never an Act of hubris, just like they never cause paradox. Maybe there's some other benefits as well - if one wanted to make the Perfected Adepts really salty, say the attainment can create both Arcane and standard XP, because fucking ones way to five dots in stamina is kind of a funny. But regardless of the mechanical specifics, she figures out some sort of framework, and tries to fill it with a philosophy that...well, probably depends exactly on the exact nature of the Legacy. Mind/Life is probably more focused on perfecting oneself mind and body via all the ritualistic sex, while Prime/Life would be more some sort of "Sex is truth" thing, though admittedly, I'm not entirely sure how that would work.

Regardless of the specifics, she probably ends up starting a sex cult, which could go really well, or really badly, depending on who ends up finding her.

 

[shadowdice]

I am debating the mechanics of sapient plant vampires (melons, pumpkins, etc)

I'd likely stat it similarly to Gangrel (animalism or auspex plus fortitude) with a custom discipline similar to Protean or Viscerikta (the Gargoyle discipline)

I got my hands on Tattered Facade and...
Just what did you do to Baali? Just look at this.

Spoiler: V5 Baali

This isn't Baali! Why even call it Baali? Oh I know, because you want to fucking use it to sell your books! This is just non-descript fancy fomori vampire at best, taking the name of Baali.
Fucking hell, not even 2 pages! See for yourself!

Spoiler

...
The book is...bearable, I guess. It's like babies first intro into running VTM for the most part with fancy words.

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I really hate almost every retcon about blood Thaumaturgy happening

And they give a definitive answer to what the Baali are that is straightforward and lacks ambiguity while erasing EVERYTHING to do with old editions

No mention of Carthage, Moloch, or Shaitan in those pages

And of course they "covet" new name for thin bloods to make them sound cool
Redworking is just feels like they wanted an edgy name without the word blood

…We have gotten implications of Dhampirs since like the core book or anarch book but it is a decade later and we get Government Name Baali in two pages

Edit

We really are in an era where fanmade content is better than the official (Kindred of the east, dhampir fanmade book, and now the Baali ones that reused art. I know there are some fan Sabbat ones but don't know about their quality)

 

[Imperator Sol]

that is why I do not consider 5th edition to be WoD at all.

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I agree with you here. What they did to the Get of Fenris, personally my favourite Tribe, in WtA 5th edition is unforgivable. And yes, I'm aware of the negative connotations of the Tribe, but come on, Viking werewolves are cool as fuck.

At the same time, I actually like the name changes to some of the Tribes. Renaming the Wendigo to the Galestalkers and the Uktena to the Ghost Council makes it less... insensitive. (Which is a topic I'm not even properly educated to talk about, putting that down now.)

 

[Wwind]

I agree with you here. What they did to the Get of Fenris, personally my favourite Tribe, in WtA 5th edition is unforgivable. And yes, I'm aware of the negative connotations of the Tribe, but come on, Viking werewolves are cool as fuck.

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To begin with, for some weird reason they have decided to equate Norse with socialist nationalists in Germany of 20th century. Even if we take into account some Norse window dressings of the nazies, Fenris follow Fenrir, not Odin. It a bit like Norse satan. Pretty sure mustache man himself would consider garou demons in flesh.

Not to mention the whole notion is a bit weird with werewolves. The whole bit of them not being humans aside, since when is good old genocide something werewolves as a whole shy away from? They have done it multiple times, to their fellow garou, to fera, who knows to who else. Not to mention the whole Impergium debacle.

At the same time, I actually like the name changes to some of the Tribes. Renaming the Wendigo to the Galestalkers and the Uktena to the Ghost Council makes it less... insensitive. (Which is a topic I'm not even properly educated to talk about, putting that down now.)

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eh, the tribes are a weird lot. I prefer the ones that are more culture/creed based rather then weird sort of a ethnicity. Like Bone Gnawers and Glass walkers.
In Americas, I would have actually preferred to not have native Garou and have them come over with European colonists. Fera would have fit Native American mythos much better. In my opinion. Basically give Gurahl, Nuvisha and corax more space.

 

[Imperator Sol]

To begin with, for some weird reason they have decided to equate Norse with socialist nationalists in Germany of 20th century. Even if we take into account some Norse window dressings of the nazies, Fenris follow Fenrir, not Odin. It a bit like Norse satan. Pretty sure mustache man himself would consider garou demons in flesh.

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I don't even care about the politics surrounding it.

I just wanted to play as a cool as fuck Viking werewolf slaying and smashing Wyrmspawn in the name of Fenrir and Gaia. Is that too much to ask? Apparently it is.

