Star Wars! Spoilers Allowed So Beware!

The force. I mean, technically its the least offensive thing with the force done in the movie, of all the things that might be considered out there. It's something that has honestly happened before in the EU.

Admittedly, by people way better trained then Leia has been in the new Trilogy, so there is that.

 

Take it up with Lucas for writing the Old Republic that way.

 

I just found some fanart that is simply amazing.

Spoiler: Spoilers

Truly, a masterpiece.

 

Finally saw the movie. My standards were lowered more than enough that I came out actually enjoying it. I didn't love it of course, and there was more than one thing that bugged me, but I also didn't hate it. It was a good popcorn flick, just as I expected it to be.

Pretty nonsensical of course, but that just seems to be how the new Star Wars universe rolls. Utter nonsense. Basically Star Wars fanfiction made by Star Wars fans, so far ranging from decent (Rogue One) to mediocre/terrible in these two new main movies.

Here's hoping for something worth while from the Han Solo movie.

 

I love how me being tied up gets included right inbetween that two coin sides of starwars fandom...

 

https://kestifer.blogspot.be/2017/12/the-last-jedi-is-big-pile-of-badly.html

I was very close to reviewing The Last Jedi with a two word review and being done with it.

However, since there are people I know and love who enjoy this pile of badly written garbage, I feel a need to get into it a little bit more.

So here is a list of problems the movie has at the storytelling level. None of it has anything to do with “HURR DURR THERE'S WIMMEN AND MINORITREES IN IT AND DAT'S BAD BECAUSE I'M A WHITE MALE IN CURRENT YEAR.”

No. Star Wars was always diverse. Nobody cares that there are Space Asians and Space Hispanics and Space Blacks alongside Space Whites. You see anybody shit talking Lando? Hell no. That man gets respect wherever he goes.

For formality's sake, the entire list that follows is one big spoiler. That's your warning.

