Dungeon Crawler Quest(Original Fantasy)

[mrttao]

Ogre's Den:
- Minor Ogre - Club, Power Attack
- Normal Ogre - Club, Power Attack
- Chucker - Ranged Explosives
- Shaman - Heal, I think a damage spell?
- Ogre Magi - Arc Lightning, Lightning Cloak
- Bawws - Heal, Club, Power Attack, maybe a buff?

So far on our various visits to the Den, none has showed the ability to stop people from activating an Orb, except from overclubbing.

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1. that assume we have seen all their abilities (in particular the ogre magi).
2. You have some uncertainties there
3. Lets take the ogre magi for example

You scream out a warning as a bolt of lightning flashes out, striking Anshelm and knocking him sprawling… and then arcing to you.

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His Arc Lightening has the ability to knock someone sprawling. Can you use an orb while sprawled? do you need to first spend a turn standing up? does it provoke an AoE? Does being sprawled provide a bonus to enemy damage?
Also, people keep forgetting we are a goddamn squishy mage and many enemies have gotten us below half HP with a single hit. Soloing is insane

 

[Arkeus]

Now please explain how does this make the golem HOLD AGGRO when we are a huge aggro magnet that even a dedicated tank can't keep enemies off of us.

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We were a huge aggro magnet because we had 'a robe that increased aggro', 'a staff that increased aggro', and we did some potent damage. We now have a robe that doesn't increase agro, a staff that doesn't increase aggro, and a veil that decrease aggro, and a passive skill that decrease aggro.

It..Might not hold aggro. We'll see. If that happens and it gets hard, we'll orb out. Learning experience. It does look like jobs like Necromancers are 'especially good' for chaffs/solo-ing, though.

It is a summon that "guards you and attacks your foes".

I am assuming that to be effective in its role, and the probability that its stat is actually based on Alice's, that it's Threat rating might be the caster's Threat rating + X, or something similar.

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This too. I assume at higher rank it has it's own challenge ability too, but not yet.

 

[mrttao]

It is a summon that "guards you and attacks your foes".

I am assuming that to be effective in its role, and the probability that its stat is actually based on Alice's, that it's Threat rating might be the caster's Threat rating + X, or something similar.

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Dangerous assumptions.
You are assuming that it can hold aggro for an entire group of enemies instead of a single target.
You are assuming "guards you" means "prevents you from taking damage" instead of "tries to kills anyone who attacks you".
You are assuming it is superior at holding aggro to a player class that specializes in holding aggro (remember that we have +aggro equip and even our party dedicated tank can't keep enemies off of us entirely).
I am sure it would be way better at holding aggro if we swapped out the +aggro gear for some -aggro gear

 

[Grosstoad]

1. that assume we have seen all their abilities (in particular the ogre magi).
2. You have some uncertainties there
3. Lets take the ogre magi for example

His Arc Lightening has the ability to knock someone sprawling. Can you use an orb while sprawled? do you need to first spend a turn standing up? does it provoke an AoE? Does being sprawled provide a bonus to enemy damage?
Also, people keep forgetting we are a goddamn squishy mage and many enemies have gotten us below half HP with a single hit. Soloing is insane

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Correct, I am doing it all from memory and not checking it over line by line.

Please take a look at this update for solo experiences.
http://forum.questionablequesting.c...uest-original-fantasy.822/page-35#post-196068

 

[Grosstoad]

Dangerous assumptions.
You are assuming that it can hold aggro for an entire group of enemies instead of a single target.
You are assuming "guards you" means "prevents you from taking damage" instead of "tries to kills anyone who attacks you".
You are assuming it is superior at holding aggro to a player class that specializes in holding aggro (remember that we have +aggro equip and even our party dedicated tank can't keep enemies off of us entirely).
I am sure it would be way better at holding aggro if we swapped out the +aggro gear for some -aggro gear

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And you are assuming that the golem does not keep aggro.
+shrugs+

 

[mrttao]

And you are assuming that the golem does not keep aggro.
+shrugs+

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A perfectly logical assumption considering all the arguments I made, in particular how Ansem can't hold aggro off of us, why would one of our class feature be superior to an entire class?
Furthermore, what I am actually saying here is not that I am 100% certain that it doesn't do said thing, but that I am not willing to bet our life on it when resurrection is not a thing in this setting.
If ANYTHING goes wrong we are PERMA DEAD and quest is over.
Making a fuckton of assumptions that everything will go your way when gambling with your life? not wise

Correct, I am doing it all from memory and not checking it over line by line.

