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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Discussion in 'Creative Writing' started by Mr Zoat, Jan 27, 2019.

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  1. david

    david Making the rounds.

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    First of all, chill.

    Secondly, if the choices are between a morally repugnant group that will elevate your race or... an arguably less morally repugnant group that wont treat your race all that well, the choice isn't set in stone. I'm not sure I'd sign up with the Tau, but working with the Imperium? I'm trying to avoid Godwins law here but we are talking about collaborating with genocidal fascists.
     
  2. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    That was an ork munition.
    Thank you, corrected.
     
  3. Travisplo

    Travisplo Dapper Necromonsieur, a fine undead gentleman

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    Hint. The "Yes" reply from the ring is a link.
     
  4. varoksa

    varoksa Getting sticky.

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    The thing is its not about the Human Race its about Zoat, joining the imperium would likely require brain flossing at a minimum while the Tau would give him premium membership with the gold trim.

    He straight up said he washes his hands of humanity so hes obviously looking out for number one here.
     
  5. transhumansage

    transhumansage Not too sore, are you?

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    yeah paul is not gonna let them take advantage. also please dial back on the white nationalist language. the imperium are bad guys. also the space wolves suck.
     
  6. Grimnar

    Grimnar Versed in the lewd.

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    At the expense of the Human race.

    Let's be generous and say that he limits his operations to Tau space itself. He clears out gene-stealer infestations, invades Ork strongholds and so on. He becomes a stabilising influence in the sector.

    The Tau will then take all the resources that has saved them, and pump it into the next Expansion, using those gains and internal security to strengthen their invasion forces as they conqueor human worlds. Then comes the sterilisations, the brainwashing, the forced relocation and Slavery in all but name.
     
  7. transhumansage

    transhumansage Not too sore, are you?

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    you are making a lot of assumptions. if i wanted a better future for humanity i wouldnt start with the zealots.
     
  8. Tavarokk

    Tavarokk Pursuer of perversion

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    One's view of the Imperium rather heavily depends on the media they've been (or haven't been) exposed to, I think. As someone who's most familiar with Cain's memoirs and Rogue Trader, I don't see the Imperium as that bad of a state in general (although the edge cases can be all kinds of horrifying). Even then, though, a case can be made for working with Tau because the Imperium is horrifically resistant to any kind of positive change, partly due to doctrine that emerged to resist any kind of change at all in response to the plethora of subversive threats, partly due to enormous social inertia. Meanwhile, it's just not possible to strike out on one's own and build something from scratch without significant risk of being arbitrarily crushed by an unstoppable threat (as MC notes), and 40k setting is woefully low on palatable interstellar powers that could shelter such an undertaking in its infancy.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2020
  9. Grimnar

    Grimnar Versed in the lewd.

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    He has no say in Tau internal affairs, and to think he would have any wieght worth anything is laughable.

    Fucking lol. If being against humans being taken over by aliens and forced into being second class citizens is White Nationalist language then (ironically) you can call me a white nationalist any day of the fucking week. It's that the conotations it carries, I'll wear it with pride.

    To who? They keep trillions of humans alive in a hostile galaxy. They arn't the best guys, but they are far from the bad guys.
    The Space wolves are unironically some of the best people in the entire setting. If you think they suck, with your wierd ass definitions, then they are clearly the tourch bearers of awesome.

    Then why would he be stating with the Tau? Fucking lol.
     
  10. DAT_NOOB

    DAT_NOOB Accused of writing in a far away land

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    I can't hear you over the sound of you heresy
    And They can't even fight in melee
     
  11. PDV

    PDV The Revelation That Uncertainty is Itself a Answer

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    The T'au are the closest thing to M2 humanity that exists in M41. It's not close. The Imperium shares genes, but the T'au share (Dawkinsian) memes, and we are far more a product of our memes than our genes at this point.
     
  12. WaleXdraK

    WaleXdraK Getting sticky.

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    Oh, i do love a good Wh40K insert and yeah humanity are kinda crazy but so is every single species in Wh40K in a way or another, the Tau aren’t exempt from this and can’t even fight in melee, Paul should be careful because if they see an ocassion were they can can kill him and take the ring, they will not hesitate.
     
  13. jaelin910

    jaelin910 habitual lurker

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    My issue here is that you seem to be pretending that that last bit doesn't include the imperium. The bit about black people in 20th century America is fair enough but you really need to mention that the alternative is Jews in 1940s Germany. That said, I do agree that one is clearly superior to the other I just find it a little disconcerting, disturbing or, dare I say, "disgusting" that you disagree on which it is.
    Still, you do you, I guess.
     
  14. Ct613hulu

    Ct613hulu Experienced.