So here is a list of script problems with The Last Jedi

• Super Leia. Everything about that entire scene begs the question: WHY?
• Why was Admiral Ackbar, a cult favorite thanks to his meme, even in this if you're going to give him one line and unceremoniously blast him into space? I know his voice actor died, that's not a valid excuse.
• Why are there no familiar aliens besides a wookiee, a sullustan, and a mon calamari? Where are the Rodians? The Twi'leks? Why come up with all new background aliens when existing ones are completely absent?
• Why come up with new background aliens when none of them have any bearing on the plot whatsoever?
• Why even bother with having Nien Nunb around? And why does the mask/puppet look cheap and awful?
• Where are the alien characters? Every major speaking character is a human. In Star Wars. Snoke comes closest, but he's just a fugly looking near-human.
• Why is the main black guy an incompetent coward? Loveable coward is something doable, and Caiaphas Cain in 40k pulls it off well, but here he's just a cowardly idiot pratfalling his way across the screen. Boyega has charisma that makes him watchable, but the subtext is borderline offensive, especially compared to badass black Star Wars characters like Mace Windu and the smoothest man in the galaxy, Lando Calrissian. The implications here are...“problematic,” as the Millenials like to say.
• Canto Bight. All of it. Arms dealers are bad, but they also provide arms to the good guys, so...?
• Finn is told he has to feel bad about how alien horses are being abused when he spent his entire life growing up as a child soldier with a serial number instead of a name? Rose, you don't know shit about having a hard life compared to that.
• Why is Finn so well-adjusted for being an escaped slave soldier?
• Why is Poe the only character who feels like he belongs in a Star Wars movie? Why does the movie spend its running time shitting on him for this?
• Why isn't Benicio Del Toro's character a cool alien design? It would probably be cheaper than hiring Del Toro.
• Why even bother with Snoke when you're going to kill him just as he's starting to get interesting?
• Why start your movie with a yo mama joke that completely undercuts any kind of menace or competence Hux might otherwise have? Even the most incompetent Imperial of the OT, Admiral Ozzel, wasn't reduced to a joke like that.
• Why didn't the First Order deploy starfighters immediately after entering the system at the beginning? That's standard procedure, and the captain of the “Fleet Killer” dreadnaught POINTS IT OUT.
• The Dreadnaught is remarkably undergunned for self-defense so that plot can happen.
• The Resistance Bombers are the most useless ships in the entire series, especially considering how bombs have worked throughout. But no, we need to have B-17's IN SPAAAAAACE.
• Paige's sacrifice at the beginning is elaborate and reasonably well done, but she's a character we have never met before and have no reason to care for her sacrifice aside from general pathos for the situation. Somebody we've never met before dies in battle and we're supposed to care....why?
• A-Wings. Why even have them if they do nothing?
• A-Wing squadron leader, the woman with the scarf, was criminally wasted. She had flashes of personality and flair and could have provided someone for Poe to bounce off/clash with on the chain of command in the subsequent power vacuum. And I'm not just bitter because she was prime waifu material.
• Why is there gritty realism about the horrors of war in a movie about space wizards with laser swords? That's not going to move toys off the shelves, you know. Priorities, people!
• “We can track them through hyperspace” is not a new idea. That's how they found the base on Yavin in the FIRST MOVIE FROM THE 70s!
• Why not use an Interdictor to prevent the Resistance Fleet from jumping to hyperspace to necessitate the chase instead? And Finn & Rose's mission would be to find a way to shutting down the gravity well projectors so they can get away? Minor tweaks could have salvaged that premise and make both factions look competent.
• Why don't the stable kids speak Galactic Basic?
• Why didn't Admiral Tumblr Hair tell Poe that she has a plan? He repeatedly asked for orders and was stonewalled by Admiral Tumblr Hair, who was proving to be an ineffective leader in a moment of crisis. Poe's mutiny was fully justified given the circumstances and the failure of Tumblr Hair to lead effectively. This is evidenced by the large number of crew who mutiny with him.
• Autopilot exists in the setting. Why does someone have to go down with the ship when everyone else abandons it? Other than to feel sad for the poor sap stuck at the helm?
• Why are your escape shuttles unarmed and unshielded? Especially since the Resistance was supposedly bankrolled by people in the New Republic on the down low? You deserve to get blown out of the sky.
• Why is the New Republic gone? They're the major faction in the galaxy and would have administrators, senators, functionaries and so on all across the galaxy. How incompetent can the New Republic be?
• Why does Yoda do any of the things he does in this movie? He acts like he did when he was trying to bamboozle Luke when he first showed up on Dagobah instead of the actual Master Yoda once he revealed himself? Why is he an asshole now?
• Why are Force Ghosts able to affect the mortal world now?
• Why does the Yoda puppet look so bad?
• Why does Luke abandon the galaxy at large because he considered killing his flesh and blood when he defied the two most powerful Dark Siders in the galaxy and ultimately refuse to kill either of them because he believed in the goodness of his own flesh and blood. Even sticking with the movies, none of Luke's backstory in this makes any sense.
• Why show Luke's submerged X-Wing when you don't use it? This is Chekhov's Blue Balls.
• When does the Star Wars movie start?
• Why is Rey able to fence with a lightsaber after an afternoon where she spins around some rocks.
• Why doesn't she ever apologize to the lizard nuns for making a mess of the place and nearly killing several of them?
• Why is Rey's backstory a big nothing after all that buildup in the last movie? Don't tell me to read the books, important information should be
• Why didn't Luke have the balls to show up on Crait to face his nephew when the net result was the same? Its FAMILY, Luke. Your SISTER is in danger you sellout.
• Why do you just die at the end Luke? Is it because of sadness, like how your mother died in Revenge of the Sith?
• Why are Snoke's bodyguards so useless and incompetent?
• Why is their armor so cheap looking?
• Where are the Knights of Ren that were talked up so much last time?
• How does Poe know Maz? he's never met her before as far as we know.
• Why is Maz even in this?
• Why is the middle of this a poorly done remake of that one Nu Battlestar Galactica Episode everybody likes?
• Why didn't Vice Admiral Tumblr Hair tell Poe her plan?
• Why wasn't Ackbar or Leia the one to hyperspace ram the Super Super Star Destroyer? It would have more emotional impact than Admiral Tumblr Hair.
• Why is Phasma anything? She accomplishes less than Boba Fett did in the movies.
• Why are there flashback sequences in Star Wars now?
• Who gives a shit if Not-Hoth is made of salt instead of snow? We know its not-Hoth. We can tell from the speeders and walkers. You don't have to pretend to be clever. We just want this three hour movie to end.
• Why does Han have a beloved set of dice hanging in the Falcon when we've never ever had them before over the course of FORTY YEARS? Besides “brand synergy” with the upcoming Han Solo movie, of course.
• Why do the dice on Crait fade away AFTER Luke dies and fades away himself?
• Why is Rian Johnson getting a trilogy all to himself?
• Why does Vice Admiral Tumblr Hair have cotton candy hair?
• Why does Vice Admiral Tumblr Hair not wear a military uniform during a military operation?
• Why do we have giant alien sloth titties in Star Wars? Why does Luke go Al Franken on them?
• Why does Rey only manage one expression: Dull Surprise?
• Why is Poe repeatedly knocked down, berated and emasculated by his military superiors for repeatedly making the right call? Is that any way to treat a Hispanic heroic role model? Why is the lesson here to blindly follow authority in a rebel movement?
• Why didn't Vice Admiral Tumblr Hair tell Poe her plan?