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That was my whole point. Are you sure that you aren't forgetting some ability or another that our enemies have that can result in a game over from going solo?

 

[Grosstoad]

No, I am saying that I am not willing to bet our life on it when resurrection is not a thing in this setting.
If ANYTHING goes wrong we are PERMA DEAD and quest is over.
Making a fuckton of assumptions that everything will go your way when gambling with your life? not wise

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Yes?

The cap is at level 6, a two person D-rank Dungeon. We did the E-rank, a level 5 two-person Dungeon, at... +checks+ Level 4. Alice is now level 5, with improved Skills and more spells.

Everyone still have the Blessing of Savior, which allows a killing blow to leave us at 1 HP. Everyone still have their Orbs.

+shrugs+

Personally, I think it is still risky, but the others want to solo, and I am just stating what reasonable precautions are currently available.

 

[mrttao]

Everyone still have the Blessing of Savior, which allows a killing blow to leave us at 1 HP.

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That thing is practically useless when soloing. Because it does not come with a temp invulnerability for a duration.
If an enemy crits on you and knocks you down to 1HP and burns the blessing, then you must dodge every single remaining attack while scrambling for an orb/potion or you die. And when you are soloing that every remaining attack is a lot of them
Very useful if you stand in the back and get hit by the occasional surprise attack though

Also, how real time is this? because the fact that water prison lasts 4 "ticks" suggest there is some sort of round system.

 

[drake_azathoth]

[X]Shopping
-[X] Tell Maya/Anshelm about the info we got, see if Sera wants to grab Earth Elementalist now. She has a slot free, and it's apparently super good for Defense/CC.
-[X] Everyone should put their "specific dungeon" gear in the vault, and see if we can all pinch in to buy a ton of Amritas to put in the vault, for between-dungeons things.

[X] Check the mission board, It will be good to know if the incoming danger has been reflected in the missions given.

[X] Head to Ogre's Den D-rank
-[X]Don't change blessing, as we are currently still doing dungeons we have never done before/etc.
-[X]Cast out Frost Guardian, like yesterday, upon leaving town.
-[X] Solo it.
-[X] Shimah with Sera.

 

[mrttao]

-[X] Solo it if you think its within your grasp.

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I am pretty sure we the players are supposed to make such decisions rather than using such a modifier to let the QM decide

 

[Arkeus]

I am pretty sure we the players are supposed to make such decisions rather than using such a modifier to let the QM decide

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Maya/Shimah Duo-d Ogre Den D-rank two days ago, so they are the ones best equipped to tell us if we are over-reaching or not.

I am tempted to have a 'Go to Crystal Lake if they think we are over-reaching' though.

 

[drake_azathoth]

I am pretty sure we the players are supposed to make such decisions rather than using such a modifier to let the QM decide

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Fixed.

 

[redaeth]

It's been tanking for the last several dungeons. So yeah, it has aggro draw.

 

[GiftofLove]

yrsillar does the golem have aggro draw? It is our pet. We should know right?

 

[mrttao]

Maya/Shimah Duo-d Ogre Den D-rank two days ago, so they are the ones best equipped to tell us if we are over-reaching or not.

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Maya and Shimah are NPCs, asking them is different than "do X if main character believes Y". Deciding what MC believes is up to us

It's been tanking for the last several dungeons. So yeah, it has aggro draw.

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Everything draws aggro in combat, the question is if it has aggro drawing skills like the active and passive aggro draw we have seen in quest. That would prevent an enemy from disengaging and go after MC in the case we go solo

 

[redaeth]

We've been in a party long enough to automatically ask our party members opinions on dangerous actions. Especially since they will be coming with us.

 

[mrttao]

We've been in a party long enough to automatically ask our party members opinions on dangerous actions. Especially since they will be coming with us.

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And? what does this have to do with anything anyone has said so far?