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    I don't think that there is sufficient unbiased lore on the Tau for anyone to definitively say whether they are better or worse than the Imperium. The morality and wisdom of siding with them will all depend on Zoat.
     
  15. Vaermina

    Vaermina Versed in the lewd.

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    Paul no doubt misidentified the solar system because his ring used pulsar positioning.

    Remember, Golden Age Humanity moved the actual Sol system twenty thousand some light years away from it's normal position.
     
    zerofarad likes this.
  16. Darko

    Darko Versed in the lewd.

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    This version of Paul could be working for the Emperor.
    Zoat said something about him going to his throne room.
    This could mean that he is working on his behalf and trying to gain an alliance with the Tau seeing as they are practically the most reasonable species in this setting.
    The Emperor could have asked him to do this seeing as while he protects humanity, even he has to acknowledge that humanity is fucked up and practically useless right now.

    Zoat what is Steppenwolf the god of?
    The newest chapter of Life Ore Death said that he was the god of Predation and i was wondering what your version is the god of exactly?

    Can Old Gods travel through space by their own power in your fic, and please don't say the SI or renegade doesn't know?
    The newest issues of Lucifer have had the Wild Hunt and Odin travel to another galaxy to hunt the Hunted God, plus Mazekeen was able to track Lucifer down to another solar system and in Life Ore Death, one of the Titans was able to leave the Earth and go to the Vega system even though she was greatly weakened and Donna was sent to capture her, flying using god magic to go there.

    Zoat will there ever be any chapter about alternate versions of the SI that went into some anime universe, like Bleach?
    He could help Hallibel with creating a society for Hollows and maybe strike up a romance there, or with one of her Fraccion, or both her and the other three:D
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2020
  17. desolatedsabers

    desolatedsabers Getting sticky.

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    i'm just gonna point out. if i was seen as peanuts, and my choice was slavery or EXTERMINATUS on the rough chance that there might be a single daemon on my planet, you're damn fucking right i'd pick slavery. fuck being melted to dust. bunch of coked up cunts is what the inquisition is these days.

    EDIT: and calling him a race traitor is rich, considering that A. Chaos marines exist, and B. most "Factions" of the imperium, are more likely to spit all over each other, slaughter each other, and other "others" just on a whim, or because the voices in their head told them to, or just because they don't want to be accused of being a traitor. most of the legions are completely neurotic, the astartes are basically useless in the golden toilet bowl coffin, and then there's the inquisition. just. all of the inquisition.

    Calling paul a race traitor for doing the EXACT SAME THING that rogue traders do, is fuckin stupid.
     
  18. Vaermina

    Vaermina Versed in the lewd.

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    Yea... The Inquisition hasn't been like that for a good long while...

    Especially since Roboute Guilliman returned.
     
  19. Darko

    Darko Versed in the lewd.

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    Slavery, sterilization, brainwashing basically exist within the Imperium.
    So it's essentially just a choice between a lesser evil, which the Tau even in their worst tend to represent, and just being mistreated by another species instead of your own.
     
  20. Tavarokk

    Tavarokk Pursuer of perversion

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    The other side of this is that it's infinitely preferrable to be incinerated as opposed to actually running afoul of a daemon powerful enough to warrant an Exterminatus. And the trade-off between type I and type II errors is a merciless thing.
     
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  21. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    He did? He doesn't remember doing that.
    Pass.
    I suppose that's not a terrible answer.
    Probably. Though I should point out that humanoids can as well, by building spaceships.
    It's not impossible. Interspecies Reviewer for the NSFW thread?
    I haven't ever watched Bleach.
     
  22. Maxx Crowley

    Maxx Crowley I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    It's 40k. There are no good guys. The whole setting is designed to be as laughably fucked as possible.

    But on that note, argh....he's joining the facking Tau?!

    Oh OL, the heresy....it burns!
     
  23. Handlewithcare

    Handlewithcare I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    Daemons? I thought he meant like hidden weapons or something?
     
  24. Chojin Patriarch

    Chojin Patriarch Veteran Lurker, Rookie Proofreader

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    Oh, it's just something terrifying: Check the ring's response for a hidden link...
    Still, it could be worse. Said threat could be a chaos-tainted version of said threat. And such things existed in 1st edition (minus the Tau part) complete with demon-possessed leaders, And said possession could be anything from a Nurgling to a Bloodthirster...
     
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  25. ForeverShogo

    ForeverShogo Know what you're doing yet?

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    A little disappointed he's playing with the Tau. I mean, I can see how it makes sense, but it's so cliche and predictable.