So that's it. I'm done with this damn movie. I'm glad it seems to be struggling at the box office. Its not good, its not worth the false hype, and its not worth your money. Avoid it if you love Star Wars, because it shits all over the franchise and demands that you say "thank you."

If you feel like listening to me and a couple others in the Pulp Rev scene go off on the movie, you can find it below.

 

I think you accidentally cut this one off mid sentence.

 

That's too comprehensive a list for me to reply to everything so I'll just pick out a few points I have immediate answers to.

Well first of all I think it's really cool that they didn't just forget that Leia is also of the Skywalker bloodline, and having her use the Force at some point was one thing I was explicitly hoping for going into this movie.

I actually really liked this whole scene, because Leia dying early on was something I had been predicting since before the movie even came out. That scene where Kylo hesitates to pull the trigger in the first trailer made me immediately think "Snoke is going to take the decision out of his hands" and then the TIE fighter pilots basically proved me right. For her to then come back afterwards was pure fucking magic in how it ripped those expectations to shreds and gave me exactly what I was hoping for in one fell swoop. Definitely one of the emotional high points of the whole movie.

As for why? Allegedly Leia was planned to take over Luke's spot as the master of the new Jedi Order in the third movie, so establishing her as a Force-user early on would be important for that.

The Canto Bight sequence is definitely one of the less well-executed plot threads in the movie, but it doesn't actually come to nothing; it's about convincing Finn to pitch in with the Alliance. The previous movie forced him to man up and fight evil for Rey's sake, and when he first tries to run away it's not fear for himself but fear for Rey coming back for him and being caught by the First Order that motivates him. This movie's arc for him is about Finn becoming, in his own words, "Rebel scum". The bit about the arms dealers is, I think, supposed to make him question the whole good vs evil thing that Star Wars has going on and make him question his loyalties one more time before he makes up his mind. That way he has more of a character arc instead of a straight line.

That's the thing though: It's not important information. Rey isn't someone who has a great destiny or is secretly Obi-Wan's daughter or whatever, she's just an example of the Force manifesting strongly in random people, the same way it does in that stable kid in the ending. And that's great, it would make the galaxy a much smaller place if everyone important is somehow related to each other. This also makes her a great foil for Kylo, who has all of the Skywalker pedigree and yet also feels disconnected from his parents and his mentor and makes totally different decisions from her because of those feelings.

It's not about having the balls or not. Luke knows from his own history with Vader that evil cannot be defeated by swinging a laser sword at it, and the one time he came close to trying to do so he wound up turning Ben to the dark side. So he projects himself, knowing that he's the best possible distraction for Ren's forces, and buys everyone time to escape, and also denies Kylo Ren the chance to actually kill him.

I think they suspected there was a mole on board. You know, because Snoke tracked them through hyperspace and all? It wound up being a piece of advanced tech that was responsible, but nobody told her that.

 

The author did, actually, I'm just copy pasting.

 

Why did you bother giving someone else's opinion on the movie when the people here can't debate with them as they are not here and you don't necessary share the same opinion? Thus might not fight to defend it?