 

[Grosstoad]

They're saying that since the NPCs live the world first-hand, instead of the voters that control Alice, who only experience it second-hand, they will be more precise in their judgment and will be willing to offer their suggestions or rebuttals to what the voters/Alice plan for, if given the choice to do so in the plan.

EDIT: Which is basically asking the QM, in character.

 

[Arkeus]

They're saying that since the NPCs live the world first-hand, instead of the voters that control Alice, who only experience it second-hand, they will be more precise in their judgment and will be willing to offer their suggestions or rebuttals to what the voters/Alice plan for, if given the choice to do so in the plan.

EDIT: Which is basically asking the QM, in character.

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No, actually. We are saying that we only did Ogre Den D-rank with 4/5 people, while they did it with 2-people two days ago. They will be able to tell us exactly the issues they had with 2 people, given we were not present.

 

[Guile]

Can we do some missions? I'm kinda bored of doing the same dungeons over and over.

 

[yrsillar]

The golem generates more than the base amount of agro per attack. It doesn't have any special abilities beyond punch/stomp/smash at the moment though.

 

[Darkened]

It is a summon that "guards you and attacks your foes".

I am assuming that to be effective in its role, and the probability that its stat is actually based on Alice's, that it's Threat rating might be the caster's Threat rating + X, or something similar.

Click to shrink...

It's been said that it doesn't get our auras and gear bonuses won't apply. Ergo even the same threat would have it attracting a good deal more attention.


On the other hand, arc lightning worries me if Ogre Magi spawns. It's POSSIBLE we may be able to dodge that effect via distance. IE: If we're too far away from our golem it might not be able to bounce to us.

Or we might just want to orb out if he does. OTOH we could try for a lucky freeze and orb out if it doesn't proc or some variation thereof.

Also do we need more pots to solo? Well, 2 high potions and 3 normals is probably enough as long as our golem stays up and we have dark magic too for extra healing.

 

[Garahs]

[X]Shopping
-[X] Tell Maya/Anshelm about the info we got, see if Sera wants to grab Earth Elementalist now. She has a slot free, and it's apparently super good for Defense/CC.
-[X] Purchase Stalwart Cleric for Alice.
-[X] Everyone should put their "specific dungeon" gear in the vault, and see if we can all pinch in to buy a ton of Amritas to put in the vault, for between-dungeons things.


[X] Check the mission board, It will be good to know if the incoming danger has been reflected in the missions given.
[X] Head to Ogre's Den D-rank
-[X]Don't change blessing, as we are currently still doing dungeons we have never done before/etc.
-[X]Cast out Frost Guardian, like yesterday, upon leaving town.
-[X] Solo it if you think its within your grasp.
--[X] Try kiting melee mobs if necessary with frost aura.
-[X] Shimah with Sera.

Hoping we could combine ice and stalwart and get a job that has targetable frost armor buffs similar to sorceress from diablo 2. At the very least, learn what buffs stalwart cleric can use.

 

[a2znut]

[X] Shopping
-[X] Buy a swimsuit for sleeping already.

 

[Grosstoad]

+ponders+
I want to get Stalwart, but then again Clerics get three Active Skills from the start, Healing, Buff/Debuff, and Talisman. That is going to mess with Alice's current loadout.

We can take off Talisman, since that basically only grants better casting with Healing and Buff/Debuff, while I was only planning to be a secondary Healer.

Mmm, should have given that Dark or Fire to either Maya or Shimah...

Getting Stalwart to Shimah might be interesting, but she has been talking about getting personal damage up, though she already have some from the Shaman's curses.

Maya taking Stalwart... Plausible?
She has Twin Knives, Bows, Stealth, and Taming.
If she drops Twin Knives and Stealth, she can be an off-Healer and Buffer, which also helps her Pet.

 

[Garahs]

I'm thinking we just pick it up for now. When we get water to C rank, we fuse ice and water, then equip buff. When Dark gets to C, swap it out for Healing. These choices are difficult. I kinda wish we had 6 party slots to play around with, especially for breaking into smaller groups evenly.

 

[Grosstoad]

Oh... Anshelm is currently only using three slots of out his four Active Skill slots: Spear, Axe, and Shield Skills.

Later, when he finally gets a Greatshield, he will swap out the Shield Skill for the Greatshield Skill. And once he Fused or got a Halberd Knight, he might also get Halberd Skill, which might allow him to use both Spear and Axe abilities.