    Though I feel the safety justification is a little off. Like, the only threat he listed that he might be safe from is the random psyker accidentally summoning a daemon. Pretty sure all the other threats could just as easily show up in Tau space as Imperium space. And even then maybe the daemon thing can still happen in Tau space. Don't they have some Human worlds in their empire?

    I think I'd at least try to work with the Imperium before making the jump to the Tau.

    Maybe the Tau have good waifus?





     
  26. frozenchicken

    frozenchicken Here to Read the Articles

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    Counterargument: There are no humans in 40k. There's a whole bunch of horrible alien races, one of which is a tyrannical empire set on creating a Fifth Chaos God of blind faith and xenophobia, that happens to share it's name with humanity. ;):p

    My actual point is, 40k is a grimderpy morass of competing canons that was created to make any combination of tabletop game battles seem like a plausible event. Nobody is a good guy, there are good reasons to oppose every single faction, and the nature of 40k means that if you're telling a story that tries to fix all the big issues in the universe you'll end up eventually having to defeat every single one of the factions including whichever one you've allied with, because each contains the seeds of its' own progression into a Big Bad of the story.
     
  27. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    The Tau have barely any warp presence and no psykers. Tau worlds are about as safe from cultists and random possessions as the 41st millennia gets. Worlds towards the centre of their empire also have large fleets.
    Eh... Sort of? They aren't anything like as human-looking as those pictures suggest, but they just miss being uncanny valley. Think that woman in the Playstation advert.
     
  28. SirKaid

    SirKaid Know what you're doing yet?

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    The Imperium of Man are literally genocidal fascists. The only time that it is morally acceptable to work for fascists is as part of the process of escaping from fascists. Given that he has a power ring he doesn't need to work for them to escape from them, making it morally indefensible to spend so much as a single second in the corpse emperor's service.

    So since the Imperium is utterly unacceptable, his options are either hiding somewhere (which would be kind of a waste, but Spider-Man can suck it, nobody has a moral obligation to help people) or picking another faction to work with. Well, technically I suppose he could learn how to turn construct Orks into construct rings and found his own faction, but that's a bit forward thinking considering the whole "no sleep, everything wants to kill me" thing.

    The Orks are fight happy loonies. The Eldar and Dark Eldar are genocidal smug racist loonies. The Necrons and Tyranids are genocidal. Chaos is even more utterly unacceptable than the fascists, which takes work.

    That leaves the Tau, who are caste based space communists and the only faction that isn't super duper mega evil all the time. Even in the later editions with the mind control stuff they're still leagues and leagues less evil than everyone else in the setting.
     
  29. Chaoswind

    Chaoswind Lord of nonsense

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    He is trying, but considering these Tau have genestealers among them he is probably reconsidering his options at the moment.

    Joining the space communist and using the low key emotional mind control to subvert their resources and set them in a cooperation mood is a fairly good idea, even more so when factions of the Eldar will inevitably contact him as well.
     
  30. Hidden Variable

    Hidden Variable Getting out there.

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    Joining the Tau is prolly not a good long term goal. I know they seem nice and fluffy but humans don't have much in the way (if any) when it comes to rights under the Tau, most being conscripted/'recruited' Gue'vesa and second class citizens. Better treatment is present on neutral worlds that don't care either way, but those are usually not part of the tau empire. In other ways the Tau are too nice and naive to stand any chance against other factions military-wise without a much greater tech advantage. The imperium is enormous, the tau empire has only survived thus far due to the imperium being busy with more important things than dealing with 'Those upstart xenos on the other end of the galaxy.' Depending on when this is set the Tau may not even believe that the warp or Daemons exist, as they don't use warp drives except in more recent media. Yes humans are generally happier under Tau rule, but believe it or not, the current model of the imperium is more about resource production and survival than happiness. Also 10,000 years of war fatigue.

    Would have been better off finding an unaffiliated human world or just dealing with the Mechanicus. Without the authority of the emperor any actual improvements to the imperium would take centuries if not millennia to make it through the labyrinthine bureaucratic nightmare of the current imperium so they are off the table if Paul wanted to make an impact within his lifespan, unless he got unrealistically lucky. Maybe working in the background with the harlequins or other such unaffiliated rogue agents that tend to be used to progress the plot of 40k.

    Zoat might be trying to show us that the ring can't detect whatever cloaking tech they use. The Tau are sorta already under emotional control because of the ethereals and whatever they use, pheremones or whatever. Dealing with the Eldar is usually a bad idea, as they are far less reasonable than would be in their best interests. They are intelligent, yes, but most of them are about as arrogant as you would expect hyper-intelligent space elves who once ruled the galaxy to be. That is, arrogant enough to ignore the stupid humans unless doing otherwise would result in eldar deaths.

    Edit: Nvm is the stealers.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2020
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