 

Except in the same scene Johnson also had Snoke reveal that Rey from Nowhere is the other most specialist Force user in the entire galaxy as the natural counterpart to Kylo Ren and it doesn't matter if she actually learns anything as her Light Side power level will literally be rubberbanded up to Kylo's Dark Side power level because Johnson thinks the Force is a balancing patch.

 

Counterpoint:

It would work better if it made sense.

Which is where a lot of the movie falls apart.

edit- it's also pretty pointless because now they'll just have to say she died off screen or minimize her presence so much that she might as well have died off screen.

 

Because I wanted to move the discussion out of SSoSB and I haven't watched TLJ. So I went and searched for some rando with a critique.

 

I would have just quoted the people who were on the starwars kick here so they can move on with the discussion myself.

 

Meh, I'm on phone. Seemed faster.

 

As someone who has seen The Last Jedi, I feel like much of the films issues stem from Rian prioritizing subverting audience expectations over making in universe (and therefore out of universe) sense.

 

The Empire tracked the Falcon because they placed a tracking beacon on it. The First Order tracked a ship they had no physical access to through, apparently, magical hyperspace radar.

Anyways, I really liked TLJ on the whole. Some things like the Canto Biggt sequence could certainly have done better but I walked out of the theater satisfied with my experience.

 

Which makes sense. But why doesn't she tell him that? Or even just reassurance she has a plan, not just evasiveness...

 

Because Poe might be the mole for all she knows?

I mean keep in mind, this lady was apparently known to be bad at dealing with people despite being some kind of tactical genius, Leia says as much to Poe when the escape pods are launching if memory serves. That's why she wasn't in command in the first place, she didn't take over until the entire command staff was either dead or in a coma.

 

Wut? I thought they are just recruiting normally using propaganda to make themselves look good. Did I miss a mention of the FO kidnapping kids in one of the movies?

 

Err, yes?

It was in the earliest part of the movie, right after Finn broke out with Poe.

 

I love the idea about a spy, it makes perfect sense. But like we can't write the movie for them. There is nothing in the film to back it up. Not the merest hint. The explanation they give us is the stupid hyperspace tracking thing. (A spy isn't perfect either, presumably a spy could also do whatever they were doing to inform the First Order about their whole 'abandon ship' idea as well).

---

With more distance from the film, I see now why it is so divisive. The "big idea" of the film is, bluntly put, to subvert Star Wars. In ways both large and small. It subverts it's heroic narrative, it subverts the idea of it's villains, it subverts the idea of it's heroes.

And if you are on board with this, you may enjoy the film.

But if you object to this, you will probably end up hating it.

 

I think we should hold off on the very final verdict until we see the 9th movie. Obviously it should also stand on its own for the most part, but in the end these movies are a trilogy and should be viewed as such. When Empire came out it was divisive as well. There were people who didn't like the movie at all, and the whole 'bad guys win' thing didn't sit right with a lot of fans at first. It is only now, with the benefit of hindsight and knowing how the story continues/ends, that we almost unanimously see it as one of the highlights of the franchise. I'm not saying the TLJ doesn't have faults (it does), but who knows, perhaps after we've seen the final part we'll see them in a different light.

 

I mean, you're entitled to your opinion and all, but I cannot comprehend how a person could have this reaction given everything that went on in this movie. I was on the edge of my seat for most of it.

 

Because a good third of the movie was pointless and it was hard to care about half of the characters.

That’s really not a good thing.

 

Considering the events of the previous movie that apparently took place a week before its extremely unlikely that he's a spy.

 

Okay, now to be fair, while those bombers were abominations made of fail and worse than the Y Wing in every regard except carrying capacity, the bombs dropping that way could simply be the artificial gravity of the bomber giving them a push and momentum doing the rest of the work.

 

He had just been stripped of his rank for disobeying a direct order and getting a lot of people killed. Sacrificing a bunch of Resistance soldiers and their equipment to take out a ship makes sense when it’s a one-of-a-kind superweapon that’s about to destroy the planet. Taking out one Star Destroyer equivalent? Not so much.

Quite frankly, I just found it refreshing to see a character flaw actually being a flaw that causes the character problems, not just something that comes up when convenient and goes away when inconvenient.

This made me more interested in her. The Chosen One isn’t nearly as interesting as the One Who Chooses.