So he actually has some Active slots open, in the not so far distance.

If he picks up Stalwart Cleric and equips Buff, even if he only self-buffs for attack because of his low SP pool, it would be a pretty good upgrade. Then, when the slots open, he can pick up Healing to do some self-healing as well.

 

[Darkened]

Anshelm tends to have SP issues with his current skillset whenever things get nasty. Something passiveish might work better for his slot.

Alternatively he could grab some kind of ranged attack option like throwing axes or the like so he can pull enemies more effectively.

+ponders+
I want to get Stalwart, but then again Clerics get three Active Skills from the start, Healing, Buff/Debuff, and Talisman. That is going to mess with Alice's current loadout.

We can take off Talisman, since that basically only grants better casting with Healing and Buff/Debuff, while I was only planning to be a secondary Healer.

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At four active skills, we'd need healing and buff to benefit from stalwart over hexer. We'd also need to level that job up, despite the fact that the only cleric that's been mentioned fusing to our class (and the only confirmed path to blue) is hexer.

Now, we want ice magic at nearly all times right now (It's our best skill, we don't want to drop our effectiveness). By the time we level dark to C

(remainder of the 30+80=110JP) we'll have Ice Elementalist at B. Ergo we'll probably want to continue raising it or water at least.

We will, however, be ready to swap our job out. So let's say we swap in healing then. Now, by the time we get healing to C (120JP) our cleric class would be at C rank and we'd fuse it away for something new, giving us that job's active skills.

The only way we'll really have time for buffing in the next 2-300JP is if our first green job has something like "You can use all ice magic with this skill"

I can't really imagine backing stalwart over hexer in this case. Sure experimentation is a thing, but stalwart's a starter job. If there was a big fusion with any basic elementalist we'd probably have heard about it. In short, I don't see it having a future, and we wouldn't use it enough to be particularly good there.

Mmm, should have given that Dark or Fire to either Maya or Shimah...

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Ninja's readily available in the store. It's easy to get. Likewise Shimah wasn't mentioned as having interest in the fire one. And it definitely helped where we have it and will do so again. Dark, by contrast, fuses with ice, so this is a pretty solid pick for us.

Getting Stalwart to Shimah might be interesting, but she has been talking about getting personal damage up, though she already have some from the Shaman's curses.

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She's leveling shaman and hexer and has fusion plans on both. I don't really see the huge appeal given that her time is already taxed.

Maya taking Stalwart... Plausible?
She has Twin Knives, Bows, Stealth, and Taming.
If she drops Twin Knives and Stealth, she can be an off-Healer and Buffer, which also helps her Pet.

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...

Our assassin class should drop stealth? Really?

She's a high agility/charisma build. She hasn't had power or con problems. Her will and power have to be junk given the number of stats she has that definitely aren't.

In short, she might work with something like wind that's not very power dependent, but probably won't ever be a viable healer or caster of any kind.

 

[Grosstoad]

Currently, our Healer is kind of pressed, not unlike our Tank, thus my inquiry for it. Not to mention to cover the gap of Buffing role in our party.

Sadly, we haven't seen likely classes that grants needed Passives for Anshelm, and even Elementalist aura abilities tends to be spells, which also cost SP. Unclear whether the Ice+Warrior Fusions grant Aura passives or just having Chill Aura spell.

On Maya, it is the same with the other spare Skills that we have. Sooner or later, she would have to unequip one or two Skills, depending on circumstances, and let them stagnant. Hunter-based Jobs unfortunately seem to be chock full of various different unrelated Skills, as the Hunters branch out to different niches and themes.

Though, if, for instance, we could Fuse Stealth and Dark Magic, that might cut down the slots used.

Shimah on the other hand, has had her hands full. If we had gotten her the Stalwart before she got Shaman... But then again, she still has her hands full with just Healing and Debuff. Unsure how she is going to get a spare time to level Fire.

Sera is... As busy as Alice.

 

[Arkeus]

yrsillar, does fusing jobs always level them a rank(white, green,blue,purple,gold), or is it possible to fuse A Blue Job with a White one to get another Blue Job that's slightly rare/different? Or is this a 'Try and Find Out' thing?