 

[shadowdice]

Vampire demonologist that hunts and kills demons/infernalists wherever they find them

Werewolf that is a bit confused by all the weird not technically bane things that act a lot like banes

They meet each other while hunting a Pentex formori and actually have a moment where they both say they are hunting demons

Both feel incredibly awkward while a human hunter busts in looking for demons in the middle of that conversation

 

[Imperator Sol]

Both feel incredibly awkward while a human hunter busts in looking for demons in the middle of that conversation

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Don't forget the Mummy carrying two skateboards coming up to them and saying "How do you do fellow supernaturals?"

 

[SGB]

https://forum.questionablequesting.com/threads/letting-adhd-rule-my-life-snippets-story-ideas.19708/page-7#post-11582246

Quantumshadows wrote neat WOD snippet btw. Fella awakening powers, kills vamps, and a wild fianna werewolf tomboy gym buddy appears!

 

[Gereh]

I got my hands on Tattered Facade and...
Just what did you do to Baali? Just look at this.

Spoiler: V5 Baali

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You know at least when they released W5 game they openly stated that is was a Reboot/Remake. It always felt like V5 wasn't the same as the OG VTM but seeing this just makes it even more clear that V5 is indeed a VTM remake.

And it's only getting worse apparently, I always thought it can't get worse then what they did to the Lasombra, but, yes, they in fact can.

This seems to be fate of all clans that have magic they get lobotomized (stares in Tremere) and/or their unique forms of blood magic gets out right deleted (cries in Abyss Mysticism).

This isn't Baali! Why even call it Baali? Oh I know, because you want to fucking use it to sell your books! This is just non-descript fancy fomori vampire at best, taking the name of Baali.
Fucking hell, not even 2 pages! See for yourself!

Spoiler

...
The book is...bearable, I guess. It's like babies first intro into running VTM for the most part with fancy words.

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And here I thought that Baali would be a playable clan, stupid me should have know better.

So what exactly is it the book adds? The new powers and Loresheet you can probably look up at the wiki, so what is it that should make me buy that book (not that I actually had plans to do so)?

 

[Sol Mark-1]

5th edition was made for internet idiots who love tge idea of female Custodes in WH 40K, defend Ubisoft saying its a competent company, and love today D&D.

 

[Skitzyfrenic]

5th edition is very much a millennial product, yes.

This is a hard departure from the Gen X product of the past.

6th or 7th edition will be a Gen Z/Alpha product and it'll have brainrot memes.

 

[SGB]

agree with you here. What they did to the Get of Fenris, personally my favourite Tribe, in WtA 5th edition is unforgivable. And yes, I'm aware of the negative connotations of the Tribe, but come on, Viking werewolves are cool as fuck.

At the same time, I actually like the name changes to some of the Tribes. Renaming the Wendigo to the Galestalkers and the Uktena to the Ghost Council makes it less... insensitive. (Which is a topic I'm not even properly educated to talk about, putting that down now.)

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…aren't the Get basically just far right Neo Nazi political straw men now? Less redeemable than black spiral dancers apparently lmaoooo. Black furies accept men now, Silver fangs don't care about status, and red talons accept homids.
Fianna are now just generic hippies

Spoiler

I DO like the renamed Native American tribe names ngl. Naming one of them after horrible cannibalism demons was…a choice

6th or 7th edition will be a Gen Z/Alpha product and it'll have brainrot memes.

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>Caine agendaposting

 

[shadowdice]

…aren't the Get basically just far right Neo Nazi political straw men now? Less redeemable than black spiral dancers apparently lmaoooo. Black furies accept men now, Silver fangs don't care about status, and red talons accept homids.
Fianna are now just generic hippies

Spoiler

I DO like the renamed Native American tribe names ngl. Naming one of them after horrible cannibalism demons was…a choice

>Caine agendaposting

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All werewolves seem to be Homids now to avoid the fact that bestiality is a key part of werewolves

Only one of the cyoa books acknowledges the wolves

 

[Sol Mark-1]

5th edition is very much a millennial product, yes.

This is a hard departure from the Gen X product of the past.

6th or 7th edition will be a Gen Z/Alpha product and it'll have brainrot memes.

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I think more exactly it was made for the hypersensitive milennials who get offended by anything, and can't stand a lot of dark things.

Worst part is that the main developers of this edition is that they are Prima Donas who can't stand critcism, like a lot of AAA western videogame developers.

So its going to still be bad.

 

[SGB]

All werewolves seem to be Homids now to avoid the fact that bestiality is a key part of werewolves

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…ok…..tbf, that was an admittedly WEIRD AF part of the og games
"earth mommy demands you fuck actual animals"
Like….wtf…..

 

[junsa]

…ok…..tbf, that was an admittedly WEIRD AF part of the og games
"earth mommy demands you fuck actual animals"
Like….wtf…..

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Yup that was really weird. Like could of just said spirit wolves that are sepiant or anything else.

 

[Imperator Sol]

…aren't the Get basically just far right Neo Nazi political straw men now? Less redeemable than black spiral dancers apparently lmaoooo.

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There were members of the Get in the past that got into the ideology, yes. The Sword of Heimdall camp brings to mind. They were all slaughtered by the rest of the Get, and are considered traitors and a source of shame.

But apparently, the wasn't enough for the fuckwits rewriting the lore, and went all 'REEEEEE NAZEEEES!' and reduced the entire Tribe to fucking unplayable Neo Nazis, ignoring the rest of their lore and history.

All the while ignoring the Red Talons just sitting there, and playable. The Red Talons, the one Tribe whose identity revolves around hating humans. The Red Talons, the one Tribe in the modern setting that's arguably still outright genocidal. Fucking genius that.

…ok…..tbf, that was an admittedly WEIRD AF part of the og games
"earth mommy demands you fuck actual animals"
Like….wtf…..

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Yup that was really weird. Like could of just said spirit wolves that are sepiant or anything else.

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I've read somewhere that apparently in universe explanation for it is supposedly to remain balanced between wolf and man. Mating exclusively with only each other could turn the Garou inbred and insular, potentially disconnecting them from both sides of their nature and making them forget what they're fighting for.

But yes, still weird.

 

[Sol Mark-1]

I heard that W5 development was a complete disaster with everyone hating the main developer (who was the idiot who completely pushed The Get bullshit), most of the other developers hated the Get change.

White Wolf reddit is completely astroturfed, so the comments that show the real opinions about 5th are deleted.

 

[shadowdice]

I heard that W5 development was a complete disaster with everyone hating the main developer (who was the idiot who completely pushed The Get bullshit), most of the other developers hated the Get change.

White Wolf reddit is completely astroturfed, so the comments that show the real opinions about 5th are deleted.

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so like a lot of YouTube about white wolf

 

[SGB]

So basically, the new WOD games were made for tumblr users?

 

[shadowdice]

So basically, the new WOD games were made for tumblr users?

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The core book talks about how to play the game over stuff like TikTok so yes

 

[SGB]

The core book talks about how to play the game over stuff like TikTok so yes

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B R U H

 

[Ragura]

Brainrot would make for a good BSD totem
Some bonus to Computers and Expression (Visual Arts) <-- or would that be Crafting?
The ban (not that they consider it a drawback) is that they need to consume the brainrot, turning any failed mental attribute roll into an automatic botch.

 

[Skitzyfrenic]

So basically, the new WOD games were made for tumblr users?

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Yeah. By and for. When I say it was a millennial product I mean it. From start to finish WoD 5th edition has been riddled with the kind of poorly done social justice activism that gets people called SJW as a pejorative.

While the mechanical changes are eeeeeeeh (I like some bits, I don't like others) the lore changes have been pretty...

For every good change (and there are a few) there are probably a dozen not good changes that run the gamut of meh to actual flaming garbage.

I really think Rudi, the 'Bear Gangrel,' who is in the corebook of V5 is a pretty decent show of the kind of not good stuff sprinkled about.

Rudi basically breaks the Masquerade by continuing to go to the same night clubs, and hang with the same friends as he did before the embrace.

Rudi somehow spits in the faces of European Cam Elders and has had nothing blow back on him. Oh, and of course, these elders are misogynistic. And racists. And classist. And homophobic. And transphobic. And forms of bigotry my mind cannot even contain.

And he's so charismatic, as a gangrel, that he has a Rudista ideology and an 'army' of followers behind him. An army that also contains mortals. And is of 'all clans, all colors, all creeds.' This army constantly organizes protests and rallies. Oh, and they're 'willing to actually fight.'

Rudi is explicitly called out as a fresh embrace. So... like he's been kindred for what? A year? Two? Less than twenty-five for sure.

Tell me the Devs actually read about Ennoia, Helen, Arkiel, the Valkyrie, the Tzmisce, the Lioness of Jerusalem, the Dream, actually looked at the Clan Exemplars like Lucita and Fatima and Victoria Ash, and the Tremere, and make sure to do so with a straight face.